QFT
You won't find anything extraordinary.
I did the Battanian extortion quests frequently to get Fian prisoners and I never looted anything better than the armored bear pelt from memory.
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Player Frustration
- 主题发起人 Flesson19
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I did the Battanian extortion quests frequently to get Fian prisoners and I never looted anything better than the armored bear pelt from memory.
Personally, my greatest source of frustration was that the release was falsely labeled as "Early Access."
For all the multiple Early Access projects I've participated in (even before early access existed, for that matter), this almost always meant at least some degree of back and forth between developers and participants. You know... actual honest-to-Bob "participation."
Bannerlord, whether it was the intention or not, ended up as "financing/pre-order" release (something Steam EA guidelines make clear it shouldn't be). Hell, even the "feedback and suggestion" forum was tossed away to "community moderators" so that Taleworlds doesn't have to bother reading, much less replying. At all.
What frustrates me is that, after being teased all the "improved" features, most of them were back-tracked on (such as castle construction or settlement upgrade to another type). After all the dev blog posts hype about Bannerlord being such an improvement over Warband (and, admittedly, the graphical improvements are there), we end up with decisions like the dumbified "village is no longer independent fief" that impacts too damn many elements for my liking. A lot of the "improvements" are side-steps, if not outright steps back, and then Callum comes out with this gem of a "action game with just some strategy elements sprinkled around."
So we have no meaningful input into design direction (because good luck figuring out what ideas TW is looking for, if at all, with not a single official post on even the Feedback sub-board), the design decisions that you CAN see in the game are all over the place (and mostly existing in disjunction of other elements), the "priority list" is just polishing stage, there is no indication Taleworlds even considers attempting adding more than a "sprinkle" of strategic elements (you know, the key major improvement of any larger mod in Warband, so apparently their customer base was rather interested in improvements in that area), and I won't even mention the complete lack of any non-PR communication (aside from occasional posts from Duh or Mexxico buried in some threads, so basically only accessible to somebody living on these boards religiously).
I am perfectly fine with missing content (I "played" plenty of EA projects that started from tech demo stage) - as long as there's meaningful show of progress. Not really something that applies to Bannerlord, considering we're near 4 months since the horrible first release (the amount of easily fixable issues it had made it clear they didn't even bother attempting to polish it up before tossing it out with the hefty price tag), and there has been next to no progress on actual content.
I mean, seriously, they hype up adding a sodding "Create Kingdom" button in the "EA Update we did so much!" post.
I don't mind bugs, if they are addressed in reasonably quick way, either. At least here TW's record isn't that bad, but EA is supposed to ba a wee bit more than just bug fixing, especially when you release a PlaceholderLord.
What I do mind, is that this is not Early Access in the slightest, at least by the metrics based on my personal experience (for the record, I have credit mentions in several past EA titles, because that's how much I enjoy the process and how much I have participated in several of the projects). And that frustrates me the most, because this was not what I paid a significant price tag to be a part of, and it's not what was advertised, either.
They took the money, and don't even have the courtesy to adhere to even base expectations of what Early Access should require from them in turn. Spoiler alert: taking money and ignoring communication ain't it.
Even dismissing their complete absence from Steam boards (something I think is extremely unprofessional, considering that's their bloody release platform of own choice), the lack of any presence on even the "official" boards actually directing the communal efforts of both feedback and idea suggestions was a huge source frustration to me, until I realized there's no point anymore.
I gave up on this game. It'll end up what it'll end up (and I strongly suspect a lot of people will end up disappointed). "Mods will fix it" to whatever degree they will. Maybe I'll be still around to play it, though considering the pace of Taleworlds' work that's highly questionable. Either way, I know what my response will be from now on anytime somebody mentions this studio and their products.
"Fool me once" and all, and at this point I'm completely disinterested in any excuses as to why this project has been handled the way it has.
For all the multiple Early Access projects I've participated in (even before early access existed, for that matter), this almost always meant at least some degree of back and forth between developers and participants. You know... actual honest-to-Bob "participation."
Bannerlord, whether it was the intention or not, ended up as "financing/pre-order" release (something Steam EA guidelines make clear it shouldn't be). Hell, even the "feedback and suggestion" forum was tossed away to "community moderators" so that Taleworlds doesn't have to bother reading, much less replying. At all.
What frustrates me is that, after being teased all the "improved" features, most of them were back-tracked on (such as castle construction or settlement upgrade to another type). After all the dev blog posts hype about Bannerlord being such an improvement over Warband (and, admittedly, the graphical improvements are there), we end up with decisions like the dumbified "village is no longer independent fief" that impacts too damn many elements for my liking. A lot of the "improvements" are side-steps, if not outright steps back, and then Callum comes out with this gem of a "action game with just some strategy elements sprinkled around."
