Recruiting mercenary clan while have no money exploit

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So if we implement something like this player will be able to talk everybody via messenger not only mercenary leaders. Does this damage any gameplay mechanic or make some issues easier / meaningless? I am far to issues I do not know rules of all issues we have at game. I do not work on these parts also while watching streams I skip these parts usually to not lose focus so need to know this.
If we want to keep it to just mercenaries then I suggest something like this (mercenary tab on the kingdom menu)

Potential issues with allowing messenger:
  • 1st main quest could be complete without running around the map to meet people (which is likely the intention of it)
  • Would make starting defection dialogs a lot easier (wouldn't have to chase them around the map)
  • Would make asking for peace in person much easier
Can't really think of others considering dialog with lords is pointless right now besides what I said above (can't suggest them to do anything). But if these issues are a problem they could just be limited to in person meetings (please no).
 
I think it would be easier, however the drawback would be that the charm of the companion would affect the success chance, and most players will have a much higher charm than a companion, that would be the trade off so it isn't just an easy thing to do, you will succeed less because of lower charm.

Charm is not effective in most dialogs. Here real problem we focused is "does making communication easier with this feature create new problems". We should not focus on charm.
 
I only see this as being used as a quality of life improvement, without exploits.

There is only one quest that I am aware of that you actually need to run around and talk to people, which is the first quest of the Dragon Banner, talking to 10 notables who were present at the battle. It seems like players generally hate this quest, so providing an alternate method to speak with these individuals would be nice, as it is basically an MMO fetch quest.

Maybe place a limit on how many messengers you can have out at once = to clan level?

I cannot think of any other quests involved where you need to run and speak to someone.

Edit: you all type much faster.
 
So if we implement something like this player will be able to talk everybody via messenger (with delay) not only mercenary leaders. Does this damage any gameplay mechanic or make some issues easier / meaningless? I am far to issues, I do not know rules of all issues we have at game. I do not work on these parts also while watching streams I skip these parts usually to not lose focus so need to know this.
Messengers mod offers practically what you are talking about. And Diplomacy Fixes does it via encyclopaedia as well.

Oh, I would love to have a look at those suggestion lists. :fruity:
 
Suggestion meetings done once a month and I do not want to go there with more than 3 suggestions otherwise reject ratio increases and thinking time per suggestion by decision takers reduce. There were about 30 suggestions collected total from different platforms and internal. Here are ones I suggested at last one and 1 is rejected, 2 is partly approved (traps & fast recovery are rejected), 3 was also rejected but we (especially thanks to @Duh_TaleWorlds) insisted so i will try to do it with any side effect then it can be accepted too. If we can clear out all details about what we want from this feature (Which menu will players use to contact with mercenary leaders? What player will be able to do (hire / fire)?) I can add next meeting.

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Great work Mexxico. Always loving your transparency. It is great to see 2nd idea is partly improved.
 
Thank you for all feedbacks. Yes having a limitation per messenger or if this messenger spends a reasonable time to reach that person (like 1-2-3 days according to distance) and again spends a reasonable time to come back after dialog (additional 1-2-3 days according to distance) this can reduce exploits.

However dialogs are mostly designed like player is talking with them or there is an active party encounter (means our party and other hero's party is encountered at that moment) this can create new problems maybe need to think. Also at some dialogs where only opened if opposite leader is at settlement probably assume we are at settlement too. Otherwise we cannot speak with them. So these type of dialogs can create problem too because when they opened we will not be at that settlement and assumptions will be false.

If side effects are solved this can be a good quality of life improvement imo but maybe they can say this feature does not suit well to our sandbox world or our game is not that kind of game you should open dialog with npcs from distance, I cannot know this :smile:
 
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Thank you for all feedbacks. Yes having a limitation per messenger or if this messenger spends a reasonable time to reach that person (like 1-2-3 days according to distance) and again spends a reasonable time to come back after dialog (additional 1-2-3 days according to distance) this can reduce exploits.

However dialogs are mostly designed like player is talking with them or there is an active party encounter (means our party and other hero's party is encountered at that moment) this can create new problems maybe need to think. Also at some dialogs where only opened if opposite leader is at settlement probably assume we are at settlement too. Otherwise we cannot speak with them. So these type of dialogs can create problem too because when they opened we will not be at that settlement and assumptions will be false.

If side effects are solved this can be a good quality of life improvement imo but maybe they can say this feature does not suit well to our sandbox world or our game is not that kind of game you should open dialog with npcs from distance, I cannot know this :smile:
Great points, this could be an issue with marriage for sure (should be there in person). Definitely would need to limited dialog choices for a messenger, maybe keep it to those basic dialog options. Maybe for lords that you would normally have to pay a fee to get into the keep it just asks if you are willing to pay once the messenger gets there?

Sadly we know by now that the decision is not in your hands, don't worry wont get hopes up too far :lol:
 
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Actually now I am examining codes which causes mercenary clans to leave their actual kingdom and I see it is happening pretty common. Probably fixing this is a must and first thing need to be done about these problems. Then I can move messenger idea to suggestion meeting if we can find solutions to side effects.

By the way I also follow these boards and I really liked this idea they throw about suggestion 2 in meeting screenshot. These are the dialogs Bannerlord really need, I can suggest it as "if caught npc says ok (if he is weak he will say "ok, you will not see me around here for a time") to this offer and if we release that npc there can be 20 days of raid cooldown for only that lord" so he will not come again raiding one of your villages (maybe if he is dishonorable he doesn't keep promise and can come again but it can be hard to tell player why he did not keep promise) :

bt4e7.png
 
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Actually now I am examining codes which causes mercenary clans to leave their actual kingdom and I see it is happening pretty common. Probably fixing this is a must and first thing need to be done about these problems. Then I can move messenger idea to suggestion meeting if we can find solutions to side effects.
Yep sounds about right, i know it would piss the player off to hire a mercenary just to have them leave relatively soon. Maybe we can put a season (21 days) long limit for mercenaries to remain in service unless released (peace/too expensive to keep). After that season maybe the mercenaries then look around at option and if current kingdom is still best renegotiate the price to keep them or else lose them.

