perks changing combat damage (discussion)

should perks have non-logical damage modifiers?

  • yes, it creates more variety and discourages people from trading weapons

    Votes: 6 20.0%
  • no, combat should be logical without random damage modifiers

    Votes: 24 80.0%

  • Total voters
    30

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i am very against the new system where you get damage bonuses due to a perk selection (such as the hunter perk which gives you %50 more damage to horses for no logical reason)

i know this has been discussed before, but it has been awhile since this mechanic was introduced and i wanted to know how the community feels about them
 
Its just a lazy "fix" to spears not working and other combat changes. Everyone complained about the spear not stopping horses enough, and TW just said "lets slap this bad boy with extra damage" and now no one complains about it. It is a lazy fix regardless if you opinion on the matter. Lazy quick fixes only help the short term.
 

flashn00b

Sergeant at Arms
I feel like the damage bonuses due to perk selection could work in some contexts than others, with some outliers such as Sharpshooter w/ Hunter just being straight up bad, and the Farmer perk on Peasant Levy being so laughably bad that the +50% damage bonus to mounts means nothing to most players.

I think the best way to look at modifiers would be to go by a case by case basis
 

Hans 77

Knight at Arms
WBWF&SVC
The passive perks -especially those that give bonuses to damage output and movement speed, have no place in this game.

Warband had it right, where everything is visible, measured, and accounted for. You saw what equipment your opponent had, you knew what faction they were and what class they were playing, you knew what they were capable of. Not these hidden intangible buffs that can't be seen, scouted, or detected.

The correct blueprint has always been right there for you Taleworlds.
 

Danny5

Squire
The passive perks -especially those that give bonuses to damage output and movement speed, have no place in this game.

Warband had it right, where everything is visible, measured, and accounted for. You saw what equipment your opponent had, you knew what faction they were and what class they were playing, you knew what they were capable of. Not these hidden intangible buffs that can't be seen, scouted, or detected.

The correct blueprint has always been right there for you Taleworlds.
+1 better system and easy to follow
 

Terco_Viejo

Spanish Gifquisition
Grandmaster Knight
The passive perks -especially those that give bonuses to damage output and movement speed, have no place in this game.

Warband had it right, where everything is visible, measured, and accounted for. You saw what equipment your opponent had, you knew what faction they were and what class they were playing, you knew what they were capable of. Not these hidden intangible buffs that can't be seen, scouted, or detected.

The correct blueprint has always been right there for you Taleworlds.
☝️ This, over and over again. Written in fire and in stone.
 

Zarthas

Knight at Arms
Do you guys remember when we were told we were getting a third perk slot and then instead they dropped half of the interesting equipment perks and replaced them with invisible broken passive perks because the game doesn't already seem random enough?

Good old Bannerlord.
 

LioneI

Regular
WBVC
I didn't like it.
This game went from semi realistic to full arcade mode with new "dynamic" perks.
We had a somehow realistic combat system, based on pure physics. Now you can throw the realistic lebel to the trash because the new combat system also depends on your passif perks like 50% horse dmg etc..
 

Roy1012

Banned
Everyone knows the multiplayer system is garbage, hence why there are more playing 14 year old warband's than bannerlord's. Maybe reverting to the old system would be a good idea?
 

_COS_

Recruit
Everyone knows the multiplayer system is garbage, hence why there are more playing 14 year old warband's than bannerlord's. Maybe reverting to the old system would be a good idea?
Old system was just as bad, they introduced perks because it's easier to balance modes with perks. The real problem is the current class system and multiplayer will continue to be garbage with the class system.
 

Roy1012

Banned
Old system was just as bad, they introduced perks because it's easier to balance modes with perks. The real problem is the current class system and multiplayer will continue to be garbage with the class system.
Lol bot
 

flashn00b

Sergeant at Arms
Everyone knows the multiplayer system is garbage, hence why there are more playing 14 year old warband's than bannerlord's. Maybe reverting to the old system would be a good idea?
I think the best way to handle MP at this point is to hand out universal buffs to infantry, skirmishers, and cavalry. In Captain mode, those unit types are perfectly playable but in other modes, all-archer teams can render them unplayable.

After that, they can probably start removing the intentional imbalances one by one. Getting rid of the archer spam meta's probably the first place to start, cuz I think that's the main reason why people have ditched Bannerlord MP for Chivalry 2, myself included.

As for people playing Warband, it's apparent to me that while it has stood the test of time in terms of its multiplayer activity, I've also noticecd that people who'd otherwise play Warband in 2020 and 2021 have since moved onto other games. Makes it even more important for TaleWorlds to actually balance their game, even if it's at the expense of whatever vision that they had in mind for Bannerlord's multiplayer modes.
 
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Roy1012

Banned
I think the best way to handle MP at this point is to hand out universal buffs to infantry, skirmishers, and cavalry. In Captain mode, those unit types are perfectly playable but in other modes, all-archer teams can render them unplayable.

After that, they can probably start removing the intentional imbalances one by one. Getting rid of the archer spam meta's probably the first place to start, cuz I think that's the main reason why people have ditched Bannerlord MP for Chivalry 2, myself included.

As for people playing Warband, it's apparent to me that while it has stood the test of time in terms of its multiplayer activity, it's also apparent to me that people who'd otherwise play Warband in 2020 and 2021 have since moved onto other games. Makes it even more important for TaleWorlds to actually balance their game, even if it's at the expense of whatever vision that they had in mind for Bannerlord's multiplayer modes.
No, you can't fix something that's completely broken. Its not worth the time and effort.
 

Horked

If perks was removed, TW would have to provide another 5-10 MP servers and they cant afford that massive expense
 

flashn00b

Sergeant at Arms
On the topic of things not clearly visible to the player, Warband has a few things that more or less function similarly to Perks in Bannerlord.

To those unfamiliar, the in-game units of Warband Multiplayer use the same statistic system as they do in Singleplayer, though you can never actually access what stats they have in game. Rather, you had to rely on wiki posts from people who data-mined Warband to know exactly what stats units had relative to other units.

As for keeping perks in-game, i feel like it might be necessary to have some perks be put in place in order for certain units to not suck but I also know that the units that would benefit from having decent perks won't ever have decent perks just because their suckage is most likely an intentional design decision.
 

Yukmouth++

Squire
Problem is that you cannot know that you are charging someone with said perk. A cav player needs to know who to avoid in skirmish
 

LANDALORE

Sergeant
M&BWBWF&SNWVC
Problem is that you cannot know that you are charging someone with said perk. A cav player needs to know who to avoid in skirmish
Avoid the guy with the spear, also cav breaker makes the spear longer if the class (say khuzait inf) has a default spear. Apart from cav breaker and looter the other perks arnt very noticeable as far as game impact.
 
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