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1.8.0
Warband had a 1.66 wage multiplier for mounted units. What governs recruit and upgrade costs in BL?
Unit tier (or level - which determines tier anyway), horse units also have higher hire price which is probalby determined by some modifier.
I wish we could make an increased consumption of grain and flax for horse troops and free horses in the inventory. Common horses only consume grain and flax, when travelling on snowy/desert terrain. Warhorses consume only grain and flax all the time. Steppe horses have decreased food consumptions etc. Malnourished horses should have decreased stats and can even die of starvation.
But I guess theses things are too complicated even for TaleWorlds. LOL
They are definetelly too complicated for current strategic AI, armies are starving all the time ATM even without increasing food consumption for cavalry.
 
Why do melee cav have such a hard time hitting anything? Is it because they are specifically nerfed on purpose or is it because the AI is just not good at calculating where they need to strike once their moving at high speed?
Ask TW about it, they change stuff under the hood every patch.
 
So started a new game with RBM. Last time I played was 1.6.0 so my memory can fail me. When doing horse archery, you have to aim slightly backward of a stationary target so you can hit it bc the arrow you are about to loose from the bow have the velocity same as you. This was in Warband but it was not in Bannerlord right? Now in 1.7.2 I have to aim backward of a stationary target, this change is vanilla or RBM did. If RBM did this change, thank you Philozoraptor.

I mean I am somewhat certain that when doing horse archery in Bannerlord, I was aiming like I was not moving but I can not be sure.

Mod thing. We recently even added release angle (the arrow goes slighlty up over where you aim).
 
1)Everybody can parry everything:
Even a measly rank 1 recruit fights like a Jedi Master... this is not believable and there should be a bare minimum for combat skill so I propose units below rank 5 can only attack or parry at once but not both at the same time, it is, only units with high level of weapon mastery can parry in the middle of their attack and not all the time.
Its unfortunatelly more complicated than that, if parry / block is too low, you end in situation when you can win majority of battles by spamming attack. Also parry chance is not exactly parry chance, its more of a reaction time - so if you attack fast low tier oponent might not be able to react at all, while if you attack slow it might seem like he can parry pretty much every attack. We went with the logic of same tier oponents being able to block parry majority of thier attacks 1 v 1, this is then complemented by the posture system, which when depleted makes you (or your enemy) vulnurable to attack even if they parry.
2)First clash between infantry formations:
When 2 infantry formations fight the starter clash lasts the blink of an eye or is simply non existant, in other words some times there is not even contact... this is not realistic or believable, in reality 2 fresh and confident lines of soldiers with high morale will fight front to front with their enemy at least 10 or 20 seconds before they decide to break their formation to retreat or push.
Do you mean that they engage slowly or that they disengage after charge, if it is disengage it might be either result of reinforcements coming due to losses from projectiles or it might be skirmisher formation that prefers to fight fromm range.
 
Momentary i play also with that mod if no collision with other mods. Clear it is not perfect but it is more challenging like vanilla. Realism is surely something different, but that depends also surely on the entire bannerlord system. But it is a great mod because it makes combat more challenging. Factly in vanilla if your controllers are all ok you nearly cannot lose any fight (only per purpose)... also lowskilled chars. So the mod is more than only ok.
Sure as i first played it and i seen a heavy highskilled cavalryman charging with lance against a slightly in cloth covered small knife wielding peasant and that poor peasant blocks the lance blow with a small hand gesture in hip-height... a small grin i could not prevent. But like the fellow above wrotes in other words, modding is a hobby and we the non-modders should be happy such folks exist... and really most make the game more interesting, even better. The bad ones soon disappearing :wink:
Posture damage caused by high speed attacks (lances etc) is gonna be buffed in next patch.
 
This is by far one of my favorite mods, thank you for all your hard work. I have one small request that would be epic if it could be implemented.

NPC characters for Ai faction leaders - These would be elite champions of the faction leaders that is part of their party template and spawn in their army. Think about characters like the Hound or Mountain from Game of Thrones. These would not just be a royal guard, but a very elite warrior or two that raise hell on the battlefield with very high skills and equipment. It just seems so unrealistic that only the players army is filled with hero's. Thank you for hearing me out and this could be fun trying to create champions for the Ai for each culture, some real monsters could be created in the process. Thank you for hearing me out!
This is more of a request for some campaign mod. We are trying to stay away from campaign changes that would mess with save file somehow because it would make the mod impossible to remove mid game.
 
