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Pistols are bad for gameplay.

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Scarf Ace

Sergeant Knight at Arms
WBWF&SNWVCM&B
Why would you go even bother with trying to actually be sneaky, why would you try to kill with a melee weapon? Why bother actually playing like an assassin when you can just use a weapon that does loads of damage, reloads on the move and goes through shields?
Seriously, pistols are just moronic.
 

Shoep

Knight
M&BWBWF&SNWNW
I tend to agree, maybe increase reload times from pistols and dont give the pistol assasins any melee weapons? Its annoying enough for a guard to sprint after a assasin, even more if he's reloading a pistol on the go. Also, i encountered a assasin with a axe, pistol + Shield. Now i know he can have looted all that, but seriously?
 

That_one_guy

Regular
WBWF&S
Pistols really aren't that overpowered. They aren't very accurate, they take a while to reload, they give away your position, and the melee weapon that goes with it is absolutely terrible. Really the only nerf I'd want is to make assassins move much slower when reloading, therefore if you don't get the person on the first shot you're only option is run and hope to blend with the crowd to lose the guard.

On a related note, I really think weapons should just be made un-lootable, this would make it impossible to see the Axe+pistol+shield assassins that I have also seen (it also would cut down on accidental TKs, I've accidently killed multiple friendly assassins because they had a shield and I didn’t see their name in time).
 

Patta

Sergeant Knight at Arms
I think pistol is fair, because:
- Very inaccurate, you need to stand very close to the target (or have really much luck) to hit it
- Sound + Smoke when shooting, in next version sopund will maybe come from the place where you shot the pistol
- you are even slower then a guard while reloading
- it takes much time to reload and to aim


Also, I saw people using the meele assassins really rampage and get many kills in dm mode, more than any one who used pistol can get. Simply because you can kill one guy, but if there are others that saw you shooting, you are as good as dead.
 

RalliX

Count
M&BWBWF&SVC
Those things may be true Patta, but at times I've found pistols make the game feel more like a battle with bystanders, rather than cloak & dagger.
Sometimes on the TDM servers, a group of assassins will get a high-spot, and start shooting any guard they spot like a tower defense game. This even happened on the Assassins Vs. Assassins server once. A group of players who (probably)knew each other started laying down a withering hail of gunfire randomly on a crowd. It was a massacre, and nobody was insane enough to reveal themselves by approaching them.
 

hatimkh

Sergeant at Arms
That_one_guy said:
Pistols really aren't that overpowered. They aren't very accurate, they take a while to reload, they give away your position, and the melee weapon that goes with it is absolutely terrible.

Pistols actually don't give away your position, the sound only tells you that someone, somewhere fired a pistol, they could be anywhere and the smoke effect is very small and doesn't last long enough.
Playing as an assassin with pistol is so easy right now, just find a guard, shoot him when he has his back to you and then run away. Even if you're spotted you can run faster than the guards, just run away, change your clothes and reload after you've lost the guards.

There's no counter to this tactic, the only way you could fail is if you get very unlucky by running into another guard as you're trying to escape the ones you just attacked. As long as you spot all the guards in the immediate area and strike at the right moment, you'll get a cheap, easy kill. If you miss, no problem just run away with your higher athletics skill and try again.
 

Jossth

Recruit
As a new player I have found pistols by far the most overpowered assassin weapon. You physically cannot catch an assassin reloading a pistol and generally because of this they get 2/3 shots at you. The Bang is loud but I do not own surround sound (does warband even support it) so I cannot tell where it came from, the smoke lasts less than five seconds. I see alot of assassins not bothering with stealth, they just stand in a corner and pistol away. Finally I think the proof is in that I have never seen an  assassin with a crossbow, people just favour pistols too much.

I cant see how one would reload a pistol while moving anyway, pouring gunpowder down a barrel would be damn difficult while running away.
 

jbebes

Jossth said:
As a new player I have found pistols by far the most overpowered assassin weapon. You physically cannot catch an assassin reloading a pistol and generally because of this they get 2/3 shots at you.
Damn good reason why they have archer and crossbow guards


" The Bang is loud but I do not own surround sound (does warband even support it) so I cannot tell where it came from, the smoke lasts less than five seconds.

I see alot of assassins not bothering with stealth, they just stand in a corner and pistol away."
What you said there has just contradicted what you said in the 1st sentence.
 

hatimkh

Sergeant at Arms
jbebes said:
" The Bang is loud but I do not own surround sound (does warband even support it) so I cannot tell where it came from, the smoke lasts less than five seconds.

