Recruiting system is very old, bad and not realistic, that cause unbalanced battles.

[achille83]

This is a new game but have the same recruiting system than warband, that is old, bad and not realistic.
This recruiting system is the first cause of unbalanced battles, because after a lost battle lords and player can have only recruits in their armies, that are only infantry without archers and cavalry, and they have very bad skills and equipment.
A better and more realistic system is to divide skills and equipment. Skills can increase from experience in battles, equipment from money.
Then need allow lords and player after recruiting the recruits from villages, to select the equipment that they want, so they can have infantry, archers and cavalry with the equipment that they want and can afford (more money = better equipment = better armies, like in real life).
Then after recruiting the player need a menù in party screen where he can select what kind of equipment want for their troops.
For example: for first the player select if want infantry, ranged or cavalry. For infantry can select 1H sword (with shield), 2H sword, polearm (with shield), next can select the equipment tipe light, medium, heavy that have different cost 10$, 100$, 1000$.
For ranged can select archer, crossbow or horse archer, next light, medium, heavy.
For cavalry can select light, medium and heavy.
After this selection the recruit become for example light infantry, medium archer, heavy cavalry, but they are tier 1 with low level skills.
When light infantry has more experience can become tier 2 light veteran infantry with better skills, with more experience tier 3 light soldier, tier 4 light champion soldier.
Player can upgrade equipment when he want, for example player have a t4 light infantry and can upgrade to t4 heavy infantry just pay the difference.

 

[avenger1024]

This is a new game but have the same recruiting system than warband, that is old, bad and not realistic.
This recruiting system is the first cause of unbalanced battles, because after a lost battle lords and player can have only recruits in their armies, that are only infantry without archers and cavalry, and they have very bad skills and equipment.
A better and more realistic system is to divide skills and equipment. Skills can increase from experience in battles, equipment from money.
Then need allow lords and player after recruiting the recruits from villages, to select the equipment that they want, so they can have infantry, archers and cavalry with the equipment that they want and can afford (more money = better equipment = better armies, like in real life).
Then after recruiting the player need a menù in party screen where he can select what kind of equipment want for their troops.
For example: for first the player select if want infantry, ranged or cavalry. For infantry can select 1H sword (with shield), 2H sword, polearm (with shield), next can select the equipment tipe light, medium, heavy that have different cost 10$, 100$, 1000$.
For ranged can select archer, crossbow or horse archer, next light, medium, heavy.
For cavalry can select light, medium and heavy.
After this selection the recruit become for example light infantry, medium archer, heavy cavalry, but they are tier 1 with low level skills.
When light infantry has more experience can become tier 2 light veteran infantry with better skills, with more experience tier 3 light soldier, tier 4 light champion soldier.
Player can upgrade equipment when he want, for example player have a t4 light infantry and can upgrade to t4 heavy infantry just pay the difference.

1. The recruiting system has been very evidently overhauled from Warband. You'd literally have to have never played one of the two games to not notice the major differences.

2. This sounds like a stupidly large amount of unnecessary micro. Let's also not forget that even if the player can be reasonably expected to handle such a micro, it would require entirely rewriting every bit of AI logic related to army management and then rebalancing the whole new system against the economic system that is itself still being worked on (as the two are very much connected).

 

[anton97]

This is a new game but have the same recruiting system than warband, that is old, bad and not realistic.
This recruiting system is the first cause of unbalanced battles, because after a lost battle lords and player can have only recruits in their armies, that are only infantry without archers and cavalry, and they have very bad skills and equipment.
A better and more realistic system is to divide skills and equipment. Skills can increase from experience in battles, equipment from money.
Then need allow lords and player after recruiting the recruits from villages, to select the equipment that they want, so they can have infantry, archers and cavalry with the equipment that they want and can afford (more money = better equipment = better armies, like in real life).
Then after recruiting the player need a menù in party screen where he can select what kind of equipment want for their troops.
For example: for first the player select if want infantry, ranged or cavalry. For infantry can select 1H sword (with shield), 2H sword, polearm (with shield), next can select the equipment tipe light, medium, heavy that have different cost 10$, 100$, 1000$.
For ranged can select archer, crossbow or horse archer, next light, medium, heavy.
For cavalry can select light, medium and heavy.
After this selection the recruit become for example light infantry, medium archer, heavy cavalry, but they are tier 1 with low level skills.
When light infantry has more experience can become tier 2 light veteran infantry with better skills, with more experience tier 3 light soldier, tier 4 light champion soldier.
Player can upgrade equipment when he want, for example player have a t4 light infantry and can upgrade to t4 heavy infantry just pay the difference.

