Patch Notes e1.0.7

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Wyzilla said:
How do you know what is good for our gameplay? I'm fairly certain if you put this up to poll the people would overwhelming vote in favor of being able to swim in gold from martial feats (y'know, a perfectly realistic aspect of war and the fuel for so called "plunder economies" vs being broke most of the game and barely squeaking by with finances at times. Especially with horses, that's just how the game works.
Click to expand...

If not in that post, in the next one he specifies it's a temporary fix because when lords take each other out they also plunder over 10k, breaking the economy AND favouring the snowballing
 
Is there a multiplayer team? Mp has hardly been touched, need servers, maps and modes asap its dieing already.
 
Dang u guys are rolling for realzies lol love the effort and progress.
Gives me no chance to regret buying another early access game after swearing I wouldn't since starbound...
But then again, starbound was a better game before 1.0 without all the story stuff they added.
 
MountainBladesMan said:
So reduce the money you get from caravans, fiefs, and workshops?

Perhaps, but I'd rather see town upgrades that cost upwards of 50k. Perhaps even upwards of 100k. It would be better for the game if the devs created something for us to do with all the money rather than just nerfing it.

Either way, equipment needs to be a lot cheaper. They're basically vanity items in the grand scheme of things. A player's personal input on combat is negligible to the outcome in all but the smallest battles.

And if you nerf equipment prices you also nerf battle-loot, which is a much bigger contributor to all the late-game wealth players have than enterprises. It'll balance eachother out.
Click to expand...

I aggre with this guy +1
 

Hello Dev, thanks for joining us. From what I have seen from spending the past several days perusing the boards here and elsewhere, I've come up with something I think this community would be very appreciative if you would do us the favor of presenting it to your fellows in whichever manner you feel would be the most respectful and effective.

I think I can speak for all of us here when I say we are very excited about this game. Are, not were. Just about everyone, frustrations aside, is almost giddy at the potential in front of us. Thank you for bringing all this hard work to us and sharing in our passion. In line with that, we are all very appreciative, even if a little concerned, that not only are we getting daily patches but are getting them despite several countries being shut down due to the plague. The respect I mentioned above is important. We're all a team here, between the devs and the EA players, and I sure as **** am not going to work in this apocalypse so I want to be sure that all of you at TW feel the palpable love we have for ya'll for doing this. Take care of yourselves. Warm liquids, stay inside, etc.

So on to the business.

At this stage of development and in accordance with what we can gather about the development plan in general, I think it's most suitable that you get an update from our end in that is coherent and as concise as my long winded nature allows me to be. Not exhaustive. There are specific threads dedicated to compiling all known bugs and such. What I aim to do here is to provide a sort of clarification and vision from the experience side of this development process. To that end, I have settled on a list form. It will be ranked and while my own experience obviously plays a role, I'm weighting community opinion heavily. This, it turns out, is not hard, because we have good little community here where there's a clear majority of preference, concern and focus. I will attempt to leave the solutions part open ended where I can. We all trust TW staff and their ability to find solutions that will work, given their experience and exposure to the inner workings of the code that we don't have, for the most part.

1. Unit fixes.

Number 1 and number 2 on the list are barely separable but the main reason unit fixes comes first is that I think number 2 is more easily fixed via modding. Unit fixes are tricky for the modders. Sometimes, like when a unit has the right weapon but not the right skill, it's a simple fix and easily updatable (for modders AND users). Other times, however, the weapon is completely missing (Vlandian Crossbow unit) or they have an illogical weapon choice (Battanian Falxman does not use a Falx) and these fixes are not so easy as the game overrides the normal method. There's more to it but this is something we'll need you to fix. There's a disturbingly large roster of necessary unit tweaks. Updating with a fix to this unit or that unit is not enough. There needs to be a thorough combing of every unit in the game and this needs to be top priority. Some troop rosters are a complete mess.