By the way I also follow these boards and I really liked this idea they throw about suggestion 2 in meeting screenshot. These are the dialogs Bannerlord really need, I can suggest it as "if caught npc says ok (if he is weak he will say "ok, you will not see me around here for a time") to this offer and if we release that npc there can be 20 days of raid cooldown for only that lord" so he will not come again raiding one of your villages (maybe if he is dishonorable he doesn't keep promise and can come again but it can be hard to tell player why he did not keep promise) :

bt4e7.png

That is a great suggestion and it somewhat mirrors the player paying to be unharmed. Would be great. :lol: been many years since i've been to 4chan
 
Actually now I am examining codes which causes mercenary clans to leave their actual kingdom and I see it is happening pretty common. Probably fixing this is a must and first thing need to be done about these problems. Then I can move messenger idea to suggestion meeting if we can find solutions to side effects.

By the way I also follow these boards and I really liked this idea they throw about suggestion 2 in meeting screenshot. These are the dialogs Bannerlord really need, I can suggest it as "if caught npc says ok (if he is weak he will say "ok, you will not see me around here for a time") to this offer and if we release that npc there can be 20 days of raid cooldown for only that lord" so he will not come again raiding one of your villages (maybe if he is dishonorable he doesn't keep promise and can come again but it can be hard to tell player why he did not keep promise) :

bt4e7.png
Omg I had a real chuckle at that suggestion and it perfectly sums up the problem with interactions with lords. ?
 
If side effects are solved this can be a good quality of life improvement imo but maybe they can say this feature does not suit well to our sandbox world or our game is not that kind of game you should open dialog with npcs from distance, I cannot know this :smile:
Yes, the mods that created this feature are practically used as a way to cheat the game's first person mechanic.

However, one of the mods used "pigeons" as a carrier, and made it an offline message feature. Thus, with a new dialog option the player chooses a message (or statement or question) to be sent, sends a pigeon, the bird takes some time to reach the target, and then a yes/no or accept/denied message gets back via the bird after a few days. This was the solution that I liked the most and this was the solution that seemed to be the least exploitive and required the lest modification in the game.
 
Thank you! To be honest the timeline feature is not realy a must have for the game, while also a perfect candidate for a mod. :smile:
Yes, it is just a quality of life improvement. Not a must. However it could be good seeing that kind of chart at game because it gives good info about how kingdoms are doing, that kind of feedbacks usually improves gameplay. But I am ok with reject here not big deal. At least we will show how many days passed since war is started at wars page for each war - it was another suggestion and approved which I also want to see. Its minor but good to know these small infos. Also we should be able to see how many towns / castles / noble clans / mercenary clans / kingdom budget kingdoms has at war - peace pages.
 
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Also we should be able to see how many towns / castles / noble clans / mercenary clans / kingdom budget kingdoms has at war - peace pages.
Those would be great additions, glad to hear we are getting some more info about our wars (just talking about the days for now, hopefully we get those you mentioned as well).
 
We have one more problem related to mercenary factions. Today I was running a long term test to see how kingdoms are going by time and see that all kingdoms start to have less and less minor factions over time. Finally after 35th year of game (1120s) all kingdoms have 0 mercenary factions and this situation did not changed for remaining of game.

Reason of this is slowly all heroes die at these minor factions and because they do not marry or have children their existance at game ends after a time. Of course this is not a major problem because it effects only 10% of players who plays game 30+ years but still a problem if we want to keep game world with all game elements for long years. Probably we need to add new heroes to minor factions over time somehow.
 
We have one more problem related to mercenary factions. Today I was running a long term test to see how kingdoms are going by time and see that all kingdoms start to have less and less minor factions over time. Finally after 35th year of game (1120s) all kingdoms have 0 mercenary factions and this situation did not changed for remaining of game.

Reason of this is slowly all heroes die at these minor factions and because they do not marry or have children their existance at game ends after a time. Of course this is not a major problem because it effects only 10% of players who plays game 30+ years but still a problem if we want to keep game world with all game elements for long years. Probably we need to add new heroes to minor factions over time somehow.

Perhaps not he best solution but they could either:

a) Create a new one as soon after one dies, sm there is always a set number of them running around
b) After some years pass (5 for example) the game checks the number of members in each mercenary clan. If number is below a certain threshold, it creates a new one.
c) Take a certain amount from their treasury to create a new one. This way the player can create a breath time before they come back. The only issue would be the player deliberately executing them all, so there would be no parties to pay for the new members.
 
Perhaps not he best solution but they could either:

a) Create a new one as soon after one dies, sm there is always a set number of them running around
b) After some years pass (5 for example) the game checks the number of members in each mercenary clan. If number is below a certain threshold, it creates a new one.
c) Take a certain amount from their treasury to create a new one. This way the player can create a breath time before they come back. The only issue would be the player deliberately executing them all, so there would be no parties to pay for the new members.
it was suggested on the snowballing thread that failed rebellion clans should become mercenaries.
maybe the mercenaries should become more faction like and accept new clans into them.

or taleworlds should make relations personal for each lord and the failed rebellion lords should join the mercenary clans.

or they should just join the mercenary clans since they don't get a name for their clan unless the rebellion is successful.

this would have the downside that mercenaries might have huge amount of lords and they'll become OP because no matter how much you imprison of them, there'll always be more.
 
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