Not sure what game you're playing, but it's not the same recruiting system from Warband. If you look at notables in towns and villages you'll see that they usually have better units greyed out. This means you have to raise your relations with them by doing quests for them. Some notables have more influence and will, in turn, have more powerful units to recruit.

 

[RavenMount]

I mostly agree with the notion in the reply of the second post, but this part made me extra chuckle.

Then need allow lords and player after recruiting the recruits from villages, to select the equipment that they want, so they can have infantry, archers and cavalry with the equipment that they want and can afford (more money = better equipment = better armies, like in real life).

Like in real life heh ?

You give a peasant the best bow on the planet and he'll most likely hurt himself while shooting an ally. There is a reason while levi tend to use spear/rock/sling as weapon is not just about the cost, beucase those tend the most chance of them actually hurting their enemies rather than themselves. Even wearing armor need to have the proper training and body coniditioning to be effective, otherwise you're just a steel tincan that enemies can poke at freely.

 

[wtid]

i totally agree it cause so unblanced fights

 

[xdj1nn]

best recruitment system I've seen in Warband was 1257ad's Lance System, but I wouldn't hope for TW to go for that approach because there are tons of people who love the recruiting from Warband (idk why, training troops through the methods present in Warband is kinda ridiculous). Here we have to waste time chasing down looters to get to okay tier, then farm harder fights but not Too hard, then we can use the army for something useful If you're unlucky, you'll lose those troops in a whim because of some weird RNG hahaha

Lance system is the way to go, but BL has been already developed around this flashier warband recruitment system.

 

[JohannTheFirst]

1. The recruiting system has been very evidently overhauled from Warband. You'd literally have to have never played one of the two games to not notice the major differences.

Right, major. You now click two buttons when visiting a village or town to recruit all.

Not sure what game you're playing, but it's not the same recruiting system from Warband. If you look at notables in towns and villages you'll see that they usually have better units greyed out. This means you have to raise your relations with them by doing quests for them. Some notables have more influence and will, in turn, have more powerful units to recruit.

Which works perfectly when any given notable has a 2% chance to have one of three different quests that may or may not be completely dependent on luck to increase relations with before you own the land to increase the relations by passively sitting around twiddling your thumbs.

Like in real life heh ?

You give a peasant the best bow on the planet and he'll most likely hurt himself while shooting an ally. There is a reason while levi tend to use spear/rock/sling as weapon is not just about the cost, beucase those tend the most chance of them actually hurting their enemies rather than themselves. Even wearing armor need to have the proper training and body coniditioning to be effective, otherwise you're just a steel tincan that enemies can poke at freely.

Yeah, haha, or like how someone who isn't a fully trained knight can't use a pitchfork anymore or get out of his armor and wear some rags.

Jokes aside, all three of you obviously intentionally misinterpreted what the original poster was saying based on some formulation issues, but he raises an extremely valid point that's been brought forth dozens of times by different people. Granted, this could have been in the feedback and suggestion forum, granted, he expressed it in a pretty vague fashion, but the system that's currently in the game for recruitment AND unit upgrades should seriously be looked at.

There are really only minor differences during the mid-late game between running around between villages in Warband and recruiting everything you can find to recuperate from battle losses and the way it's handled here. The way unit upgrades work (and for once, I'm not even talking about the UI aspect of it) is pretty hamfisted but it does its job, but there's no doubt that a system that completely separates experience from equipment would be more realistic (hey, how about adding friendly fire and if your villager can't shoot his bow he damages himself and his allies? Its not like the mechanics for this aren't possible in the context of the game!) and depending on how well it is integrated in the UI much more player friendly.

