Poll: Horse Hopping Must GO!!!

[Ordonator]

I'm not playing beta so I'm not sure, but my guess is that you can easily counter that with an overhead attack of an axe, or a stab of a shorter (but still long enough) weapon like a Great Sword.

Nope not a chance.

 

[kingofnoobia]

I'm not playing beta so I'm not sure, but my guess is that you can easily counter that with an overhead attack of an axe, or a stab of a shorter (but still long enough) weapon like a Great Sword.

Nope not a chance.

Ok, what about throwing an axe the moment he lowers his shield (even before he jumps)?

 

[Swadius 2.0]

I've only had the jumping thing happen to me once, successfully. The second time I just aimed at the torso of the rider and he fell off the horse into a lynch mob.

 

[Redfyre]

Yeah. Often when the rider jumps I still take down his horse and he falls to the ground. Granted this stops me from killing him but his horse is injured.

 

[brunoxyz]

I havn't seen it so often, and  jumping is needed to get on top of houses and trees. 

JK,    but horses need to jump fences etc, maybe making them jump a little lower is the solution.

 

[Darkness]

I just got a brilliant idea, lets do the following to multiplayer:

Make EVERY server 1v1!!! this way nobody gets an unfair advantage due to team imbalance.

Then, plant the two players 2 feet apart from each other with a long sword an tournament tunic each.

Now glue them in place, and make them unable to move, this way they can't sploit unfair stuff!

Furthermore, blocking is gay, so disable it, now let them hack at each other in a fair and balanced manner and everyone has an equal chance.

You're totally missing the point. I don't care if a horseman can ride my ass down while I'm playing as a swordsman or archer or whatever.  There has to be one, solid direct counter to such a widely used style of play. I thought it was pikeman. Apparently its not.

There shouldn't be one Troop-archetype to rule them all. It's stupid and it makes people want to quit the game. And I'm not alone on this one.

My lack of skill is the only thing that tempts me to quit. Well... that and the finicky ranged weapons. Sometimes it'll take me 3 axes or 3 to 5 arrows to kill someone. But ill be owned with one. well... those and friendly fire. Friendly fire urks me the most. I've played archer enough to plan my arrows. I don't shoot except when I can avoid hitting my teammate. However, when you are shooting through a gap thats very small (achm, windows, down ladders, through slightly open doors) and your teammate just immediately walks infront of you. Boom you headshot them your dead. This is not my fault. Yet I pay for it.

But past that rant, I agree that you should not be able to bunny hop as a cavalry. It should be shorter apex but longer total distance. Thats the way horses really jump anyway. They dont do short little hops, we might as well all be riding oversized rabbits (and if they are monty python rabbits, they would fit both setting and be very useful killers).

 

[Stromko]

I haven't really had an issue with horses jumping over me while the rider killed me, I don't think it's actually happened to me and I just played for about six hours straight. The timing to get a regular couched lance attack is rather tricky, adding that on top of it seems like too much work.

I did have a horse rider try to jump me once, and I killed him because I aimed a little higher up. Seems like the horse still makes a rather large target when they're jumping you, and if you can take out the horse the rider is much less dangerous than before.

One thing I have noticed, in my experience it's very difficult to fight horsemen with a spear, you're better off with a swinging weapon, ideally a two-handed axe or something big like that. Though I did run into one player (Jethro-something) who was quite good at spearing cavalry. I tried to charge him on many separate occasions, each time I got close he'd waste my horse or just straight kill me. So apparently this is something one can master.

 

[Darkness]

I haven't really had an issue with horses jumping over me while the rider killed me, I don't think it's actually happened to me and I just played for about six hours straight. The timing to get a regular couched lance attack is rather tricky, adding that on top of it seems like too much work.

I did have a horse rider try to jump me once, and I killed him because I aimed a little higher up. Seems like the horse still makes a rather large target when they're jumping you, and if you can take out the horse the rider is much less dangerous than before.

One thing I have noticed, in my experience it's very difficult to fight horsemen with a spear, you're better off with a swinging weapon, ideally a two-handed axe or something big like that. Though I did run into one player (Jethro-something) who was quite good at spearing cavalry. I tried to charge him on many separate occasions, each time I got close he'd waste my horse or just straight kill me. So apparently this is something one can master.

Oh yes, I can spear down atleast 2 out of 3 horses that charge me. And kill maybe 1 in 3 horsemen that charge me out right. Spears own horses for sure.

 

[IntegerDevourer]

I agree it is an imbalance and that a horse's jump should be based on speed (if possible).

 

[JethroKirby]

I haven't really had an issue with horses jumping over me while the rider killed me, I don't think it's actually happened to me and I just played for about six hours straight. The timing to get a regular couched lance attack is rather tricky, adding that on top of it seems like too much work.

I did have a horse rider try to jump me once, and I killed him because I aimed a little higher up. Seems like the horse still makes a rather large target when they're jumping you, and if you can take out the horse the rider is much less dangerous than before.

One thing I have noticed, in my experience it's very difficult to fight horsemen with a spear, you're better off with a swinging weapon, ideally a two-handed axe or something big like that. Though I did run into one player (Jethro-something) who was quite good at spearing cavalry. I tried to charge him on many separate occasions, each time I got close he'd waste my horse or just straight kill me. So apparently this is something one can master.

That would be me And I quite enjoy a good cavalrymen kabob as my favorite meal after a few rounds of Warband. I'm only good with pikes, but I get moderate success with the shorter ones and glaives I'm ok - I mainly use the jump+horizontal slash for those. The trick is in the timing, much like lancing from horseback. Just pretend you are on a horse and your target is on foot. Also don't aim for the horse as you still have a good chance of getting hit by the rider, particularly since horses have more hp.