So we have no meaningful input into design direction (because good luck figuring out what ideas TW is looking for, if at all, with not a single official post on even the Feedback sub-board), the design decisions that you CAN see in the game are all over the place (and mostly existing in disjunction of other elements), the "priority list" is just polishing stage, there is no indication Taleworlds even considers attempting adding more than a "sprinkle" of strategic elements (you know, the key major improvement of any larger mod in Warband, so apparently their customer base was rather interested in improvements in that area), and I won't even mention the complete lack of any non-PR communication (aside from occasional posts from Duh or Mexxico buried in some threads, so basically only accessible to somebody living on these boards religiously).
I am perfectly fine with missing content (I "played" plenty of EA projects that started from tech demo stage) - as long as there's meaningful show of progress. Not really something that applies to Bannerlord, considering we're near 4 months since the horrible first release (the amount of easily fixable issues it had made it clear they didn't even bother attempting to polish it up before tossing it out with the hefty price tag), and there has been next to no progress on actual content.
I mean, seriously, they hype up adding a sodding "Create Kingdom" button in the "EA Update we did so much!" post.
I don't mind bugs, if they are addressed in reasonably quick way, either. At least here TW's record isn't that bad, but EA is supposed to ba a wee bit more than just bug fixing, especially when you release a PlaceholderLord.
What I do mind, is that this is not Early Access in the slightest, at least by the metrics based on my personal experience (for the record, I have credit mentions in several past EA titles, because that's how much I enjoy the process and how much I have participated in several of the projects). And that frustrates me the most, because this was not what I paid a significant price tag to be a part of, and it's not what was advertised, either.
They took the money, and don't even have the courtesy to adhere to even base expectations of what Early Access should require from them in turn. Spoiler alert: taking money and ignoring communication ain't it.
Even dismissing their complete absence from Steam boards (something I think is extremely unprofessional, considering that's their bloody release platform of own choice), the lack of any presence on even the "official" boards actually directing the communal efforts of both feedback and idea suggestions was a huge source frustration to me, until I realized there's no point anymore.
I gave up on this game. It'll end up what it'll end up (and I strongly suspect a lot of people will end up disappointed). "Mods will fix it" to whatever degree they will. Maybe I'll be still around to play it, though considering the pace of Taleworlds' work that's highly questionable. Either way, I know what my response will be from now on anytime somebody mentions this studio and their products.
"Fool me once" and all, and at this point I'm completely disinterested in any excuses as to why this project has been handled the way it has.
最后编辑:
You´re totally right, this is the last info we got on the next update (correct me if I´m wrong):
It was one week ago
It was one week ago
If this was directed at me, I wouldn't know.
I found another, genuine "small indie team," project that I bought into, and enjoy all the benefits of being part of the actual development process, with the sole programmer of the team somehow managing daily communication (including feedback with direct code snippets to make us, participants, better aware of how the game handles things which balance and implementation we are discussing). And they aren't 50-100 people studio, haven't just racked in a significant amount of money from "pre-purchase" con of an "EA," just a bunch of people with drive and desire to make a good game without abusing, but rather fully utilizing, the "early access" process.
When this forum (and that'll likely happen pretty quickly considering nothing is changing in TW's behavior) becomes the, apparently desired, echochamber for just the most die-hard-see-no-evil "supporters" of Bannerlord, the game sure won't get better, but at this point you might just consider it a write-off and move on anyway.
Yes, it was directed at you. I also bought into a lot of "real" EA games, TW isn´t doing EA it´s more like Kickstarter.
I share the dismay of a lot of people in this thread. I genuinely considered the launch promising: sure, it was broken as hell but a lot of the surface-level mistakes seemed pretty easy to fix (e.g. broken unit stats, gear, perk implementation - things the modding community addressed swiftly), and I imagined that by now we'd be offering constructive feedback on new features that expand the original Warband ruleset. It's hard to believe we're 3 months in and the game has made so little progress.
As for the topic of lack of dev communication, I'd mind it a good deal less if the beta branch felt like a true beta test, for a mass of users to provide feedback on (and identify the occasional edge case bug that got missed by QA). But when core features of a patch like the 'Create Kingdom' button actually yield CTDs, as 1.4.1 originally did, it becomes painfully apparent that branch is an alpha with no internal QA team involved: we're it. The devs need to maintain a much more active dialogue with their outsourced QA team. Without it, the unpaid testers will steadily drop out of the beta branch (personally I already have) and stop providing the feedback needed for the game to progress towards full release.
