On Rebellions

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Apocal

Grandmaster Knight
We destroy rebel clans if their leader dies. This is only the case for rebel clans (i.e. the 30 day period is not yet expired)
I'm dropping a bug report right now, but just as a heads-up, I'm pretty sure this applies to minor factions as well. The leader of the Jawwal (minor faction mercs vs. Aserai) died of old age and his entire clan poofed as well.
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I think the pacing of rebellions in 1.6 is really good. They aren't going off super early, but once past day 100 they seem to be more common. This is good as it gives time for the player to build up thier recourses to better set up to stabilize the rebel towns if they choose to take them. I've also noticed the rebel clans get destroyed when I finish the siege too. I kinda miss them piling up to the sky in older version's but my caravans are safer.
 
I had the thought that one counter for players that go on an execution sprees to take over Calradia is for those players to experience and freakish amount of rebellions as a consequence for executing lords. The more the player executes and the closer the executions are to each other the more all of Calradia including lords, notables and villagers will hate them. The more executions will some how cause the rebels to be even more powerful than normal leading to them having more units in their armies with higher tier units. Maybe the rebels would fight each other too maybe not but the more the player acts unstable the more Calradia should be unstable to nerf such gameplay. I'm going to post this in suggestions, hopefully you moderators don't have a problem with it.
 

iloveubaby

Recruit
Good day!

I ask for some advice regarding a situtation with self-supporting rebellion due to raided villages.

It is fairly early in the campaign (day 190), I got my first city after retaking it from rebels. All of its villages are destroyed, therefore the city is constantly starving, if I supply it with food myself, caravans buy it in no time. This and the fact my lord is of different culture (-3 loyalty) induces steep dive in loyalty. Building and projects are of zero effect. The city rebels within a week or two, no matter how hard I try to prevent it by appointing proper governors (+1 is just not enough) and other measures recommended here.

If then I try to retake it from rebellion, the story repeats itself, but even quicker. Other lords of my faction just don't let villages to repair.

It is the thing not only with my city, but with several others of other factions: Lageta, Epicrotea - they are constantly taken by some faction, get readed, then rebel. It might have something to do with the fact the campaign was started like a year ago. Is there anything I can do to repair the situation? Rebellions happen so quickly.
 
Good day!

I ask for some advice regarding a situtation with self-supporting rebellion due to raided villages.

It is fairly early in the campaign (day 190), I got my first city after retaking it from rebels. All of its villages are destroyed, therefore the city is constantly starving, if I supply it with food myself, caravans buy it in no time. This and the fact my lord is of different culture (-3 loyalty) induces steep dive in loyalty. Building and projects are of zero effect. The city rebels within a week or two, no matter how hard I try to prevent it by appointing proper governors (+1 is just not enough) and other measures recommended here.

If then I try to retake it from rebellion, the story repeats itself, but even quicker. Other lords of my faction just don't let villages to repair.

It is the thing not only with my city, but with several others of other factions: Lageta, Epicrotea - they are constantly taken by some faction, get readed, then rebel. It might have something to do with the fact the campaign was started like a year ago. Is there anything I can do to repair the situation? Rebellions happen so quickly.
Try dumping food especially grain into any villages that trade with this town. Additionally dump grain into town itself just in case caravans buy up everything. Garrison eat up a lot of food so keep that in mind so be careful with garrisons eating food.
 

