Regarding the Campaigns of Others

[LevonVeldspar]

I've always been fascinated observing how the world of M&B/PoP behaves, evolves and interacts with itself outside of the player's control. Its complex enough to be dynamic and interesting but not so complex as to be overwhelming (after a learning curve, of course, but that's what Native is for  .) Intuitive in many ways but just as often entirely inexplicable to normal human logic. I dig it. One of the main reasons I spend so much time on this forum is to read about other people's experiences playing by the same rules but having entirely different experiences, or sometimes very similar.


3.6 brought a lot of new factors into the mix in the form of Minor Faction sacking and Custom Knighthood Orders. I'm at day 140 of my 3.6 campaign and just starting to fight weaker Lords on even terms as a merc so I haven't had been able to get into the new CmKHO stuff personally. However, in my travels trading and escorting caravans, I have noticed a more numerous and potent Order presence on the map. More than once I've been saved from having to ditch heavy cargo to escape a fast enemy party by leap frogging from one Order patrol area of influence to another's. They seem to be everywhere making life hard for a bandit and I figure what's good for me must be good for peasants and caravans even when I'm not around. I wonder how big an impact this could be having on trade?


I've also witnessed an even stranger sight in my first few months in Pendor 3.6: Sarleon managed to come out of a non-stop series of sometimes simultaneous wars and actually GAINED significant territory in the process  . Largely at the Fierdsvain's expense, no less! In fact, Sarleon and Ravenstern have been fighting each other for Valonbray since week 1 and picking up a castle apiece on the side, and the Koningur's Horde are looking like chumps. I think its fair to say that on the whole, the Fierdymen were in a league of their own when it came to AI vs. AI warfare in 3.5, a constant steady conquest machine that could at best be merely delayed. That was my campaign, at least. Earl Ari Forkbeard managed to stay in the marshal's position literally for years of game time and was the most renowned man in Pendor for a long time before I overtook him at around 3800. He was worth 75k a pop when I finally managed to ransom him and he actually kept my fledgling kingdom afloat during those shaky early months . Have the orcs been giving a better showing in anyone else's campaign? Overall I've found the inter-kingdom conflict to be a lot of give and take with no clear juggernaut so far, despite Sarleon's early gains, and I like it.


Feel free to comment on my thoughts and even freer to post your own questions 

 

[Beorn424]

I'm actually on my second playthrough of 3.6 at the moment. In both Sarleon has done quite well for themselves. The first time I thought it was because I was a sarleon vassal, and that may have had something to do with it. But in this playthrough while I'm an Empire vassal they are still doing very well. Similar to your game it's at the expense of the Fierdsvain who now have just Javiskolohm and Windholm left. Sarleon took Valonbray after it was sacked and several of the nearby castles.
I've been staying out of most of the wars until I start my own kingdom, and at nearly day four hundred the borders really haven't changed that significantly other than what Sarleon has conquered.
The only losses Sarleon has suffered is when I took Laria and Valor Shield Castle for myself, and I led the empire to assualt Whitestag but it wasn't awarded to me. Taking Laria was just a matter of walking in as it had just been sacked by the Honor Noldor. They left it with a garrison of 80 or so tier three or lower troops.
I've also been able to "befriend" the Noldor and in the process get 650 or so honor. I've also been able to participate in their tournaments and in the most recent I won some lordly noldor enchanted armor (70/31). My knights are just about fully equipped so I will be starting my own kingdom before long.
I've been made marshal a few times now and that always seems to end with me having 3 more qualis gems and 500 prisoners in Larias garrison just waiting for a ransom broker to show up in the tavern. Funnily enough they never gain any territory while I'm marshal.
I've really enjoyed doing the new order quests. I will say that the order castle looks absoluting amazing. Also on the topic of orders, I  agree that there is a lot more order patrols than previously. I've even seen some silvermists patrolling eventhough they aren't established that I know of.

 

[Hatchet]

Day 1600 here. The Fierdsvain had it tough early on losing a few Castles, but held on to there three cities. At day 900 they declared war on the D'shar who were in a stalemate war with the fledgling King of Pendor, and picked up Nal Tar, Singal, and a couple of castles. They then Lol-stomped the Sarleon going from seige to seige with no breaks and taking everything bar Laria, Valorshield and Whitestag, and then split Ravenstern in half with the kingdom of Pendor taking the west, while we took the east. At the end game stage they have a little less than half the map, we have a little more, and sarleon have 1 town and 2 castles. They have 38 lords and can muster a combined army a little over 5000, while our 21 lords struggle to get over the 3000 mark for a marshal campaign (we don't seem to work together as well as they do at the moment). My current plan is to grab Stonehand and Redsword of them (one or 2 more capture and release should get them) before blitz seiging their holdings. I think their strength is in their strong honourable lords who stick with Valdis when things are tough, which gives them a resilience that other kingdoms cannot match. 

Next playthrough i might start my kingdom in their lands and knock them out early, and see how that goes.

Closing comment on a boring wall of half relevent text: I've had a few playthroughs which have seen the Fierd's take a hit early on, but most of the time they bounce back and eliminating them is still a planned stage rather than just a side effect of the game.

