Real-Life DLC or Expansion: Michael the Brave

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I'm all for a Balkan setting DLC as a nice change of pace and opportunity for many gamers to learn a bit of the history about regions other than their own.

However, i just got mad at myself as i realised that in all this Bannerlord EA and the pandemic fuss, i missed the fact that the Tsardoms Total War was released.

Without the wish to undermine the amazing effort the OP has put in his opening,
The previously mentioned mod for Medieval 2 Total War Kingdoms reminded me that THAT is the time period, factions and the map i think could be the most successful scenario for a Balkan setting DLC (if we dare even joke TaleWorlds would do such a DLC in the first place).

It encompasses much more stuff many more people would find being more familiar with and maybe drawn in by those little familiarities, much more than going "full balkan" from the start, if you know what i mean.

For those unaware what i am talking about
 
Words do not spawn material things; actions do. Instead of wasting time on preaching your beliefs, you, the thread poster, should focus on gathering like-minded people in order to create something greater. Topics on the forum get less exposure than elaborate modifications, which serve as a good way to popularize history. Too much ado about nothing.
 
Words do not spawn material things; actions do. Instead of wasting time on preaching your beliefs, you, the thread poster, should focus on gathering like-minded people in order to create something greater. Topics on the forum get less exposure than elaborate modifications, which serve as a good way to popularize history. Too much ado about nothing.
Words can spawn material things as well, if the developers decide to make a DLC out of this, given the feedback I think that's unlikely but at least the idea was put out there and presented.

90% of my beliefs I apparently preached are not exactly my beliefs but the preconceptions of an ignorant troll. As you said, every nation is rather interested in its own history and actually, any portrayal of a country's history translates into greater profits in that state. That's a reasonable assertion. So yeah, naturally, as a Romanian, I'm interested in the history of Romania and would like to play with a Romanian character.

But I didn't post this just for the sake of it being a Romanian character. I think the prospect of playing as a king trying to unite 3 principalities while effectively being attacked by 3 empires is interesting. By contrast, Dracula is more popular but I don't think playing Dracula would be as interesting as playing Michael the Brave since ultimately there wouldn't be much territorial change, just like in John Hunnyadi's case.

But from "every nation is rather interested in its own history" to "a suggestion about a Romanian ruler in the campaign is clear evidence of Romanian nationalist fervor" is a huge difference. Which is the reason for that whole conversation.

It's a bit ironic how in his quest to debunk the distortion of reality from nationalist fervor he is guilty of his own distortion of reality with the horse lens automatically assuming that everything that comes from a small country must be factually incorrect and exaggerated, because it has to be infused with nationalistic myth.

He doubts the validity of the video arguing that it must have been made by fanboys, arguing that instead, he checked the wiki. Which he didn't because if it did, he would reach the same conclusion as the video:

His denial is quite emotional in nature, without even watching the videos he already tagged me and the videos as nationalist fervor that tries to distort reality and hype their historical figures to create a national myth, because that's what is compatible with his prejudices.

I don't think I was actually preaching anything, rather than debunking his lack of objectivity and even integrity. He made plain arguments about John Hunyadi that were equally valid for Michael the Brave, when I pointed out that it applies to Michael the Brave too, he took this as a clear sign of my nationalistic fervor.

That could be excused as being too narrow-minded rather than lacking integrity, although it does show how much history he seems to know. But then when I told you some actually valid arguments for a John Hunyadi's campaign that wouldn't be applicable to Michael the Brave's campaign, making it a better option from that point of view. He jumped in saying that this is exactly why John Hunyadi is a better option and is clear proof I'm not objective. I mean for real, how desperate you must be? His argument was exactly my argument and this is why I'm not objective. Logic just killed itself.

It just goes to show desperate he is and how little he cares about actual facts and evidence as long as it serves his purpose of 'bashing nationalistic fervor with his all-mighty trailblazers of objectivity'.