As for the topic of lack of dev communication, I'd mind it a good deal less if the beta branch felt like a true beta test, for a mass of users to provide feedback on (and identify the occasional edge case bug that got missed by QA). But when core features of a patch like the 'Create Kingdom' button actually yield CTDs, as 1.4.1 originally did, it becomes painfully apparent that branch is an alpha with no internal QA team involved: we're it. The devs need to maintain a much more active dialogue with their outsourced QA team. Without it, the unpaid testers will steadily drop out of the beta branch (personally I already have) and stop providing the feedback needed for the game to progress towards full release.
RoyalGut
Recruit
I remember even at the beginning when everyone was happy and saying "we should be grateful that we have this many patches" i expressed my concerns about how this is going, and was jumped by the blind-following fanboys.
Unfortunately things didn't change at all, it is even worse than it was. What a shame really, i cannot understand the reasoning behind TW's actions.
Unfortunately things didn't change at all, it is even worse than it was. What a shame really, i cannot understand the reasoning behind TW's actions.
markp27
Sergeant
Early Access Game
Get instant access and start playing; get involved with this game as it develops.
Note: This Early Access game is not complete and may or may not change further. If you are not excited to play this game in its current state, then you should wait to see if the game progresses further in development. Learn more
Is what steam states on it's site. Be thankful you did not buy Interstellar Marines which next month has been in early access for 7 years. At least this game is slowly progressing and I for one am happy with that.
Get instant access and start playing; get involved with this game as it develops.
Note: This Early Access game is not complete and may or may not change further. If you are not excited to play this game in its current state, then you should wait to see if the game progresses further in development. Learn more
Is what steam states on it's site. Be thankful you did not buy Interstellar Marines which next month has been in early access for 7 years. At least this game is slowly progressing and I for one am happy with that.
That was kind of my point, I know it's early access and we were made aware. What I am saying is each of us are their testers and potential promoters to others. I think they do a decent job in many areas, I was just saying that people are frustrated in a few such as communication and priority of things that should be done.
take today, it has been what 4 weeks or so since a non hot fix patch. I know there are working some major coding, but you can't fix some of the "known issues" or something in that time to release to us, It is just a couple areas that I think they could try better at to make people not as angry when trying to help them fix their game is all. I haven't even look at this thread since I made it, didn't think it would get this much attention just wanted to let the devs know a quick thought from people but here it is 4 weeks later to patch and no communication, my exact point.
I agree with everything you said @Sheepify, for me it's not even the bugs. There will always be bugs in games of this scale, luckily those will hopefully be fixed at some point. What personally frustrates me is the lack of ambition by TW, as you said yourself it feels like they've cut all the interesting things and are just going to deliever the absolute minimum acceptable.
I mean why aren't all scenes even done yet ? Surely they had the level designer tool finished early, so what have the level designers even been doing for 9 years ? Also why didn't they just put 1 intern to do quest, it's not like the quests are super complicated so pretty much every semi-capable person should've been able to to create them. I mean just look at the gang mechanics they showed us what 3-4 years ago? They're still not finished, so whatever bugs/problems there was with this, they couldn't fix in 3-4 years... I don't even know what to say really...
But again this isn't even the worst, Bannerlord has sold like it was an AAA game and then we get teased with a Kingdom creation button like it's some huge achievement by them to add this... There's no way in 9 months we'll have something resembling what the full release of Bannerlord should be.
I mean why aren't all scenes even done yet ? Surely they had the level designer tool finished early, so what have the level designers even been doing for 9 years ? Also why didn't they just put 1 intern to do quest, it's not like the quests are super complicated so pretty much every semi-capable person should've been able to to create them. I mean just look at the gang mechanics they showed us what 3-4 years ago? They're still not finished, so whatever bugs/problems there was with this, they couldn't fix in 3-4 years... I don't even know what to say really...
But again this isn't even the worst, Bannerlord has sold like it was an AAA game and then we get teased with a Kingdom creation button like it's some huge achievement by them to add this... There's no way in 9 months we'll have something resembling what the full release of Bannerlord should be.
GET 3 lines of code per week, join in the early access fun!
Yeah I agree here. The game is so dull atmosphere wise. Marriage is an absolute abomination, just not creative at all.
Yeah I agree here. The game is so dull atmosphere wise. Marriage is an absolute abomination, just not creative at all.
markp27
Sergeant
I am guessing neither of you are on the Total War forums, they often reply on Reddit rather than their official forum. The same seems to apply to TaleWorlds where they gave an update on what they are planning on Steam and not here on their official forum. It seems to be the way developers are operating nowadays.