 

[LevonVeldspar]

I ended my 3.5 campaign around day 1700 with my Pendor kingdom holding all of the former Empire, plus the eastern half of old Sarleon lands and Ishkoman. Everything else was green. You're right about the Fierdslords sticking together and not scheming against one another. I witnessed what I thought was a cool phenomenon as the Fierdsvain Earl Ari Forkbeard kind of took over the Fierdsvain with Koningur Valdis as a sort of figurehead. Forkbeard became marshal very early in the game, and stayed there for years and years by delivering victory after victory after victory. He personally gained so much property (3 towns, 5 castles, 4 villages at its height) and renown (nearly 3800) that he became far more powerful than Valdis. 450 man armies, and 100 of them Berzerksers  . Since the Fierdsvain was almost constantly at war, and Forkbeard decided how the war would go, and since he managed to win almost every battle, he was essentially in charge of the faction. They eventually voted him out once I managed to get strong enough to beat their army in the field (probably the best large scale battle I've fought) and I felt sad seeing him go, but it had to happen eventually.


Have you been checking with your steward for conflicts within the realm? As I expanded I found the key to integrating new lords was taking a time out of peace every once in a while to resolve disputes. That gets them to more willing to work together and stick with the campaign army, which in turn leads to fighting battles and forming friendships and respect.

 

[minimumdifficulty]

In my 3.61 game, the Fierds are down to Windholm, Javiksholm, and a few castles...and it's only day 60 or so.  Then again, Sarleon, Ravenstern, and the D'Shar must have learned from their mistakes in past PoP versions, as they all declared on the Fierdsvain within a few weeks of my game starting.  Hilariously enough Rufio decided to get in on the act, besieging Javiksholm and leaving it with fewer than 100 defenders.  Don't think the green horde's long for the world.  Can't wait for my Sarleon merc contract to expire, look forward to signing up with the Fierds and trying to bring them back from the brink.

 

[Zim45]

I'm hitting around day 900 in my current And the Fierdsvain have been up and down. They took Nal Tar and a lot of the D'Shar's castles relatively early on and have held onto them. They had even made some incursions into Sarleon territory before being beaten back. Then they lost a war with Ravenstern and Javikshold with it. They were the first to declare war on me after I founded my nation. Even with most of their nobles in my dungeons and the others on a catch and release program they beat the D'Shar around, I think stealing their last castle. They eventually took Javiksholm back as well after making peace with the fledgling Kingdom of Pendor.

Now it's wierd, D'shar just got out of a losing war and declared on the Fiersdvain again. The Fierdsvain have had time to recover and have 4 towns and ample castles but they're losing bad to the D'Shar so far. Even despite their successes at past points I'm not sure they've ever been the biggest, unlike first Sarleon and then Ravenstern. Of course, if they turn things around against the D'Shar that could change.

 

[Zanze]

Funny you mention them sticking together Veldspar, I just started a new game to test out 3.61 and within a week they had kicked one of their Jarl's out. Forgot which one, but I still thought it was funny. I spawned in Javiksholm, he was gone before I made it to Ishkoman.

On the topic, have personally never seen the green horde go. Not even 3.5. Never actually seen 1 faction go nuts, but I have seen twice a Sarleon - D'shar Alliance of death basically. They both gang up on Fierds and eat everything, then spend the rest of the game fighting the Empire, taking lands at a very slow pace. (Sarleon usually loses a castle or 2 near Laria and spends the rest of the game trying to retake them when 2500-sized Aeldiran is not looking. So it's usually 1v1 D'shar vs Empire. Ravenstern is content to stay in the north usually...always...always...

 

[Zim45]

Ravenstern actually took Avendor, Marleons, and Javiksholm in my game, although that's the only game of PoP I've played that I recall themexpanding past a single town.

 

[bishopbutters]

actually for me its the Empire being super aggressive and taking lands like teen boys stealing panties. A few weeks into my game they had taken Ishkoman and Avendor. They lost Ishkomah right away before I joined as a vassal and then we retook it (I got it luckily). Shortly thereafter Poinsbruk was sacked by Wolfbode, then sacked again my a Mystmountain Army, then again by the Jatu rapidly. The Empire swooped in while Ravenstern was trying to capture Windholm and took the city. Poinsbruk has been sack 3 more times after that and Ravenstern has yet to take it back even with its 200 garrison

 

[Zim45]

Just came back to my first 3.6 game for a break and the D'Shar completely tore apart the Fierdsvain and destroyed them. I'm impressed but can't remember the details of how it happened...

 

[azxcvbnm321]

It seems that the tactical AI of Sarelon and D'Shar Marshalls have greatly improved along with kingdom unity.  I've noticed that they will now immediately siege another castle or town after capturing their first, sometimes this can continue for 3-4 straight castles/towns before they break off the campaign.  They are also less likely to break off sieges to fend off raids on villages.  This has made my game, where I try to maintain balance among all factions, difficult.  I've had to step in several times to cripple an attacker's army so that defenders can have time to reorganize and fight back.  Sometimes this leads to the other side taking 2-3 castles/towns in a row. 