I know this discussion had no productivity, but it's a rare occasion to see someone guilty of the same narrow-mindedness he claims to stand against. Some people exaggerate things without question out of nationalist fervor, he depreciate things without question because it has to be nationalist fervor. It's the same lack of objectivity, just in different directions.
 
Words can spawn material things as well, if the developers decide to make a DLC out of this, given the feedback I think that's unlikely but at least the idea was put out there and presented.
The difference in effort between making a post (even a 2000 word one) and making an overhaul mod is a factor of thousands. I say this as someone who's done both.

I think the main problem people have with your post is that it's a ultra-specific request that nobody except you cares about, and it almost comes across as arrogant to insist that you were serious about it rather than just shooting ideas around.
 
The difference in effort between making a post (even a 2000 word one) and making an overhaul mod is a factor of thousands. I say this as someone who's done both.
I agree.
I think the main problem people have with your post is that it's a ultra-specific request that nobody except you cares about, and it almost comes across as arrogant to insist that you were serious about it rather than just shooting ideas around.
The reason I made the post very specific is that Michael the Brave is an obscure figure and I needed to present why his campaign would be interesting. In handsight, I should have made a shorter summary.
 
all i got from this, is that i should watch a documentary about michael the brave.
he seems interesting.
and something to add, the most popular culture in today's world
is west-anglosaxon. so the majority of historic researches, books, docs etc.
are made by that perspective. so Akfiz
don't get angry.
 
@MadVader @Akfiz

Lol, did this thread just turn into a Hungary vs Romania debate?.... I'm disappointed guys, you can both do better than that.
I'm from Transylvania and never had issues getting along with any hungarian people. We really need to drop this nonsense.
 
@MadVader @Akfiz

Lol, did this thread just turn into a Hungary vs Romania debate?.... I'm disappointed guys, you can both do better than that.
I'm from Transylvania and never had issues getting along with any hungarian people. We really need to drop this nonsense.
Then why I are you not dropping it when everyone else did? Also, you didn't get the point.
 
Concluding, action is more valuable than words. We, players, do not want to spend time on reading; we want to spend time on playing. Making a modification with interwoven historical elements is not a sign of boosting a nation's worthless pride (oftentimes performed by people with conspicuous inferiority complex with respect to their nation's history) as it enriches experience of many. Writing long messages in order to preach one's own beliefs regarding their own country's history might be considered, however, otherwise since its only aim is to impose one's view on their readers; it is deemed by us, players, a display of arrogance.
 
@MadVader @Akfiz

Lol, did this thread just turn into a Hungary vs Romania debate?.... I'm disappointed guys, you can both do better than that.
I'm from Transylvania and never had issues getting along with any hungarian people. We really need to drop this nonsense.
I have no issue getting along with Hungarian people either, but some people would rather hate than come up with something good on their own. MadVader came up with John Hunyadi as a better alternative, when I pointed out that all the reasons he listed why John Hunyadi is a better choice than Michael the Brave also applies to Michael the Brave, he called it "Romanian nationalism", talking about projection.

I guess it could be Romanian nationalism if you ignore all the facts and only focus on the part where Michael the Brave can't be that good because he comes from Romania.
Concluding, action is more valuable than words. We, players, do not want to spend time on reading; we want to spend time on playing. Making a modification with interwoven historical elements is not a sign of boosting a nation's worthless pride (oftentimes performed by people with conspicuous inferiority complex with respect to their nation's history) as it enriches experience of many. Writing long messages in order to preach one's own beliefs regarding their own country's history might be considered, however, otherwise since its only aim is to impose one's view on their readers; it is deemed by us, players, a display of arrogance.
Ah, the spokesman of the players is here!

Since you are talking in the name of every player, I have a quick question for every Mount&Blade player: If you, all of the players, don't want to spend time reading, but want to spend time playing, why are you visiting the forums?

I would think that the players want to spend time reading when they are visiting the forums, and spend time playing when we are starting the game, but I couldn't have been more wrong.

Damn, Mount&Blade could be more popular than Counter-Strike, too bad all the players are confused and come to the forums when they want to play a game.