 

[pRaX]

I'd prefer AD 1257's or Silverstag's recruiting. With the latter offering alot deeper experience in combination with Kingdom management. Just not this old tack...

 

[achille83]

I mostly agree with the notion in the reply of the second post, but this part made me extra chuckle.



Like in real life heh ?

You give a peasant the best bow on the planet and he'll most likely hurt himself while shooting an ally. There is a reason while levi tend to use spear/rock/sling as weapon is not just about the cost, beucase those tend the most chance of them actually hurting their enemies rather than themselves. Even wearing armor need to have the proper training and body coniditioning to be effective, otherwise you're just a steel tincan that enemies can poke at freely.

Then you think that a peasant equipped with a pitchfork/rock and without an armor it's the same that a peasant with a good shield/sword and a good armor?
When i write like in real life, I mean the possibility to buy a better equipment for your soldiers if you have the money.

 

[vota dc]

It would be funny to see tier 1 with tier 5 equipment (for infantry is double, ranged weapons and mounts require skill) that chicken against tier 5 skill troops with tier 1 equipment.

 

[xdj1nn]

I'd prefer AD 1257's or Silverstag's recruiting. With the latter offering alot deeper experience in combination with Kingdom management. Just not this old tack...

most of the people discussing on this thread probably have never even played warband
But I feel you, Silverstag was a beast of a project, tried to help them at some point but I've never really had time to fully commit into any Warband mods I've helped throughout the years (nor the patience). I'm more of a "Game Designer", creative director guy, can't deal too well with coding or art. Actually I hate doing both. Well, there's a reason why I've left Game Development career years ago and moved onto Film-making. I'm over-sharing...

Anyway, yes, those systems worked far better, but with the direction BL took it's highly unlikely that they'll ever take them as examples or even references. I've always had a feeling that TW leans way more onto the popular badly designed mods than the masterpieces design wise that eventually died out because the engine wouldn't fully support what they were trying to achieve with said mods. So idk, it may be so that their own personal tastes are against better recruitment systems.

 

[achille83]

With bannerlord recruiting system is very hard to have a balanced party like 33% infantry, 33% archers and 33% cavalry, or whatever balance you want.

 

[JohannTheFirst]

most of the people discussing on this thread probably have never even played warband

What a weird, unnecessary and most likely incorrect flex. (At least if your definition of "most" is "more than 50%")

 

[xdj1nn]

What a weird, unnecessary and most likely incorrect flex. (At least if your definition of "most" is "more than 50%")

If I wasn't correct, you'd probably not even bother responding to it, would you?

 

[anton97]

Which works perfectly when any given notable has a 2% chance to have one of three different quests that may or may not be completely dependent on luck to increase relations with before you own the land to increase the relations by passively sitting around twiddling your thumbs.

Didn't defend it, just said it was different than the system in Warband, which it is.

 

[kreamy]

This is a new game but have the same recruiting system than warband, that is old, bad and not realistic.
This recruiting system is the first cause of unbalanced battles, because after a lost battle lords and player can have only recruits in their armies, that are only infantry without archers and cavalry, and they have very bad skills and equipment.
A better and more realistic system is to divide skills and equipment. Skills can increase from experience in battles, equipment from money.
Then need allow lords and player after recruiting the recruits from villages, to select the equipment that they want, so they can have infantry, archers and cavalry with the equipment that they want and can afford (more money = better equipment = better armies, like in real life).
Then after recruiting the player need a menù in party screen where he can select what kind of equipment want for their troops.
For example: for first the player select if want infantry, ranged or cavalry. For infantry can select 1H sword (with shield), 2H sword, polearm (with shield), next can select the equipment tipe light, medium, heavy that have different cost 10$, 100$, 1000$.
For ranged can select archer, crossbow or horse archer, next light, medium, heavy.
For cavalry can select light, medium and heavy.
After this selection the recruit become for example light infantry, medium archer, heavy cavalry, but they are tier 1 with low level skills.
When light infantry has more experience can become tier 2 light veteran infantry with better skills, with more experience tier 3 light soldier, tier 4 light champion soldier.
Player can upgrade equipment when he want, for example player have a t4 light infantry and can upgrade to t4 heavy infantry just pay the difference.

