[Poll] Attack/Shooting while crouching available in Bannerlord

[Terco_Viejo]

I know that most of you have definitely thrown in the towel regarding MP or are just waiting for the modding tools to be released for custom servers. However, I would like to " measure" the general interest by means of a poll regarding the issue of attacking/shooting while crouching/squating.

While it's true that in Warband native there is no "official" crouching option (you could change the can_crouch parameter in the module.ini file to 1 to activate the action; buggy yes, but somewhat activatable) in later installments it was available through the use of strikes and shooting; something that broadened the playable experience imho.

Warband​	Bannerlord​

Viking Conquest​	Napoleonic Wars​

Unfortunately there is no such possibility officially in Bannerlord as the crouch action is automatically cancelled if you launch a strike or a shot from that pose. Another problem for us players is when it comes to modifying this; it is currently not possible as it is subordinated to the engine (hard coded)...

[...]Tried some simple methods like setting the flags or simply calling crouch in each tick still not working. All goes to engine, so I'm guessing that engine sends something back and overwrites it. Source - A reliable top programmer

Square defence formation actions as seen in NW or shieldwall variants with crouching players in organized events or a simple wall or ladder defence will not be possible if Taleworlds doesn't fix/allow it.

Obviously this possibility of attacking/shooting from a crouched position implies automatic cancel and standing up if the player changes his static position by using any movement key; just as it is implemented in the previous installments I mentioned as an example.

So, I bring a question to you players; do you want to have attack/shot while crouching available in Bannerlord?

I'm quoting @Dejan and @badbuckle in case you would like to comment on this, or if you would like to convey an official stance on the subject here.

Thank you all in advance.

 

[Horatius]

God please no, this will probably just make the game break again. Why do you think asking for new features is a good plan with this magnificent case of mismanagement.

 

[Spulor]

IMO more options are always better, especially for range it would also make sense to be able to do this. For melee I don’t really see the practical use (maybe vs. cav to dodge/stab?), but it feels unnatural that you can’t do it.

Important for me would be that as you said if you move the action gets cancelled and also that for a standing opponent the block directions remain the same, otherwise you would have to crouch as well to block a lower stab I guess, which would be annoying.

You would also need a command for AI troops in captain.

At least it should definitely be moddable for mods in settings which need this kind of functionality.

 

[Vattghern]

Shooting yes. But melee attacks should deal reduced damage.

 

[hoonii]

pls no mordhau

 

[Namakan]

We've had crossbows reloading while crouched, that was broken enough already. No need for the full thing.

 

[Younes]

Just do it for melee, this is literally a must-have for mods like full invasion

 

[vonbrandt]

This will be good.

 

[Kripaz]

Generally I'm not a fan of crouching while in melee or shooting, but I'm more than willing to accept it for mods that actually have a specific purpose for it.

 

[Terco_Viejo]

As far as I can see, a controversial subject... we have a bone to pick .

Joking aside, from a competitive environment perspective, what harm would such an addition bring to the gameplay-balance experience?. Any of you who voted NO, would like to speak up? Thanks in advance to all of you for your participation.

 

[Namakan]

Joking aside, from a competitive environment perspective, what harm would such an addition bring to the gameplay-balance experience?. Any of you who voted NO, would like to speak up? Thanks in advance to all of you for your participation.

Spoiler: rambling

For ranged, crossbows reloading was already an issue (a bug, that was fixed) some time ago - basically, you make yourself a smaller target and thus are harder to hit - for other ranged players (meaning you can find cover more easily behind smaller props, where as without crouch-reloading, you'd get shot) but also for cav coming by at high speeds. [I think there were some other issues as well but I can't remember]

Secondly, now being allowed to fire while crouched would probably lead to even more tiny spots archers could sit in and plonk away. Right now, if you want to shoot someone as an archer, you are most likely also visible to them. I fear that crouch-shooting would greatly reduce the chance of seeing someone shooting at you (before they do so, at least).

As for infantry, I believe there are enough unreliable mechanics that should be fixed before new things are considered. I don't play nearly enough infantry to properly comment on this though.

tl;dr: For archers I feel likes this would be an unreasonable buff. For infantry, I feel like it would be yet another gimmick that would probably just add another (annoying) layer to the bull****-bingo infantry already is.

Generally, this should just be an easy config change like it was in warband, as you showed in your OP.

 

[Einarcf]

Maybe for melee, not for shooting

 

[ParzivaI]

This was one of the features that made the previous games good, idk why remove it in the first place

 

[Horatius]

This was one of the features that made the previous games good, idk why remove it in the first place

Since when can you crouch in warband MP?

 

[Farticle]

I don't know anything about competition but it makes sense to me, at the very very least for crossbows.

 

[ParzivaI]

Since when can you crouch in warband MP?

only using mods like persistent world/frontier and others, or the DLC viking conquest

 

[Clsy]

OH NO DONT ADD ANYTHING ITS BROKEN
OH NO ADD SOMETHING ITS BROKEN

this sub forum in a nutshell

and yes btw it's better for singleplayer

 

[Younes]

OH NO DONT ADD ANYTHING ITS BROKEN
OH NO ADD SOMETHING ITS BROKEN

this sub forum in a nutshell

and yes btw it's better for singleplayer

You really think you did something there, which is painfully funny.

 

[Etonviper]

This would be fun to have, I want to cut at peoples shins

 

[Lagstro]

from a competitive environment perspective, what harm would such an addition bring to the gameplay-balance experience?

Since that's a specific question you asked, what I would say is that as a standalone mechanic, it sounds like it should be fine at a glance, but taking into consideration Bannerlord's current shielding animations and their limited movement range (thus limited shield coverage), there's a potential problem I can see with this being implemented for high level play, and that is that being able to shoot from a lower height would provide archers with an easier angle to shoot at feet from, especially at closer distances.

I can imagine it being like a reverse problem of archers/xbows/weapon throwers jumping over shield users in warband at close range, and shooting them in the head because shields couldn't be moved high enough to block shots or throws like that. I think this could cause a similar situation, except that instead of it being an unblockable shot from above, it would be an unblockable shot from below.

It's been months since I last played Bannerlord, and I can't remember if you could reach the ground and cover your toes with the smaller shields in the game while crouching, but even if you could, requiring infantry to be constantly crouching down to block foot shots, or especially trying to do so while in the middle of fighting other infantry would probably look and feel just as bad, potentially even worse, than not being able to shoot while being crouched.

Some actual current comp players should chime in on the practicality of something like this in the current state of the game, because things may have changed already since the last time I played, or I may be misremembering how the game worked.

In essence, my position is that being able to shoot from a crouched position would be visually appealing, and would feel intuitive, but given how other aspects of the game are designed (in this case shielding), allowing it could be problematic for gameplay.

I think if shield users were given a higher degree of shield movement range while in a non-crouched position, being able to shoot while crouched would be completely fine, and there would be no good reason for it not to be in the game if Bannerlord already introduced crouching into the game. I do think that not being able to shoot while crouched inevitably leaves a sour taste in every new player's mouth who has tried to do it, as it feels unintuitive and restrictive to be unable to do so. It's definitely a part of a conglomeration of game mechanics that TW (or modders) should look into fixing up all at once so that all the game mechanics can mesh well together.