Re-Working Gold/Class System

HancockT35

Recruit
WB
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0
In the current class system I think it creates a lot of holes and snowball issues, The difference between 10 gold can be the difference between 3 or 2 re spawns or 1 heavy cav spawn or 2 heavy cav spawn. Gold also itself feels more of a threshold than a flexible currency for example you can Play Archer and never need more than 300 gold with some class asking what is the point of gaining gold. The class system along with the gold system feels incomplete and inconsistent with what most people would expect out of it.

The Legionary: https://gyazo.com/de62e88abc744e82471dd216985c9e1a
It currently costs you 140 gold but why if your a inf main and your going to play inf threw out the entire scrim whats the point of it being 140 gold. The fact its 140 gold has 0 impact on the 1st round it makes 0 difference whether its 150 or 140. The gold only comes into fact when you have 380 gold total which gives you a 3rd life with recruit. It takes 280 gold total to use your 2 lives with legionary and no matter what you will always be able to spawn with that. But it takes over 100 gold to get to the point where you get a extra spawn which is a extreme snowball. But this only comes into play if you snowball if you die every round twice by the time you hit the 3rd round you will only have 360 gold not even enough to spawn 3 times. This feels weird you literary have to snowball and win a round hard for you to be able to unlock something that allows you to snowball.

Palatine Guard/Veteran: https://gyazo.com/959674f6e4759b446f3cae86a1218c0d, https://gyazo.com/0a4c1ed0585217e9a07d30d53e039bd2
It currently costs you 150 gold no matter what point of game your at whether you are 0 and 10 or 30 and 0 you gain nothing by winning or losing. You cannot progress at all. Gold literary has 0 worth you if you play archery for Empire. Seriously whats the point Recruit/Skirmisher costs 100 your not going to be able to get a 3rd life. Gold is a extremely snowball mechanic that effects a lot of other class's and can allow them to snowball but no matter what you cannot. This creates a extreme flaw for Palatine Guard or Veteran as you cannot snowball unlike cav class's or other archer class's or inf class's and makes what the class system revolves around in gold not apply to 2 core class's and its just weird.

Cataphract: https://gyazo.com/89bd8d17babc39cf89993962e1735794
feels at a disadvantage compared to other cav class's No matter how well this class does the only thing it can hope for is reaching 340 gold allowing it to spawn once with Cataphract and once with courser. Then you compare it to Vlandian knight, Which costs 190 gold or Khuzait Lancer, Mamluke, and Druzhinnik which all costs 180 gold. This creates extremely way different snowball effects where every other fac, Other than Battania and Empire can snowball having 2 Heavy cav spawns. This creates a extremely bad balance where if a Mamluke and a Cataphract trade even tho its essentially 1 for 1 because of snowball the Mamaluke won the trade because the next spawn for the cataphract will be light cav vs the Mamaluke heavy cav.

In the Current state of the game depending on what class you play 90 gold can literary mean nothing or 10 gold can mean everything it feels extremely imbalanced and almost impossible to balance as you look at formula's like League of legends and Dota 2 where constant change is happening to the meta. In bannerlord I feel like the same approach is being tried but the difference in Dota 2 is a hero can receive +3 base armor and can become good but in Bannerlord if a single class receives a -10 or +10 gold change it can result in 3 respawns or 2 respawns.

So whats the solution? because whether this system stays or changes it needs a lot of work. In my opinion I don't see a way to balance class system within reason without just reworking it and using Warbands loadout system. The community I feel like would really enjoy the change as it helps casuals with creativity and to meme. While allowing Competitive players a better system that yes has snowball but not to the extreme that its currently in the game.

Side Notes: Nerf Vlandia Xbow, Buff Sturgia Hunter
 

artiedee

Recruit
Best answers
0
Its more of a question whether TW is making a game for themselves or for us. If its the first one then good luck with retaining playerbase, Im pretty sure come Christmas no one will be playing multiplayer at all, but hey at least they will have their class system and all the justification behind it for themselves.
 

Caps

Knight at Arms
WBWF&SNWVC
Best answers
0
In the current class system I think it creates a lot of holes and snowball issues, The difference between 10 gold can be the difference between 3 or 2 re spawns or 1 heavy cav spawn or 2 heavy cav spawn. Gold also itself feels more of a threshold than a flexible currency for example you can Play Archer and never need more than 300 gold with some class asking what is the point of gaining gold. The class system along with the gold system feels incomplete and inconsistent with what most people would expect out of it.