2. Snowballing/late game curve.

These are easier for the modding community to fix but it's still precarious and the fix often feels more like a work around than an actual solution. I've noted that you've acknowledged this needs to be more of a priority and will be in next few patches and that's awesome and we really appreciate you listening. However, this may be the real reason why so many are upset about the tournament changes. If it were just kingdoms snowballing, it wouldn't be that bad. If it were just that leveling progression for your character was unbelievably slow, again not that bad, but we have both. The logic behind the changes to tournament xp seems sounds, but to be honest there is a lot more work that needs to go into tournaments and the community is less worried about new features being added or revamping minigames and are more concerned with the snowballing issue, both as it's own issue and because it directly effects what tournaments add to the game. I don't need to go into the whole thing though, everybody already knows. So the takeaway here is that this needs to move way up in the queue. This issue will probably be addressed before issue #1, but one of the reasons I made unit fixes number one is that even when the issues of economy, diplomacy, etc are fixed and snowballing from that is no longer, there will still be a snowballing element in some games because a 500 unit army vs a 500 unit army will often be a big mismatch due solely bad stats or incorrect weapon usage and the like. And modders won't have a good way to fix that. So even if #2 gets fixed first, I cannot stress the importance of unit fixes to this community enough. Either way #2 and #1 being fixed will open this EA development up for us in a HUGE way. Which leads us to #3.

3. Perk fixes
Now, it's one thing to have some bugs in perks and such, but, for instance, it's a little too over the top that there seems to be no effects to any of the perks in the Steward skill. None. And the Steward skill is really important to the testing of the game overall. Still, key perks across the board are unusable so don't misunderstand my Steward example. Things like Bow skills. They need to be activated and given flesh. It doesn't matter what you do to them, modders can easily enough modify enabled and working perks, but fixing broken ones or creating new ones from scratch because they don't have code behind them is much more difficult. Perk fixes are critical for us to be able to assess balance and to perceive where new features are needed or where overhauls of existing features are needed as we move forward through this EA dev process. So this patch method where one perk is fixed every couple of patches is a bit counter-active to our ability to contribute to this process.

Not exhaustive, obviously. Plenty of people have valid concerns in addition to these. The reason I've aggregated these 3 main issues is that not only do they seem on average to be the most pressing issues to the community, they also are, as I said, a critical part of how we will be able to address the other concerns that we have. For instance, it seems to many, and very much correctly, confusing that focus was giving to tournament balance at this point in time when so many combat perks aren't working and leveling up skills in general is problematic. How can you say that tournaments are balanced, or even that they are better balanced than they were before, when the environment they are situated in is unbalanced, you know?

Any way.

Keep in mind that we aren't privy to the conversations devs have between themselves. It's left up to us to assume. I say that because perhaps this makes some eyes roll because this is something you guys have already talked about, I don't know. Still, I promise, hit these three bullets and not only will you have a very happy EA testing group, but we also will be fundamentally empowered to contribute further. Let us help you with the priority, here. This is a big project and while we think there needs to be some adjustments to the immediate game plan, I think I am speaking for most of the community when I say that no one here is judgmental or angry about mistakes like this. That's what we're here for. We want to be here for you guys so much that a record shattering number of people bought into the EA, a good deal of us with the intention to go beyond just financially supporting development and to contribute whatever we can to the development process itself. And honestly ya'll are doing great. In the scheme of things, even as important as we believe this moment to be, what we're discussing is a minor course correction and that's a testament to TW's staff.

I hope you all stay safe. We love and appreciate ya'll, always.

Penitent Dynamo
 
Last edited:
MountainBladesMan said:
And if you nerf equipment prices you also nerf battle-loot, which is a much bigger contributor to all the late-game wealth players have than enterprises. It'll balance eachother out.
Click to expand...


Hmm i wouldn't agree with that. I have 3 caravans and 2 enterprises that can fund my 120 too tier vladian units and still gives me profit. So any loot is just additional money that I don't really need.

On the other hand whole economy balance needs some work cause supply and demand mechanics don't work properly and for example city like sargoth buys clay for good price cause they have pottery workshop but they aren't producing any pottery out of it and it's a lot more expensive than in Praven and it's strange cause Praven is not producing pottery.
 
Why were the tournament bets nerfed? If anything they needed a buff. If you bet the max in all the rounds, you would make a maximum net profit of about 700 gold IIRC before the patch. Not even worth the time and risk except for very early game. Now it's even less.
 
Has anyone seen the armors that were supposed to be "fixed" a couple patches ago? I do not see good armor for vlandia or battania such as fiann or Sgt armor. Even knight armor not available.
 
SpectreSC said:
They already fixed that, maybe you just haven't noticed.

As far as XP balance in arena and tournaments, I HOPE they did nerf them somewhat. It was far too high to begin with and it essentially was an exploitable method of power-leveling your character early game and avoiding the dangers outside of town until you were already far better than the enemy. XP in Arena and Tournaments is a GOOD thing but too much of it is a BAD thing.