I think skills should be variable, I dont agree with the levelling system, and automatic +30,+X of any stat (its just dumb like you say IE bad/not realistic).

I recommend Kingdom modifiers, policies & faction goods (like equipment) in one of my posts, which address your concerns -> https://forums.taleworlds.com/index...my-infrastructure-recruiting-policies.420919/

Here, there are variable modifiers that apply to your troops (across the faction, that range from 1-8% based on kingdom policies and other factors such as Faction Goods (like a global 'supply' of armor, that is produced by new buildings, and that dont circulate in the market, which make troops have slightly better gear by proportion of supply available to the troops needing the supply across the faction). This makes a double tier effect,
1) modified skills for weapon proficiencies that vary and add realism to randomness
2) varying gear quality and amount that does the same

 

[xdj1nn]

Didn't defend it, just said it was different than the system in Warband, which it is.

not so much, it's more detailed, flashier, but works basically the same.
Quests for the village to get more recruits? check.
Improved relations get better recruits? check
Doing quests and helping the village through improving it gives better recruits? check
Has to constantly walk back and forth to actually get said recruits? check

The only negative is that if you are part of any kingdom, you'll barely ever have recruits in there because lords will constantly steal your recruits before you can even click on the village. Worse than that, mercenaries wipe out recruits all the time, then leave your kingdom to join your enemies, isn't that awesome?

 

[JohannTheFirst]

If I wasn't correct, you'd probably not even bother responding to it, would you?

... You're not one for deduction, are you? 9 people have commented in the thread up until your comment. You're one of them, and have evidently played and mastered Warband to such a degree that you're forced to show your elite status to the whole wide world in the forums.
vota dc has an account that's been active since 2010, which would kind of imply that he has had some prior interest in Taleworlds before Bannerlord was released.
Anton97, since 2017, same thing, owns the game, registered.
pRax 2012.
Avenger made a comment comparing the two, making it likely that he's played it. Same goes for the thread creator.
Lastly, I've been around here since roundabout 2005-2008, and have, indeed, played Warband.
Now, I have no idea about wtid or Ravenmount since they haven't written any references to Warband here, but that makes 7/9 people having played Warband previously. I wouldn't put it past them to have played it either, because spoiler: Having played Warband is not some arcane ritual only the chosen few have been privy to.

Again, just a super weird thing to say in the first place. But you do you.

Didn't defend it, just said it was different than the system in Warband, which it is.

Fair enough.

 

[Pejot]

The only negative is that if you are part of any kingdom, you'll barely ever have recruits in there because lords will constantly steal your recruits before you can even click on the village. Worse than that, mercenaries wipe out recruits all the time, then leave your kingdom to join your enemies, isn't that awesome?

This part depends highly on Your fiefs location and current ongoing wars. For example in Pen Cannoc villages I have almost always full stacks of best possible recruits cause no one is going through that way to frontlines. Lords that have fiefs nearby recruit only from their own.

What I really don't like in recruitment system and this is since first M&B is that all units are regionally.
From my perspective all recruits should be the same and upgrading them should be to whatever You like if You have certain trait, skill, companion or whatever. I don't like the part when You start a game as some nobody and You know all the ways to train troops from all different factions. This knowledge is something You should have to gain before You can use it. And from all recruits You should be able to make whatever You want as long as You know how. Only noble units should be regionally connected. And for start You should have access only to mercenaries and bandits troop trees.

 

[achille83]

Another more simple system is that to put in villages 3 npc that have 3 types of troops, infantry recruits, ranged recruits and cavalry recruits with some t2 and t3 units, purchasable for money not relations.