I see alot of assassins not bothering with stealth, they just stand in a corner and pistol away."
What you said there has just contradicted what you said in the 1st sentence.

Where's the contradiction? I don't see it.
 

Slytacular

Sergeant Knight
Pistols in this game are like the shotguns you use in shooter games. Yeah it gets annoying. Plus it doesn't really seem to fit with the time period either.
 

Patta

Sergeant Knight at Arms
Well, it for sure fits in very good.

For the sound: It simply comes from out of your own character atm, it is not made from the position of the shooter. But I will change that. The smoke lasts long enough to see who shot, I think. And as a last thing: in Assassins vs. Assassins, everyone reloading a pistol is slower than any other class. Against Guards, you are nearly as fast as an assassin reloading a pistol or even a bit faster. ANd the pistol take m uch longer to aim than, for example, the crossbow. I lost almost every duel with a crossbow guard when I was not attacking from stealth. Simply because the crossbow aims much faster.
 

jbebes

hatimkh said:
jbebes said:
" The Bang is loud but I do not own surround sound (does warband even support it) so I cannot tell where it came from, the smoke lasts less than five seconds.

I see alot of assassins not bothering with stealth, they just stand in a corner and pistol away."
What you said there has just contradicted what you said in the 1st sentence.

Where's the contradiction? I don't see it.
You contradicted yourself when you talked about how the smoke doesn't last long and the bang makes it so you dont know where i came from and then talked about a lot of assasins not using stealth. What you said in the 1st bit about the sound and smoke, makes it easier for the weapon to be used in stealth. If you do not know where the shot came from, the assasin who shot the gun is in "stealth mode" because it is hard for people to pick him out of the crowd.
 

RalliX

Count
M&BWBWF&SVC
I simply think the pistol's accuracy should be decreased around 5 points. Its accurate range can be amazing sometimes.
1/2 times I can hit a target fifty feet away.
 

Patta

Sergeant Knight at Arms
But on a distance higher than, let's say, 20 feet or even less, it is just totally luck. And we once had the pistol exactly 5 points less accurate, and it was useless then. You could stand directly behind someone and hit a townsman left or right from him...
 

hatimkh

Sergeant at Arms
jbebes said:
hatimkh said:
jbebes said:
" The Bang is loud but I do not own surround sound (does warband even support it) so I cannot tell where it came from, the smoke lasts less than five seconds.

I see alot of assassins not bothering with stealth, they just stand in a corner and pistol away."
What you said there has just contradicted what you said in the 1st sentence.

Where's the contradiction? I don't see it.
You contradicted yourself when you talked about how the smoke doesn't last long and the bang makes it so you dont know where i came from and then talked about a lot of assasins not using stealth. What you said in the 1st bit about the sound and smoke, makes it easier for the weapon to be used in stealth. If you do not know where the shot came from, the assasin who shot the gun is in "stealth mode" because it is hard for people to pick him out of the crowd.

I didn't make that post by the way, anyway the point he was making is that the assassin doesn't have to use stealth, the gun being stealthy is something else and I don't think it was intended to be a stealthy weapon. You try firing an old flintlock pistol in a town centre and people could hear where the gun was fired and there would be alot of smoke, much more than there is in this mod.
 

Patta

Sergeant Knight at Arms
It is not used very stealthy, yea. More to sneak up to someone who is alone and kill him quickly while he does not see who attacked. Wiht more than one enemy surrounding you, It should be a real problem to escape them all or even killing them all.
 

Slytacular

Sergeant Knight
Pistols are still pretty accurate to me (this coming from playing Mount&Musket). Also, they are way too cheap for the Townguard versus Assassins gametype. Anybody who knows how to use the pistol properly in this game, can make anybody want to rage quit.
 

Patta

Sergeant Knight at Arms
How funny that i never had this feeling when playing. I also never had any problems against people with pistols. I have even more problems against peole with knives.
 
Saying that pistols are accurate is just rudicolous. If it would be less accurate it would be a toy pistol none needed, which seems to be exactly what you want.
 

RalliX

Count
M&BWBWF&SVC
Alirhgt then, if making it less accurate would make it so useless, then how about increasing its main diadvantage: Reload time. These things took around ten seconds to reload, and that's if it was a flintlock, which it is in this case.
Increase the reload time to reflect this, and people will be happier when dealing with pistol users, because they will get one shot only.

Maybe even slow down how fast one can move while reloading.
 
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