Art arda ileti
@Philozoraptor I notice some strange AI behavior in RBM AI module for 1.8.0 beta. It looks like AI don't know about melee weapon range they use. I made 2 videos with troops using longest pike in the game, one on v1.7.2 and another on v1.8.0. Both videos use mods RBM AI + Spear Rework + My Little Warband (for custom troops) and same units.

1.7.2 my pikemen attack enemies when they are in range, you can hear many "pierce dmg sfx", they perform great, keeping enemies at distance:

1.8.0 my pikemen are autistic, brainless and blind, attack only at point blank, only "blunt dmg sfx", not using their weapon range, stand and die:

I also notice that AI likes face hugging in 1.8.0 even with long weapons. For example - vlandian tournament, billhooks 1v1, AI hugs me and smack with a stick instead of using blade dealing low dmg. I can imagine how painful would be strugian 1v1 with shields and spears even with Spear Rework.
Welcome to 1.8.0, TW changed some core AI behaviour under the hood, they did similiar thing multiple times in the past.
 
I agree with pretty much everything, problem is mainly technical. Majority of nuance of cavalry charge is simply not doable, hack we cannot even tell them to attack specific formation effectivelly or to tell them all to couch their lances.

Morale based gameplay would probably be somehow doable, however I believe that low numbers of troops present during battles in BL would make it very unpleasant to play for majority of players (including me), AKA one rear charge just broke my army, PLZ FIX, I just want to fight some battles not play morale simulator, etc, etc.

What I meant by cav being underpowered is that generally they had better KD ratio than in game (to big degree due to aforemetioned factors but still). In game 1.5-2 foot infantry equals one cav of same tier (banner knights and elite cataphracts are tier 6, please keep that in mind). I am almost certain that generally two light infantrymen were not equal 1 light cav in the past, otherwise noone would bother with cav (one horse alone eats like 10 times as much calories as human, and war horses ate grain not grass, not to mention that knights / horse archers often had multiple horses, there were 3 supporting personnel per knight etc).

Then there is problem of spam, player can mass 250 maybe even 500 cavalry and he will face army of similiar size on the field no matter how big the actual army is due to limitations of game so player can abuse critical mass. But this is more about self control, if someone wants to exploit single player game he will (cough blacksmithing cough), there is nothing keeping players from taking all recruits (which results in more organic armies) and participating in huge 2K vs 2K battles which will whittle down even elite cavalry in his army very fast.

Something tells me that whiners intentinally min max their armies (aka tier 4-6 cavalry) and then keep fighting relatively weak enemy tier 1-6 mixed armies which are probably much weaker even in auto resolve / power score. I have possible solution that would increase player cavalry cost significantly, but I need to test it first.
So I think the best fix for this is to alter recruitment. Because what I see as the problem is not so much the power of the Cav forces but rather that there is just too much of them. AI Armies are running about with 1/3 Cav when in reality they would be about 1/10th Cav, or for some like Byzantines and Mongols they were just smaller overall with larger proportions of Cav. This was due mostly to the aforementioned logistics issues. Too much cav in armies is what causes them to dominate because they just do the AI equivalent of f1/f3 and they really just can't be stopped.

So I think maybe making a separate module that alters both availability of Noble troops and the AI decisions to recruit CAV would be the way to fix it.
 
So I think the best fix for this is to alter recruitment. Because what I see as the problem is not so much the power of the Cav forces but rather that there is just too much of them. AI Armies are running about with 1/3 Cav when in reality they would be about 1/10th Cav, or for some like Byzantines and Mongols they were just smaller overall with larger proportions of Cav. This was due mostly to the aforementioned logistics issues. Too much cav in armies is what causes them to dominate because they just do the AI equivalent of f1/f3 and they really just can't be stopped.

So I think maybe making a separate module that alters both availability of Noble troops and the AI decisions to recruit CAV would be the way to fix it.
Volunteer uptier already put noble recruits to 20% of all recruits, which is probalby a nerf since right now lots of caslte recruits are noble in vanilla.
 