Bannerman Man

C# Sleuth
Knight
I ask for some advice regarding a situtation with self-supporting rebellion due to raided villages.
So firstly, there are two circumstances where a rebellion cannot happen regardless of loyalty, which you can use to buy you time to get out of the danger zone (which is < 25 loyalty). Those are:
  • When the player is physically present in a town, the town cannot rebel no matter what the value of loyalty is. Sitting and waiting in a town under 25 loyalty will prevent them from rebelling for however long you remain there, which can give your villages time to recover from a raid.
  • If the strength of the town's militia is not 1.4x higher than the strength of its garrison + any allied parties waiting in town, then a town cannot rebel no matter what the value of loyalty is. This means installing a strong garrison can prevent a rebellion and will allow you to leave the town without fear of it rebelling. Keep an eye on the militia growth number though, as it can increase rapidly in certain situations when loyalty is very low.
Now some general advice:
  • Insert a governor with a culture that matches the town's culture for the all important +1 bonus to loyalty. The +1 loyalty alone will counteract the effect of the "Owner Culture" penalty enough that a town's loyalty can't fall below 25 without additional loyalty penalties present (loyalty will stabilize at 30). Try to find a governor with extra loyalty or security perks if possible (you can use bannerlordperks.com and type "loyalty" or "security" into the filter box to easily find which perks boost each stat).
  • If loyalty is below 25, all construction will cease, meaning using the "Festival and Games" daily default won't increase loyalty. If you can get loyalty over 25, put 500 gold into the construction reserves for a substantial boost to the power of Festival and Games. Daily defaults don't consume the gold from the reserves, so 500 gold is enough to fully boost them indefinitely. Once loyalty is high enough, you can transition to building Orchards or Fairgrounds to help you keep loyalty higher permanently.
  • Check the town's bound villages to see if any of them are close to crossing either 200 or 600 hearths. Those are the thresholds for villages to increase goods production and contribute higher passive food income to their bound towns. If any villages are close to those thresholds, you can use the Irrigation daily default to push them over the line.
  • Solve any unresolved issues (notable quests) in the town or its bound villages that are affecting loyalty or security and destroy any hideout that is affecting security. Getting rid of their associated penalties is important, and many of the quests provide instant boosts to security or loyalty as rewards. Issues also have expiration dates and will automatically go away on their own after roughly 15-30 days if you haven't already accepted the quest.
  • Having a strong garrison will also boost security which in turn will boost loyalty. If you are going to be waiting in town anyway, temporarily adding your party to the garrison will provide an extra boost to the security growth of your town, which will in turn boost loyalty growth. Before adding them, you will want to consider if adding them will cause the town to start starving when they were not already, or if it will cause more garrison troops to starve out per day.
Not especially insightful advice, I know, but every bit helps.
 

Antaeus

Sergeant
Try dumping food especially grain into any villages that trade with this town. Additionally dump grain into town itself just in case caravans buy up everything. Garrison eat up a lot of food so keep that in mind so be careful with garrisons eating food.

It's helpful if the city is yours, to keep substantial reserves of food locally for these kinds of situations. Go to somewhere friendly with cheap grain and throw down 10k on it. Then dump it in your city stash for future use, or to hold on hand in case some giant army comes by and empties the town's reserve.

I also do the same with looters, livestock and tools in case those quests are favoured by your city - solving supply quests in your villages really helps.
 

Doofus

Veteran
Regarding this, I like the rebellions as they add a bit of interest, but.....

Right now I'm stuck. I head the Aserai. I keep taking control Makeb & Baltahkand. They keep going to rebellion within 5-10 days. Why? Because the only lords I have a choice to give them to are either Empire or Aserai. The Khuzaits are basically wiped out and their lords are spread all over the other civilizations. We never got any because, of course, being that I'm always at war and usually leading an army I didn't get the chance to recruit any. When you lead an army you generally only engage armies and settlements. Lords in armies won't talk about joining you, so...yeah, no Khuzait lords. I could use a companion to take over one of those spots (I already control Odokh, Akkalat, & a couple of Khuzait castles, but it doesn't give me the option to give myself Maken & Baltahkhand.

Something needs to change. I'm tired of having to take those back all the time while also at war with Sturgia, the Northern Empire, & the Western Empire (For some reason, the Southern Empire that I've knocked down to just Vostrum seems content to still exist and no longer wars me). Oh, I'm also still at war with what's left of the Khuzaits from time to time, but since they hold nothing it hardly matters. The rebel groups are more challenging than them now.
 