The Legionary: https://gyazo.com/de62e88abc744e82471dd216985c9e1a
It currently costs you 140 gold but why if your a inf main and your going to play inf threw out the entire scrim whats the point of it being 140 gold. The fact its 140 gold has 0 impact on the 1st round it makes 0 difference whether its 150 or 140. The gold only comes into fact when you have 380 gold total which gives you a 3rd life with recruit. It takes 280 gold total to use your 2 lives with legionary and no matter what you will always be able to spawn with that. But it takes over 100 gold to get to the point where you get a extra spawn which is a extreme snowball. But this only comes into play if you snowball if you die every round twice by the time you hit the 3rd round you will only have 360 gold not even enough to spawn 3 times. This feels weird you literary have to snowball and win a round hard for you to be able to unlock something that allows you to snowball.

Palatine Guard/Veteran: https://gyazo.com/959674f6e4759b446f3cae86a1218c0d, https://gyazo.com/0a4c1ed0585217e9a07d30d53e039bd2
It currently costs you 150 gold no matter what point of game your at whether you are 0 and 10 or 30 and 0 you gain nothing by winning or losing. You cannot progress at all. Gold literary has 0 worth you if you play archery for Empire. Seriously whats the point Recruit/Skirmisher costs 100 your not going to be able to get a 3rd life. Gold is a extremely snowball mechanic that effects a lot of other class's and can allow them to snowball but no matter what you cannot. This creates a extreme flaw for Palatine Guard or Veteran as you cannot snowball unlike cav class's or other archer class's or inf class's and makes what the class system revolves around in gold not apply to 2 core class's and its just weird.

Cataphract: https://gyazo.com/89bd8d17babc39cf89993962e1735794
feels at a disadvantage compared to other cav class's No matter how well this class does the only thing it can hope for is reaching 340 gold allowing it to spawn once with Cataphract and once with courser. Then you compare it to Vlandian knight, Which costs 190 gold or Khuzait Lancer, Mamluke, and Druzhinnik which all costs 180 gold. This creates extremely way different snowball effects where every other fac, Other than Battania and Empire can snowball having 2 Heavy cav spawns. This creates a extremely bad balance where if a Mamluke and a Cataphract trade even tho its essentially 1 for 1 because of snowball the Mamaluke won the trade because the next spawn for the cataphract will be light cav vs the Mamaluke heavy cav.

In the Current state of the game depending on what class you play 90 gold can literary mean nothing or 10 gold can mean everything it feels extremely imbalanced and almost impossible to balance as you look at formula's like League of legends and Dota 2 where constant change is happening to the meta. In bannerlord I feel like the same approach is being tried but the difference in Dota 2 is a hero can receive +3 base armor and can become good but in Bannerlord if a single class receives a -10 or +10 gold change it can result in 3 respawns or 2 respawns.

So whats the solution? because whether this system stays or changes it needs a lot of work. In my opinion I don't see a way to balance class system within reason without just reworking it and using Warbands loadout system. The community I feel like would really enjoy the change as it helps casuals with creativity and to meme. While allowing Competitive players a better system that yes has snowball but not to the extreme that its currently in the game.

Side Notes: Nerf Vlandia Xbow, Buff Sturgia Hunter
Having units at 140g instead of 150g lets you spawn in with 120g units or swap your units decision later on. Its not a system that needs a rework its the units. If the difference between heavy and light units is smaller, it will be easier to balance.
 
Best answers
0
I don’t think there’s anything wrong with this
Winners get like 30 gold extra if they’re alive: not that big of a deal
It also opens up to tactics like forfeiting spawn for a round and saving up their money or spawning with a weaker unit for the round
 

Caps

Knight at Arms
WBWF&SNWVC
Best answers
0
I don’t think there’s anything wrong with this
Winners get like 30 gold extra if they’re alive: not that big of a deal
It also opens up to tactics like forfeiting spawn for a round and saving up their money or spawning with a weaker unit for the round
The problem is winning without dying, idm the snowballing effect. But getting 2 times heavy cav is just far too strong.
 

๖Kern

Grandmaster Knight
WBNW
Best answers
0
I think that system can be improved a lot but it needs more thought, it’s not as simple as “make some units cheaper and some more expensive.”
 

DainMorgot

Regular
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0
I think that system can be improved a lot but it needs more thought, it’s not as simple as “make some units cheaper and some more expensive.”

Which is precisely that every step taken towards improving the class system will lead to another stupid layer on top of a layer for the sake of balance which cannot be achieved unless the current design philosophy changes. It's really evident that classes are not easier to balance than gearing.
 
Best answers
0
The problem is winning without dying, idm the snowballing effect. But getting 2 times heavy cav is just far too strong.
I disagree, with proper counterplay, cav really isn't as strong as it seems rn. Usually, archers, javelins, and spear wielders can pretty effectively take down heavy cav. The chance of getting heavy cav 2 times also serve as an interesting consideration (do I press X or F?)
 

FearSpear

Recruit
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0
If the gold system were changed in such a way that different perks (or perhaps instead of a perk you choose to bring nothing) would cost different amounts of gold, it would allow for a greater depth of strategy without detracting from the original intention of the gold system. At this point it would be far easier to simply remove the class system in favor of customization gear however...