 

[gadrael]

I have started new game lately, and after few months Firdsvain has only one city left. They got raped by Ravenstern, Dshar and Sarleon, and what is interesting thay are still in war with Ravenstern, since day 1. I have impression that comparing to 3.51 much more castles and cities are conquered in one campaign. In my previous game Ravenstern lost all cities in one campaign to Fierdsvain, after Sarleon joined war.

 

[LevonVeldspar]

I have impression that comparing to 3.51 much more castles and cities are conquered in one campaign. In my previous game Ravenstern lost all cities in one campaign to Fierdsvain, after Sarleon joined war.

I've noticed this as well. In 3.5 it was common for a campaign army to break up after its objective was taken only to reform a few days later. Now in 3.6 I'm noticing that they're much more likely to keep grabbing fiefs in quick succession if they seem like easy prey. I'm currently a merc for the Empire and we just grabbed 3 D'shar castles near Singal in less than week.

 

[LevonVeldspar]

Has anyone ever, in the history of all their PoP campaigns, captured a town by starving it out? Or even just a castle?

 

[habeo123]

I'm marshal of the Empire, with 4 towns, 2 villages and 1 castle and a fully equipped CMKHO. The Empire under my lead had already eliminated D'shar and Sarleons and now planning on taking down Fierdsvain. I hold feasts endlessly in time of peace and most of the Empire vassals are my friend with 70+ relationship. It is day 750 and in peace all over Pendor. Noldor is a nuisance with both Spawns having 1500+ troops. Snake Cult status is Crushed, Jatu is Fading. Now, I am just trying to muster my personal army to the point of 150 CMKHO Knights and I'm ready to siege 400+ garrisoned troops. I will give up my marshalship then and blitzkrieg the Fierdvain while the main armies fight.I hope with 7 Persuasion and 100 relation with Mario, I can get 1-2 towns more. Maybe even consider to start a rebel and get the Empire vassals on my side after taking down the Fierd.

 

[SilentK]

Has anyone ever, in the history of all their PoP campaigns, captured a town by starving it out? Or even just a castle?

I read somewhere some one actually took the time for it.

In the long run, its impossible, you basically need like 90% of the enemy lords captured and make sure they dont escape, if u have a lord army, forget it, no matter how good you are, they won't stick around for 30 days.


Its actually faster to basically lose 80% of your army (lords included) and take said settlement and let them recover their losses and you still do better than actually starve them out.



In practical reasons, its impossible, the enemy will have recovered their losses 10 times if they actually lose to you that many times while you siege.

 

[Nikodemus]

Has anyone ever, in the history of all their PoP campaigns, captured a town by starving it out? Or even just a castle?

I never managed to starve a town out, but I managed to make them surrender: I besieged a town with lost of Knight of the Ebony gauntlet, supported by a few ravenstern rangers... I could cause them heavy losses without taking much myself and after each assault, I asked their commander to surrender - and after taking significant losses, he actually gave in.

 

[SilentK]

Has anyone ever, in the history of all their PoP campaigns, captured a town by starving it out? Or even just a castle?

I never managed to starve a town out, but I managed to make them surrender: I besieged a town with lost of Knight of the Ebony gauntlet, supported by a few ravenstern rangers... I could cause them heavy losses without taking much myself and after each assault, I asked their commander to surrender - and after taking significant losses, he actually gave in.

Well if i go in for the kill, i just go in for the kill and be done with it, unless i know for sure that going melee will cause losses i don't want to suffer.

 

[LevonVeldspar]

How has minor faction sacking been affecting everybody's campaigns? When I first heard the feature was being added I immediately thought "oof... poor Empire," but they have yet to suffer a sacking at day 300 of my campaign despite 3 generic Snake Cult armies being present. My guess is that the sizeable contingent of Shadow Legion/Immortals in Cez/Janos are enough to keep them at bay, and Ethos is just too nice I guess. That may change when the Dread Legion finally chows up but until then, aside from the usual disruption caused by their spawns chasing peasants away, the minor factions haven't been a bigger threat to the Empire than they were before.

Ravenstern, on the other hand, has been getting **** on nonstop by the Mysts and Jatu. Rane has been sacked twice and Wolfebode's sacking of Poinsbruk cost them the city as Sarleon swooped in close behind for the capture. I've noticed that Ravenstern's particular geography makes it more susceptible to long-term economic disruption at the hands of the minors. In most of the rest of Pendor, armies and their patrols will chase peasants off their trade routes and delay their goods' arrival at market, but most of the time they're too slow to actually catch the poor villagers and they end up making it safely to their destination in the end. But up in long, narrow Ravenstern, many peasants end up running south toward the Great Lake or north into the mountains. In either case they end up coming to a hard barrier on the map and when they do, they tend to freeze in place for a time which often leads to their demise. Its a hard life up in the snow...

 

[Audustum]

With a sufficiently larger army than the enemy castle/town (i.e., after sacking/a fief that was recently captured but not garrisoned/a fief that you attacked repeatedly), you can make the castle commander surrender.

Generally you would be able to take them just with autocalc with minimal losses anyway though.