iloveubaby

Recruit
So firstly, there are two circumstances where a rebellion cannot happen regardless of loyalty, which you can use to buy you time to get out of the danger zone (which is < 25 loyalty). Those are:
  • When the player is physically present in a town, the town cannot rebel no matter what the value of loyalty is. Sitting and waiting in a town under 25 loyalty will prevent them from rebelling for however long you remain there, which can give your villages time to recover from a raid.
  • If the strength of the town's militia is not 1.4x higher than the strength of its garrison + any allied parties waiting in town, then a town cannot rebel no matter what the value of loyalty is. This means installing a strong garrison can prevent a rebellion and will allow you to leave the town without fear of it rebelling. Keep an eye on the militia growth number though, as it can increase rapidly in certain situations when loyalty is very low.
Now some general advice:
  • Insert a governor with a culture that matches the town's culture for the all important +1 bonus to loyalty. The +1 loyalty alone will counteract the effect of the "Owner Culture" penalty enough that a town's loyalty can't fall below 25 without additional loyalty penalties present (loyalty will stabilize at 30). Try to find a governor with extra loyalty or security perks if possible (you can use bannerlordperks.com and type "loyalty" or "security" into the filter box to easily find which perks boost each stat).
  • If loyalty is below 25, all construction will cease, meaning using the "Festival and Games" daily default won't increase loyalty. If you can get loyalty over 25, put 500 gold into the construction reserves for a substantial boost to the power of Festival and Games. Daily defaults don't consume the gold from the reserves, so 500 gold is enough to fully boost them indefinitely. Once loyalty is high enough, you can transition to building Orchards or Fairgrounds to help you keep loyalty higher permanently.
  • Check the town's bound villages to see if any of them are close to crossing either 200 or 600 hearths. Those are the thresholds for villages to increase goods production and contribute higher passive food income to their bound towns. If any villages are close to those thresholds, you can use the Irrigation daily default to push them over the line.
  • Solve any unresolved issues (notable quests) in the town or its bound villages that are affecting loyalty or security and destroy any hideout that is affecting security. Getting rid of their associated penalties is important, and many of the quests provide instant boosts to security or loyalty as rewards. Issues also have expiration dates and will automatically go away on their own after roughly 15-30 days if you haven't already accepted the quest.
  • Having a strong garrison will also boost security which in turn will boost loyalty. If you are going to be waiting in town anyway, temporarily adding your party to the garrison will provide an extra boost to the security growth of your town, which will in turn boost loyalty growth. Before adding them, you will want to consider if adding them will cause the town to start starving when they were not already, or if it will cause more garrison troops to starve out per day.
Not especially insightful advice, I know, but every bit helps.
Thank you, dire anti-crisis measures finally helped me. I dumped loads of grain there, dumped all my troops plus some tavern guys into the garrison (the entire garrison was about 350, half of which are tier 3-4 troops), installed an empire governor, solved a city issue (once again villages were non-existant so had none) and other minot stuff. It costed me a lot (like -3K daily with 4 profitable workshops and a caravan), but smithing money helped a lot.

The thing is the AI can't do the same with its cities. Several big cities (like Saneopa, Lageta and others) keep rebelling just weeks after getting recaptured. The list of faction leaders now exceed 30 =) Is it normal?
 

Doofus

Veteran
Biggest thing I do that stops rebellions, particularly when first taking over a town, is install a governor of same culture, either family or companion. I always try to marry myself or family members (male) into different cultures than my own. Used to be I used companions for war parties. Now 3/4ths of them are governors. Incidentally, it'd be nice if Taleworlds would give you a way to keep female family members in your clan (such as paying a larger dowry or something). All my female family members are doomed to die as spinsters and/or become governors for life.
 

Bannerman Man

C# Sleuth
Knight
Thank you, dire anti-crisis measures finally helped me. I dumped loads of grain there, dumped all my troops plus some tavern guys into the garrison (the entire garrison was about 350, half of which are tier 3-4 troops), installed an empire governor, solved a city issue (once again villages were non-existant so had none) and other minot stuff. It costed me a lot (like -3K daily with 4 profitable workshops and a caravan), but smithing money helped a lot.
Glad you got it sorted out. Another thing you can do if you're part of a faction that I forgot to mention is to pass policies. There are several strong policies that give +Loyalty. The percentage support for policies by lords that the game presents can be misleading. If a policy has 0% support, that doesn't actually mean that all lords are going to vote against it, it just means that no lords will for it. Often times the lords won't vote at all in a policy decision, which means you can pass policies simply by being the only lord that votes. If you have a lot of influence to spare and you want to test the waters, you can put forth a vote just to see if anyone will even show up to vote it down.

The thing is the AI can't do the same with its cities. Several big cities (like Saneopa, Lageta and others) keep rebelling just weeks after getting recaptured.
Yeah there are some cities in the game get trapped in a cycle of rebellion because they sit at the frontlines of multiple factions and get raided, besieged, and pillaged repeatedly with little time to recover, which will all negatively impact loyalty. Since the AI don't have the same means to prevent this as the player, those towns will rebel pretty frequently. A certain amount of rebellions are good for the game, but it might be nice if they were spread out a little more evenly.