I'm still trying to learn the technique of dodging the riderless horse after the kill - I have a tendency to put myself right in the path. Also be careful piking horses when you are surrounded by them. I was playing earlier this morning and was doing good 1v1 but once the horsemen started catching on they would gang up on me and stand off with throwing weapons. If you are fighting more than two at a time... run. Seriously, its time to find buddies or a hiding place to make em come to you.

 

[wolfstriked]

I think this is cured by just putting horse jump height to realistic levels.I feel that M&B had these high jump heights to ensure that player wouldn't have to go around fences in SP(ever notice alot of fences are knocked down).Same with jumps over pretty high fences while on foot.Its annoying to see a fenced in area and not be able to "climb" over it instead having to run its length to get inside.......so they made higher jumps priority.Not good for MP.


EDIT just found this video showing some insane horse jump height.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QjxV-kSuCA4&NR=1

 

[Ravenheild]

On the 2H axe vs horses, I think that works better if you have backup because once I get into a horseman groove with a lance I can usually skirt a 2-hander enough until he gives up and I don't even have to charge him

 

[RoyaleWithCheese]

Your poll asks us to state whether or not we agree that this problem "must be corrected," but the title states that "horse jumping must go."  If horse jumping is removed entirely, within minutes we're going to see another thread on these forums complaining about obstacles and the certain exploitation of them by archers and infantry.  If jumping needs to be nerfed, then nerf them in such a way that jumping over obstacles (not including enemy pikes) is still possible.

 

[wolfstriked]

Also I dont know if horse legs have hit boxes....if not then add it.This way you can hit a horses legs so they land face down throwing the rider.And is thrown rider damage being looked at still?

 

[Tibertus]

Historically, a 1:1 ratio of cavalry to spearmen (pikemen, polearms, etc.) would not stop the cavalry, you had to have at least 10 spearmen to every cavalry to effectively stop the charge, and high casualties would still be seen by the spearmen. The things that stopped cavalry charges were of course the polearm, AND disciplined formations in greater numbers. Try getting more people together who want to fight as infantry, and you'll start taking down a lot more cavalry if you work together. Unfortunately, if you're playing a game with only 10 or so people, cavalry will do its thing.

 

[Skeletor9000]

Personally, I don't mind the horse jumping, though I agree it should be limited or impacted by what the horse is carrying. A Khergit bowman? Sure, let the horse jump the fences. A fully armored Swadian knight? Even the hardiest destrier wouldn't be jumping fences with that sort of load. The game already has an encumbrance system for players; why not just use that to limit horse jumps?

Furthermore, I really miss the infantry couching of lances, though I wouldn't want to see it implemented to the same extend as in native extended. I think that those polearms which prohibit the use of a shield should be couchable, perhaps even making that the "attack" animation -- players click and hold the LMB to brace the polearm to receive a charge. That way, if you want to skewer folks, you can still do so with a shield and spear, but if you want to be a dedicated pikeman and stop charges, you'll have to risk quarrels and arrows while doing so.

 

[Ordonator]

Historically, a 1:1 ratio of cavalry to spearmen (pikemen, polearms, etc.) would not stop the cavalry, you had to have at least 10 spearmen to every cavalry to effectively stop the charge, and high casualties would still be seen by the spearmen. The things that stopped cavalry charges were of course the polearm, AND disciplined formations in greater numbers. Try getting more people together who want to fight as infantry, and you'll start taking down a lot more cavalry if you work together. Unfortunately, if you're playing a game with only 10 or so people, cavalry will do its thing.

Screw history. How can anyone even know that? Where you there?

Stick to what we can prove, which is whether or not the game is fair and entertaining for everyone playing it.

Historically speaking, games that aren't balanced often tend to suck. How bout that?

 

[Skot the Sanguine]

I haven't had much of a problem spearing horses with my pike.  However, on occasion I do have a horse jump clear over myself and my weapon, which isn't realistic.  Jumping in general is too high for realism, but it might have its reasons (for when on foot anyway).  I think the height of horses jumping should be decreased but at a level where they can still jump over barriers like a wooded fence for a garden.  Horses can't jump as high in real life as they do in this game.

At this point, it is not a game breaker....it is barely perceptible for me.

As for needing a ration of 10 spearmen per horse....I challenge both your source and logic.  The Swiss didn't have those odds and they still won.

 

[Ordonator]

EDIT just found this video showing some insane horse jump height.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QjxV-kSuCA4&NR=1

A) I turned into a girl after I watched that video. B) Those horses have no riders.

 

[derfel cadarn]

What if the speed of the horse became a factor for how high they could jump. I am pretty sure it actually applies similarly in real life though I am no horseman. The faster your riding the lower but further your jump, on the other hand the slower your riding the higher you jump.

This way a charging horseman who decided to jump his enemy would, at best, be able to knock him down with the horse (if the pikeman didnt run his pike through his mount). The ability to attack with sword or lance, and actually hit anything, should be somewhat reduced causeing the rider to stick to their plan or veer away if they see they are going to be speared first.

Now if you needed to hop a high fence or broken wall you would have to slow down to almost a trot and take a higher jump. At that speed your not going to clear a footman if your intention is to jump over him. He will be able to spear you either when you jump or as your comming down.

Just my opinion on the matter. Imagine when you did running long-jump versus high-jump in school.