Daft I know.
rektasaurus
Squire
Actually I think it’s so hard to come up with what they have so far I’m surprised that anyone is staggered by their much more fleshed our story than warband. I don’t remember there being any story at all except waking up in an alley or something like that then just plopped right into the world to do whatever
musashii89
Banned
The problem is there are too many people like WhiteEyedSh4rk who give them infinite patience. We need to stand up for how we want the gaming industry to look into the future. Im with you, EA is cancer. Show TW we expect better. #downvoteonsteam
Clearly this is your first time here, because if you werent in the dark you'd know this community has been VERY active giving suggestions and next to NOTHING has been done about it.
Also squad and EFT are still both buggy as ****, I would not use them as gold plated models.
Also bannerlord does randomly crash all the time so I wonder if you've got as much time up in game as you do in the forum?
Instead of telling people not to complain why dont you let others with intellect and passion push this forward and gtfo of the way of progress?
This game is garbage partly because EA is used by companies to exploit endless dev windows. We don't need to put up with this, make noise about how bad the game is widely. Make game designers fear bad EA releases. #downvoteonsteam
最后编辑:
musashii89
Banned
I see this reposted alot, Allow me to help by adding some other parts to the same quote
There you go, now you can develop your understanding of EA from TWs own advertisement
I was discussing Bannerlord's "EA" with somebody who prefers sci-fi. Got recommended Stellar Tactics (that also happens to be on Steam's sale right now). Checked it out:
1. One-man development "team"
2. Sandbox game
3. Clearly outlined roadmap
4. Detailed patch notes
5. Constant communication on the forum
Picked it up, noticed some grammatical errors during character creation. Posted a report. Five minutes later got an acknowledgement from the developer himself.
Watch and learn, Taleworlds. Now I got two genuine EA projects to lose myself in and forget about this clusterchuckle.
1. One-man development "team"
2. Sandbox game
3. Clearly outlined roadmap
4. Detailed patch notes
5. Constant communication on the forum
Picked it up, noticed some grammatical errors during character creation. Posted a report. Five minutes later got an acknowledgement from the developer himself.
Watch and learn, Taleworlds. Now I got two genuine EA projects to lose myself in and forget about this clusterchuckle.
Most EA games follow those simple rules, that´s why EA was "made".
TW only does 2. and 4.
Ok wanted to make a reply since a guy on Youtube wanted to quote my post and pick it apart without following the whole message. To sum this up, the entire post come down to this one sentence, "a little more communication isn't that hard to do" That is all I was saying in the post. But I guess he thinks since they are refractoring the code or whatever it is it is impossible to give an "eta" or update to how it is going, we are around 30% or 50% there and it might be a couple weeks more, wow that was hard.\
All I am saying is TW could give us a little more update on how things are going so we can plan accordingly for new playthrough to test the beta branches if they are released, I have once played an entire evening without knowing one had dropped and I play this to help test things and report problems so it would be nice to know.
Once a week blog, or once a week post on the state of the game, doesn't sound difficult or because it's early access as he says, expect nothing or don't buy it. Yes it's early access, but does early access mean your unable to communicate? really that's what you think
Yeah sorry guys little salty from the video
So any Youtubers please understand what is being said before talking about it or ask first and not assume. communication shouldn't be hard for anyone
As I have said many times, I love the game, I am happy with the money I spent, the devs are doing a good job, just add a little more communication is all, I don't think it is much to ask for.
sorry to rant all, I won't post here again and hopefully it dies out
So I guess I'll go record a playthrough for youtube to take up more of my time
Have fun all
All I am saying is TW could give us a little more update on how things are going so we can plan accordingly for new playthrough to test the beta branches if they are released, I have once played an entire evening without knowing one had dropped and I play this to help test things and report problems so it would be nice to know.
Once a week blog, or once a week post on the state of the game, doesn't sound difficult or because it's early access as he says, expect nothing or don't buy it. Yes it's early access, but does early access mean your unable to communicate? really that's what you think
Yeah sorry guys little salty from the video
So any Youtubers please understand what is being said before talking about it or ask first and not assume. communication shouldn't be hard for anyone
As I have said many times, I love the game, I am happy with the money I spent, the devs are doing a good job, just add a little more communication is all, I don't think it is much to ask for.
sorry to rant all, I won't post here again and hopefully it dies out
So I guess I'll go record a playthrough for youtube to take up more of my time
Have fun all