Good patch TW!
Click to expand...
They never fixed the snowballing... they merely delayed it. I'm hoping this rumoured 1.1.0 update has a more permanent "fix"
 
Penitent Dynamo said:
Hello Dev, thanks for joining us. From what I have seen from spending the past several days perusing the boards here and elsewhere, I've come up with something I think this community would be very appreciative if you would do us the favor of presenting it to your fellows in whichever manner you feel would be the most respectful and effective.

I think I can speak for all of us here when I say we are very excited about this game. Are, not were. Just about everyone, frustrations aside, is almost giddy at the potential in front of us. Thank you for bringing all this hard work to us and sharing in our passion. In line with that, we are all very appreciative, even if a little concerned, that not only are we getting daily patches but are getting them despite several countries being shut down due to the plague. The respect I mentioned above is important. We're all a team here, between the dev's and the EA players, and I sure as **** am not going to work in this apocalypse so I want to be sure that all of you at TW feel the palpable love we have for ya'll for doing this. Take care of yourselves. Warm liquids, stay inside, etc.

So on to the business.

At this stage of development and in accordance with what we can gather about the development plan in general, I think it's most suitable that you get an update from our end in that is coherent and as concise as concise as my long winded nature allows me to be. Not exhaustive. There are specific threads dedicated to compiling all known bugs and such. What I aim to do here is to provide a sort of clarification and vision from the experience side of this development process. To that end, I have settled on a list form. It will be ranked and while my own experience obviously plays a role, I'm weighting community opinion heavily. This, it turns out, is not hard, because we have good little community here where there's a clear majority of preference, concern and focus. I will attempt to leave the solutions part open ended where I can. We all trust TW staff and their ability to find solutions that will work, given their experience and exposure to the inner workings of the code that we don't have, for the most part.

1. Unit fixes.

Number 1 and number 2 on the list are barely separable but the main reason unit fixes comes first is that I think number 2 is more easily fixed via modding. Unit fixes are tricky for the modders. Sometimes, like when a unit has the right weapon but not the right skill, it's a simple fix and easily updatable (for modders AND users). Other times, however, the weapon is completely missing (Vlandian Crossbow unit) or they have an illogical weapon choice (Battanian Falxman does not use a Falx) and these fixes are not so easy as the game overrides the normal method. There's more to it but this is something we'll need you to fix. There's a disturbingly large roster of necessary unit tweaks. Updating with a fix to this unit or that unit is not enough. There needs to be a thorough combing of every unit in the game and this needs to be top priority. Some troop rosters are a complete mess.

2. Snowballing/late game curve.

These are easier for the modding community to fix but it's still precarious and the fix often feels more like a work around than an actual solution. I've noted that you've acknowledged this needs to be more of a priority and will be in next few patches and that's awesome and we really appreciate you listening. However, this may be the real reason why so many are upset about the tournament changes. If it were just kingdoms snowballing, it wouldn't be that bad. If it were just that leveling progression for your character was unbelievably slow, again not that bad, but we have both. The logic behind the changes to tournament xp are logical but to be honest there is a lot more work that needs to go into tournaments and the community is less worried about new features being added or revamping minigames and are more concerned with the snowballing issue, both as it's own issue and because it directly effects what tournaments add to the game. I don't need to go into the whole thing though, everybody already knows. So the takeaway here is that this needs to move way up in the queue. This issue will probably be addressed before issue #1, but one of the reasons I made unit fixes number one is that even when the issues of economy, diplomacy, etc are fixed and snowballing from that is no longer, there will still be a snowballing element in some games because a 500 unit army vs a 500 unit army will often be a big mismatch due solely bad stats or incorrect weapon usage and the like. And modders won't have a good way to fix that. So even if #2 gets fixed first, I cannot stress the importance of unit fixes to this community. Either way #2 and #1 being fixed will open this EA development up for us in a HUGE way. Which leads us to #3.

3. Perk fixes
Now, it's one thing to have some bugs in perks and such, but, for instance, it's a little too over the top that there seems to be no effects to any of the perks in the Steward skill. None. And the Steward skill is really important to the testing of the game overall. Still, key perks across the board are unusable so don't misunderstand my Steward example. Things like Bow skills. They need to be activated and given flesh. It doesn't matter what you do to them, modders can easily enough modify enabled and working perks, but fixing broken ones or creating new ones from scratch because they don't have code behind them is much more difficult. Perk fixes are critical for us to be able to assess balance and to perceive where new features are needed or where overhauls of existing features are needed as we move forward through this EA dev process. So this patch method where one perk is fixed every couple of patches is a bit counter-active to our ability to contribute to this process.