I have spent the last few weeks going through and cleaning up gear just for personal use, but it turned out pretty amazing imo and wanted to offer it to the team for review encase you might be interested. I have been modding for years mostly mod for personal use, but keep with your amazing theme just removed things that clipped and brought some unique looks to some units. Unit creation has been a specialty of mine and I was the creator of the Shieldwall mod for Throne of Britannia.

Just curious why are pugios are 10k each? they are pretty critical to smithing, however in the mod smithing is pretty impossible in 1.8 to get anywhere.

There are a few dead mods that add war horn sounds on commands like charge, move to position, etc. It would be nice to see something like that integrated to RBM as it would be save game compatible and add greatly to immersion.

Anyways really a great mod, thank you so much for your hard work and such a great mod!
 
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  • Arena Module released:
  1. Enemies in arena will be on your tier level. Player tier is calculated from player level and gear, whichever of these two values is higher will be chosen.
  2. Rewards are 1 tier higher than tier of the tournament, so player should be able to upgrade by fighting in arenas.
  3. Renown reward for fighting in arena is increased as well (higher tier = more renown).
  4. Melee weapons and shields will be randomized and of appropriate tier and culture. Bows and arrows will scale with arena tier aswell.
  5. Since tournament is fair now it is good way to train and learn how to fight with Combat and AI module. Combat module also enables normal XP gain in arenas.
Also significant update to AI module:
Improvements to defender postions on some maps. So far: Ab Comer castle, Veron castle, Zeonica and Vostrum. More to come in future patches. Available only in version for BL 1.8.0 and further.
 
Here is a few weeks of tweaking gear based on the foundation your team built, if you like it I donate my work to the team. I built it for personal use, but turned out pretty sick imo so I decided to share it with the RBM team.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/9qy9hoh2hibpmke/unit_overhaul.rar?dl=0

I brushed up all factions, here is what I did

-added new armors/gear that is not in use
-added in more variation to give factions more of a distinct look
-keep balance roughly the same as far as adding new gear to variations
-tested all entries and cleaned up any loose or broken/typos
-fixed slot placement
-changed a few names of units
-based the Battania culture more off Welsh/Romano British rather than Gaul, just seemed out of place and many Battanians served in the legion.

Here is a few screenshots to show case some of the code additions:

1thQD2a.jpg

N029rgx.jpg

cGHG7Ju.jpg

GwGCNBj.jpg

YxeCWQs.jpg

7x8OeN7.jpg

xs9xvwQ.jpg
 
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Here is a few weeks of tweaking gear based on the foundation your team built, if you like it I donate my work to the team. I built it for personal use, but turned out pretty sick imo so I decided to share it with the RBM team.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/9qy9hoh2hibpmke/unit_overhaul.rar?dl=0

I brushed up all factions, here is what I did

-added new armors/gear that is not in use
-added in more variation to give factions more of a distinct look
-keep balance roughly the same as far as adding new gear to variations
-tested all entries and cleaned up any loose or broken/typos
-fixed slot placement
-changed a few names of units
-based the Battania culture more off Welsh/Romano British rather than Gaul, just seemed out of place and many Battanians served in the legion.

Here is a few screenshots to show case some of the code additions:

1thQD2a.jpg

N029rgx.jpg

cGHG7Ju.jpg

GwGCNBj.jpg

YxeCWQs.jpg

7x8OeN7.jpg

xs9xvwQ.jpg
Sorry but we wont go for inconsistent gear even though its more realistic, players need to be able to tell units quickly and incosistence in armor is hell to balance.
 
Sorry but we wont go for inconsistent gear even though its more realistic, players need to be able to tell units quickly and incosistence in armor is hell to balance.
players don't "NEED" to tell units quickly, that's just how you feel the game feels better, design choice, not a "necessity" choice xD
I'd advise to experiment with it on your own, you might change your mind
 
players don't "NEED" to tell units quickly, that's just how you feel the game feels better, design choice, not a "necessity" choice xD
I'd advise to experiment with it on your own, you might change your mind
I have done more experimenting than is healthy. I am consistence kind of guy, so we are going for consistency.

