On Rebellions

Users who are viewing this thread

SadShogun

A Furtherer of the Calradic Cause
Developer
Greetings Warriors of Calradia.

In this post, we explain our new feature and provide a follow-up to our previous post about Loyalty and Security.
Rebellions are instantaneous map events that occur after a build-up of resentment to the current owner of the settlement.
The purpose is to punish poor management and challenge over-expansive conquest and simulate the realities of governing settlements.

The rebellion based on the following assumptions.
  • Garrisons are always loyal to the settlement owner.
  • The militia on the other hand can defect as they represent the will of the people. The militia is the main force of the rebellion

Conditions
Currently, the rebellions only occur in towns and checks for the following conditions:
  • Loyalty of the town is very low.
  • Strength of the militia is a lot higher than the strength of the garrison.
As the loyalty of the town drops below a threshold, the populace gets angry and starts to take up arms. When this happens the number of militia in the town starts to increase rapidly and as they see the owner as their tyrant they will not join to defend against sieges. (Thus, a player cannot exploit this to create a very large number of militias)
If the conditions are met, a rebellion is started with some chance. This has quite a lot of effects which we explain below.

Effects
When conditions hold and a rebellion starts few things happen in the town.

  • The owner of the settlement loses all control of the settlement.
  • The garrison is destroyed. Some of them end up in prisons and others are killed.
  • A portion of the militia is lost in the uprising and the rest is converted to the garrison.
  • A new rebel clan is created. This clan has newly generated members representing charismatic or influential people who lead the rebellion.
  • The new clan is immediately at war with the original settlement owner's faction.
  • The loyalty of the city will get a temporary boost.

Rebel Clan
The rebel clan is the new clan formed by the prominent figures of the rebellion. While they take over the settlement's control, they have not established their legitimacy at this point.
A rebel clan is very similar to a normal kingdom clan with few key differences.
  • They cannot join factions.
  • They cannot marry other clans.
  • If they lose their original settlement, they cease to spawn and eventually destroyed.
  • If they manage to hold onto their settlement for some time, they will become a legitimate clan and can join, leave, marry, and perform other actions that a normal clan can do.

When rebel clans are created they start with a very low relationship with the faction they rebelled against and a very high relationship with their settlement culture and will probably defect to their original faction when they become normal clans after some time. Of course, it is not hardcoded and these clans (as any other) can be persuaded to join other factions. If the clan has rebelled against its own culture's faction then they will hate their own culture's faction(s)

Countering Rebellions
Rebellions is a future that would make large empires be wary of their over-expansive policies. Expanding very fast without keeping necessary garrisons until the land is healed can lead to rapid rebellions when conquering foreign lands. However, there are ways to counter rebellions. A town can be kept in check in many ways which we list a few below.
  • Appointing a culturally appropriate governor to reduce cultural penalties.
  • Resolving issues that have negative loyalty effects.
  • Improving permanent projects that increase loyalty gain.
  • Doing daily projects which would give loyalty boosts.
  • Defending villages and allowing them to heal would curb loyalty penalties from starvation.
  • Going after bandits and hideouts to increase security and loyalty.
  • Passing faction-wide policies that improve loyalty.
We believe rebellions introduce a new layer of depth to the simulation and make many other systems in the game matter more as policies, town projects gain new importance and also balance the steam-rolling factions quite a bit. As always we are awaiting your feedback, to further improve and balance rebellions.
Keep your subjects or happy or expect a rebellion soon!
 

Piconi

Fashionista
Section Moderator
M&BWBWF&SNWVC
If they manage to hold onto their settlement for some time, they will become a legitimate clan and can join, leave, marry, and perform other actions that a normal clan can do.
One question about this, do they become just a kingdomless clan, a minor faction that happen to hold a town, or a de facto new AI kingdom, as i've seen in the video that the rebel leader is called a "king"? So is there a possibility of them not joining any kingdom but staying independent forever, and even form a new AI kingdom with all the functuonalities of the starting ones, and even the player can join them as a vassal?
 

SadShogun

A Furtherer of the Calradic Cause
Developer
One question about this, do they become just a kingdomless clan, a minor faction that happen to hold a town, or a de facto new AI kingdom, as i've seen in the video that the rebel leader is called a "king"? So is there a possibility of them not joining any kingdom but staying independent forever, and even form a new AI kingdom with all the functuonalities of the starting ones, and even the player can join them as a vassal?
Currently, they do not form independent kingdoms but I believe this is something that can be investigated. This is not a hardcoded behavior though. The scoring algorithm always chooses to join a kingdom because it is always more advantageous to be a part of a kingdom than standing on your own against the world. While they're not part of a kingdom, they lack a lot of functionalities bestowed on kingdoms like policies and declaring wars.
 

Piconi

Fashionista
Section Moderator
M&BWBWF&SNWVC
Currently, they do not form independent kingdoms but I believe this is something that can be investigated. This is not a hardcoded behavior though. The scoring algorithm always chooses to join a kingdom because it is always more advantageous to be a part of a kingdom than standing on your own against the world. While they're not part of a kingdom, they lack a lot of functionalities bestowed on kingdoms like policies and declaring wars.
Ok, thanks for the clearing that out, i'm glad it's not hardcoded. As there will probably be instances where the rebels are of the same culture as the previous owner, having low relations with own culture, and being too far and isolated from any other faction, thus a low chance of joining other kingdoms, with the distance and culture differencies.