Not exhaustive, obviously. Plenty of people have valid concerns in addition to these. The reason I've aggregated these 3 main issues is that not only do they seem on average to be the most pressing issues to the community, they also are, as I said, a critical part of how we will be able to address the other concerns that we have. For instance, it seems to many, and very much correctly, confusing that focus was giving to tournament balance at this point in time when so many combat perks aren't working and leveling up skills in general is problematic. How can you say that tournaments are balanced or even that they are better balanced than they were before when the environment they are situated in is unbalanced, you know?

Any way.

Keep in mind that we aren't privy to the conversations devs have between themselves. It's left up to us to assume. I say that because perhaps this makes some eyes roll because this is something you guys have already talked about, I don't know. Still, I promise, hit these three bullets and not only will you have a very happy EA testing group, but we also will be fundamentally empowered to contribute further. Let us help you with the priority, here. This is a big project and while we think there needs to be some adjustments to the immediate game plan, I think I am speaking for most of the community when I say that no one here is judgmental or angry about mistakes like this. That's what we're here for. We want to be here for you guys so much that a record shattering number of people bought into the EA, a good deal of us with the intention to go beyond just financially supporting development and to contribute whatever we can to the development process itself. And honestly ya'll are doing great. In the scheme of things, even as important as we believe this moment to be, what we're discussing is a minor course correction and that's a testament to TW's staff.

I hope you all stay safe. We love and appreciate ya'll, always.

Penitent Dynamo
Click to expand...
Totally agree
 
jipped said:
Has anyone seen the armors that were supposed to be "fixed" a couple patches ago? I do not see good armor for vlandia or battania such as fiann or Sgt armor. Even knight armor not available.
Click to expand...

Nope, the shops are still selling the same old junk as always. If they fixed it, then I haven't seen the evidence so far.
 
Late game armor or any kind of heavy armor do not appear in the stores. I am still waiting for a fix for this. Is it related to the economy system? Do towns need materials and workshops to produce heavy armor? I am filthy rich in the game but can't find anything.
 
Pejot said:
Hmm i wouldn't agree with that. I have 3 caravans and 2 enterprises that can fund my 120 too tier vladian units and still gives me profit. So any loot is just additional money that I don't really need.

On the other hand whole economy balance needs some work cause supply and demand mechanics don't work properly and for example city like sargoth buys clay for good price cause they have pottery workshop but they aren't producing any pottery out of it and it's a lot more expensive than in Praven and it's strange cause Praven is not producing pottery.
Click to expand...
Your enterprises are what allow you to break even and make a little profit when running around with a party. But the war loot is what really puts you over the edge into absurd wealth in my experience. After a standard fight with a lord I can make around 10k off of prisoners and items I resold whereas with enterprises set up (and no feifs) I might make 300-500 or so denars after wages. Which is very good but still nowhere near as profitable as loot.
 
mexxico said:
Snowballing issues :
Currently this problem is in better point compared to first release and we did not stop working on this. We will continue working on this issue. When one kingdom get 35%+ of lands other kingdoms will be more cautious aganist this kingdom and they will try to stop them before things get worse for them. However this feature is not implemented yet and will be implemented in next patches. Also minor factions will be paid more by losing kingdoms and they will choose these weak kingdoms to get better payment per influence. When these things are implemented we will be in better point.
Click to expand...

Thanks for this, these things will probably improve a lot the game. Plus, having a good implemented rebelion system will be also something crusial to stop kingdoms getting over all the map. As long as a kingdom gets bigger, It should be more vulnerable to rebelions.

On the other hand, you could also implement things like not aggression pact and defensive pacts between factions, while making factions a bit less aggressive and less likely to be constantly at war against other ones. Also, you could program the AI to try to get peace if one kingdom is involved in multiple wars.
 
Dabos37 said:
Thanks for this, these things will probably improve a lot the game. Plus, having a good implemented rebelion system will be also something crusial to stop kingdoms getting over all the map. As long as a kingdom gets bigger, It should be more vulnerable to rebelions.

On the other hand, you could also implement things like not aggression pact and defensive pacts between factions, while making factions a bit less aggressive and less likely to be constantly at war against other ones. Also, you could program the AI to try to get peace if one kingdom is involved in multiple wars.
Click to expand...

There's a mod for this already (rebellions)...lol.
 
Still a bad game with a lot of problems, errors and omissions! The balance in the game is bad, the optimization is terrible (the game is freezed on any settings) Many things are annoying! For example, the inability to select units before attacking the bandit hideouts. They have been making the game for eight years, now they will be releasing bugfixes for another five years.
 
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