At least in first person / third person action RPG with limited combat system (3 swing directions + 1-2 thrusts) and elements of RTS. In pure RTS with thousands of units inconsistent armor would be fine because unit size + statistic would deal with it. If combat system would be more robust / duel simulator with fine hitboxes (armpits, face, etc), again it would open up some interesting strategy. But given state of combat in BL, inconsistent gear just means random death, majority of players want to get tier 5 unit when they upgrade to tier 5 unit, they dont want to get tier 3 unit instead due to RNG, and yes its my opinion, but I have dealt with enough of feedback by this point (see post section on our Nexus page) to have a rough idea of what is digestable to players and what is not.

As cherry in top in the beginning of RBM lot of units were inconsistent and they were underperforming or overperforming in battle for exactly this reason. Adding additional variable on top of whether unit has slight highground or low ground or whether its more static defender or attacker more aggresive attacker is simply not feasible from balancing perspective.

If you want this kind of balance just make a new overhaul and publish it. Then you will find out that you will have to spend hundreds of hours to balance it in order to be any good. Or you can ignore balancing it and people will just endlessly ***** about it being unbalanced and X being OP and Y being UP etc.
 
I have done more experimenting than is healthy. I am consistence kind of guy, so we are going for consistency.

At least in first person / third person action RPG with limited combat system (3 swing directions + 1-2 thrusts) and elements of RTS. In pure RTS with thousands of units inconsistent armor would be fine because unit size + statistic would deal with it. If combat system would be more robust / duel simulator with fine hitboxes (armpits, face, etc), again it would open up some interesting strategy. But given state of combat in BL, inconsistent gear just means random death, majority of players want to get tier 5 unit when they upgrade to tier 5 unit, they dont want to get tier 3 unit instead due to RNG, and yes its my opinion, but I have dealt with enough of feedback by this point (see post section on our Nexus page) to have a rough idea of what is digestable to players and what is not.

As cherry in top in the beginning of RBM lot of units were inconsistent and they were underperforming or overperforming in battle for exactly this reason. Adding additional variable on top of whether unit has slight highground or low ground or whether its more static defender or attacker more aggresive attacker is simply not feasible from balancing perspective.

If you want this kind of balance just make a new overhaul and publish it. Then you will find out that you will have to spend hundreds of hours to balance it in order to be any good. Or you can ignore balancing it and people will just endlessly ***** about it being unbalanced and X being OP and Y being UP etc.
easy there mate, just suggested that you can add varying degrees of gear into a item pool, not that they need to be arbitrarily outclassed.
supposedly, if you add a conditional to the pool and score the gear, you could easily slap in inconsistent load-outs that are always balanced in the meta department.
IE:
Pool has Helmet, Chest, Weapon
Helmets score from 3 to 6 (always better than armor for any time period, preferred equipment)
Armors score from 1 to 3
Weapon scores from 1 to 5

target score for Tier = 10
helmet 3
armor 3
weapon 4

h 6
a 1
w 3

h 4
a 2
w 2

h 6
a 3
w 1

h 5
a 3
w 2

so on so forth...
Totally doable as long as you create a score table that's decent, although it's A LOT OF WORK. So by all means, I don't demand / expect or judge you for not doing it, I just said that it is doable.
 
easy there mate, just suggested that you can add varying degrees of gear into a item pool, not that they need to be arbitrarily outclassed.
supposedly, if you add a conditional to the pool and score the gear, you could easily slap in inconsistent load-outs that are always balanced in the meta department.
IE:
Pool has Helmet, Chest, Weapon
Helmets score from 3 to 6 (always better than armor for any time period, preferred equipment)
Armors score from 1 to 3
Weapon scores from 1 to 5

target score for Tier = 10
helmet 3
armor 3
weapon 4

h 6
a 1
w 3

h 4
a 2
w 2

h 6
a 3
w 1

h 5
a 3
w 2

so on so forth...
Totally doable as long as you create a score table that's decent, although it's A LOT OF WORK. So by all means, I don't demand / expect or judge you for not doing it, I just said that it is doable.
Take a hint. Re-read his posts. He doesn't want to do it in his mod and won't do it in his mod. If you want it, make your own sub-mod.
 
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