Mr.spokesman, please tell this to "we, the players": If your intention was to spend time playing, I don't think visiting the forum was the way to go. You have to start an app called Mount&Blade. Hopefully this will solve a lot of the confusion.

Using your logic, every game/mod ever made is a sign of boosting a nation's worthless pride: Call of Duty? boosts USA's worthless pride. Viking Conquests? boosts Scandinavia's worthless pride. With Fire and Sword? boosts Poland's worthless pride. We should only make games in fictional universes to avoid boosting a nation's worthless pride.

Funny how you're accusing me of nationalism but can't stop thinking in nationalistic lens. Ever since your first comment on this topic, your criticism never had anything to do with something about Michael the Brave, the validity of the facts presented or the implementation of the campaign. It was mainly about: "waagh, Romanian nationalism, nay!".

I don't care that you are allergic to nationalism, but when your sole reason for rejecting something is because it comes from a certain country, you may want to Google the term "xenophobia" and see whether it applies to you.

By the way, xenophobia was a central element of 19th century nationalism, so congratulations on being a nationalist without trying to be one!

The spokesman in you is back again. Just for the record, if aliens invade Earth I don't want you to speak in my name, so don't use the phrase "we, the humans" please.

Ok, let's follow your flawless logic and see where it goes. So, I should not write long messages in order to preach my beliefs about my country's history, because it will be deemed by every player of Mount&Blade ever a display of arrogance. Correct?

So, let's assume, out of nowhere, that I want to make a suggestion for a DLC. About a historical figure that is only known in Eastern Europe, and not even there by everyone case in point MadVader. In order to explain why this historical figure would be great for the game, I would need to write some text about it, right? BUT, if I write some text about it, it's a display of arrogance because it's preaching my own country's history. So, what do I do? It's a catch 22.

Need to write some text to explain the figure. Can't write some text because it's a display of arrogance. Since you're the one who thought of all of this, do you have any solution to this catch 22? Or maybe that's the entire point of your flawless logic. That there's no way out of it and I should stop doing it.

Very convenient, I'll give you that. By the way, you should boycott Activision, it's an American company making games about Americans to promote their country's worthless pride. They are not allowed to do that! Such display of arrogance, I know.

Sarcasm aside, if you're offended by person from country X making a suggestion about historical figure from country X, you either have an issue with country X or a snobbish sense of superiority, as there is objectively no reason to be offended by it or take it as a display of arrogance.

My post wasn't a display of arrogance, you're simply projecting your shortcomings on me, that's why it comes across as arrogant to you, despite the post objectively not being arrogant.

For example: Someone makes a suggestion about Tamar the Great of Georgia. Most people see it as a cool suggestion and judge it for what it is, the worth of the suggestion itself and the historical elements in it.

While "we, the players" can only think in terms of flags and nationality, either being offended by it because "how can those peasantly lowly worthless Georgians even consider doing such a thing", it hurts your ego to think that the Georgians even dare to rise to your standards, only Germany, US, France, UK are allowed to do these.

Or see it as a display of arrogance because of a personal sense of superiority "look at those Georgians, they think they have the history to match up our deeds, they are not as important as the Turks, the British, the French, screw them". It hurts my head to even project being such xenophobic, must be hard to live with it.

And before you ask, I think Tamar the Great of Georgia would make a great Mount&Blade campaign, just like Michael the Brave.

To conclude, such circular reasoning with no substance, might be considered, however, otherwise since its only aim is to impose one's view on their readers; it is deemed by us, players, a display of arrogance.

So please, stop projecting next time you try to be xenophobic.
 
Using your logic, every game/mod ever made is a sign of boosting a nation's worthless pride: Call of Duty? boosts USA's worthless pride. Viking Conquests? boosts Scandinavia's worthless pride. With Fire and Sword? boosts Poland's worthless pride. We should only make games in fictional universes to avoid boosting a nation's worthless pride.
This is true though. None of these games would exist without nationalists.
 
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