I think somewhere in this feature there is a gold mine of cool potential surprises, if done right.
 

Shun

Squire
WB
Ok, thanks for the clearing that out, i'm glad it's not hardcoded. As there will probably be instances where the rebels are of the same culture as the previous owner, having low relations with own culture, and being too far and isolated from any other faction, thus a low chance of joining other kingdoms, with the distance and culture differencies.

I think somewhere in this feature there is a gold mine of cool potential surprises, if done right.

I agree. Also if two rebellions would happen in adjacent towns of the same culture, they could join forces, etc.
 

danEN

Knight at Arms
WBM&BWF&SNWVC
Really like the depth behind the feature, although I feel we're missing out with rebel clans not creating new kingdoms, being a sandbox the idea of the extremely small chance to see a new faction rise up and become a power in the world would really add some needed immersion, uniqueness and unpredictability to every playthrough.

@SadShogun If you could speak to the bosses about the possibility of adding this, It really would crown this feature off as one of the best aspects of the game.

This is a great suggestion as well, would work well with them forming a new Kingdom.
I agree. Also if two rebellions would happen in adjacent towns of the same culture, they could join forces, etc.
 

Maneuverer

Regular
It would make sense the clan to dissolve and become a subject of voting should the rebelling clan join its starting faction for the nobles to aquire the fief like we already have in the game when a faction conquers/obtrains one.

Or there could be a possibility that the settlement would declare itself as a fief of its original owner (a noble who owned the settlement at the start of the campaign) if the lord's realationship would be in favour with the settlement notables.
 

vito397

Knight at Arms
WBWF&SNWVC
Really like the depth behind the feature, although I feel we're missing out with rebel clans not creating new kingdoms, being a sandbox the idea of the extremely small chance to see a new faction rise up and become a power in the world would really add some needed immersion, uniqueness and unpredictability to every playthrough.

@SadShogun If you could speak to the bosses about the possibility of adding this, It really would crown this feature off as one of the best aspects of the game.

I agree with this
 
Really like the depth behind the feature, although I feel we're missing out with rebel clans not creating new kingdoms, being a sandbox the idea of the extremely small chance to see a new faction rise up and become a power in the world would really add some needed immersion, uniqueness and unpredictability to every playthrough.

@SadShogun If you could speak to the bosses about the possibility of adding this, It really would crown this feature off as one of the best aspects of the game.

This is a great suggestion as well, would work well with them forming a new Kingdom.

Yep, agreed.
 
Its amazing!!! I have been playing for a few hours straight with a new save. First you see a red icon over the town that looks very ominous telling the player a rebellion is likely. It happened 3 times with the town of Lageta. Derthert took Lageta from the Western Empire then the 1st rebellion started. Derthert takes Lageta back from the 1st rebels. Derthert, then loses Lageta to Caladog. After Caladog's rule of Lageta, 2 seperate rebellions occur in Lageta and fail. (During Caladog's last seige of Lageta one of the Vlandian nobles was close to the seige as if she was watching and waiting to take it from him.) Each time there was a different 'Emperor' and each time the rebels lost Lageta only to be left to roam the map. So there are 3 Lageta Rebel factions with 3 monarches each and 3 seperate but identical listings in the encyclopedia using the same banner and colors. Onira seems to be next but the Khuzait ruler is hanging onto it.

My clan is tier 2 an all of this began around tier 1. There isn't much I can do with the rebels. I can't become their mercenary but it seems as though I can fight them and maybe execute them. There doesn't seem to be any quest to eliminate them either on the behest of their enemies. There aren't many dialogue options to interact with the rebels.

What happens if we kill rebels? Are there any penalty for executing them? Can the 3 different Lageta Rebel factions merge into one? Can rebel lords join the player faction?

Below are some screenshots.
 
Last edited:
Its amazing!!! I have been playing for a few hours straight with a new save. First you see a red icon over the town that looks very ominous telling the player a rebellion is likely. It happened 3 times with the town of Lageta. Derthert took Lageta from the Western Empire then the 1st rebellion started. Derthert takes Lageta back from the 1st rebels. Derthert, then loses Lageta to Caladog. After Caladog's rule of Lageta, 2 seperate rebellions occur in Lageta and fail. (During Caladog's last seige of Lageta one of the Vlandian nobles was close to the seige as if she was watching and waiting to take it from him.) Each time there was a different 'Emperor' and each time the rebels lost Lageta only to be left to roam the map. So there are 3 Lageta Rebel factions with 3 monarches each and 3 seperate but identical listings in the encyclopedia using the same banner and colors. Onira seems to be next but the Khuzait ruler is hanging onto it.

My clan is tier 2 an all of this began around tier 1. There isn't much I can do with the rebels. I can't become their mercenary but it seems as though I can fight them and maybe execute them. There doesn't seem to be any quest to eliminate them either on the behest of their enemies. There aren't many dialogue options to interact with the rebels.

What happens if we kill rebels? Are there any penalty for executing them? Can the 3 different Lageta Rebel factions merge into one? Can rebel lords join the player faction?

Below are some screenshots.

Looks like rebels need different names assigned in the scripts or we are going to have redundancy.
 

Worlok

Squire
I have checked few towns captured by Khuzaits in my new 1.5.6 campaign (Tyal, Sibir). They didn't seem to have troubles with security or loyality at all.
 

Old-Bull

Squire
Rebellions should provide a new option for kingdom creation. Now just wait until a rebellion happens, take that fief, and you can start a kingdom.
 
Top Bottom