The list of faction leaders now exceed 30 =) Is it normal?
Many of those will be the leaders of kingdoms and minor factions, and the ones that are rebel leaders might be dead. If you toggle the "Dead" status filter in the encyclopedia, you will see which ones have been eliminated. I believe they only want a couple rebellions per year to happen, but I'm not entirely sure the exact rate they're shooting for.
 
Biggest thing I do that stops rebellions, particularly when first taking over a town, is install a governor of same culture, either family or companion. I always try to marry myself or family members (male) into different cultures than my own. Used to be I used companions for war parties. Now 3/4ths of them are governors. Incidentally, it'd be nice if Taleworlds would give you a way to keep female family members in your clan (such as paying a larger dowry or something). All my female family members are doomed to die as spinsters and/or become governors for life.
Marry heroes to other cultures are currently not possible, because of a bug all childs are from the mother culture.
You should wait until they have fixed this bug.

And yes, they should add a option for a matrilineal marriage for all female heroes, not only female clan leaders.
 

Doofus

Veteran
Emperor, I'm still able to marry my family members into other cultures, but it is a challenge. I usually get that message that says something like, 'That won't work for me'. But occasionally I can get them to agree. I've tried to figure out why that is. Sometimes I think your child that just came of age can only be married after a year or two of being of age. Sometimes I think it has to do with a difference in the age of the candidate you are trying to get them to marry. Sometimes I think it has to do with your relationship with the other clan. I haven't figured it out, but I can still get them married to wives of other factions if I work at it.
 

Doofus

Veteran
Realistically, I don't think changing cultures makes sense. I think what would make more sense would be accepting the governor after a certain amount of time if things are going well for the town/castle. As an example, after you have held a town after 1 year and security & things are going well, either remove the -3 penalty for culture or downgrade it to a -2...then after another year, downgrade to -1, after the 3rd year remove the penalty entirely. It makes sense that people would start out biased against a leader because of cultural differences, but the longer things go well the more that bias drops away.
 
Realistically, I don't think changing cultures makes sense. I think what would make more sense would be accepting the governor after a certain amount of time if things are going well for the town/castle. As an example, after you have held a town after 1 year and security & things are going well, either remove the -3 penalty for culture or downgrade it to a -2...then after another year, downgrade to -1, after the 3rd year remove the penalty entirely. It makes sense that people would start out biased against a leader because of cultural differences, but the longer things go well the more that bias drops away.
I think that could be a good idea too tbh.

I was coming at it from the sake that it was not uncommon in medieval warfare for an entire population to be killed off or forced to migrate somewhere else, for the very sake of prevent revolts. Historical precedence aside, with the Devastate option, that could be a good channel to force a population change maybe with an extra timer. It would be a short-term pain but a long-term benefit to have the same-culture bonuses and with a good governor you can counteract the negative effects rather quickly. But just my opinion, I find trouble always finding matching culture governors with good stats.
 

Doofus

Veteran
@Emperor1997 I just tried marrying my clan members to members of Leonipardes clan. My 18 year old son could not be married to their 25 year old daughter. My 20 year old daughter could not be married to their 27 year old son. But my 25 year old daughter could be married to the same 27 year old son. Makes me think it could be an age thing (Either child has to be over a certain age to be considered or the ages have to be within a certain number of years of each other for marriage).
 
@Emperor1997 I just tried marrying my clan members to members of Leonipardes clan. My 18 year old son could not be married to their 25 year old daughter. My 20 year old daughter could not be married to their 27 year old son. But my 25 year old daughter could be married to the same 27 year old son. Makes me think it could be an age thing (Either child has to be over a certain age to be considered or the ages have to be within a certain number of years of each other for marriage).
This is because of a bug who is it fixed in 1.6.1.
Before 1.6.1 you must select the oldest unmarried clan member.
But now you can select every clan member you want to have a marriage.
 

Rush09

Regular
I do agree with the sentiment regarding the current -3 settlement loyalty penalty is too severe.

Being a returning player from 1.1.2 playing in 1.6.1, the rebellions are a great addition to the game. I would argue though that the -3 settlement loyalty penalty from being from another culture is too much. Apart from empire factions conquering other empire towns, the AI can't hold 9/10 of towns they conquer outside of their culture. This makes certain towns to be constantly targeted by warring factions due to constant rebellion/conquer cycle.

Even I felt that having the -3 was too much, I was given an underdeveloped Rovalt in a campaign I was playing as a Battanian and the micromanagement I had to do to keep it from rebelling was crazy. My faction had an additional -1 penalty to help too.
 
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