B Musket Era [NW] Crimean War mod. (Need help with scripts)

[Ivkolya]

First message is already too old, and some day I'll change it properly. For now - I added all screenshots in the first message

Hi all, I'm making a mod about Crimean war.
Why this war? I think it is perfect for gameplay of most popular and my favorite modes of NW (i mean siege, battle and commander battle) - here are combined large battles in fields (like Alma or Balaclava) and siege (famous siege of Sevastopol). This war was one of the first to be documented extensively in written reports and photographs, so we have a lot of materials about this war.
I am a reenactor and took part in many reenactments about this war  in Crimea since 2005, so I have big interest in Crimean war and have some knoledge about it.

I have not decided yet, how many factions will be in mod:
Var. 1: two factions - Russian Empire and Allies (France, Britain and Turkey - so you can not play battle as example France vs. Britain, for this you have NW) with extra section for winter uniform and uniform of Alma battle (after that battle there were changes in uniform) and so we can achieve sameness in the uniform
Var. 2: four factions - Russians and Allies in winter and summer uniform
Var. 3: one faction for each nation.
I prefer first variant, but we'll see.

As for the difference in weapons - I think russians will be more skillfull in melee and maybe will have more HP. Besides, in russian army also were good rifles, but not so many. Also, difference in weapons between russian troops and french troops was also not so big,  french troops also had not so many rifles as british troops had (and if british and french troops will be in same faction - it will even the odds ).

Also I want to make some changes in artillery - es example make artillery crew with 3 bots (1 loads, 1 reloads and 1 shoots), make historical-correct artillery train with 6 horses in it and make cannons be able to move with hands on foot, but I know about module system almoust nothing, so now I don't know how to make it all 

Currently I have some problems with my videocard, so right now i can't work on mod, but it is perfect time to read more about Crimean war and Siege of Sevastopol. And also it is a good time to tell me suggestions and ideas for mod. Also I will apreciate any help, because there is a lot of work and one person will do it very long.

Also - maybe you know guys who worked on this mod http://www.fsegames.eu/forum/index.php?topic=3193.0 and maybe they can give me what they have already done to make the work easier?


Some screenshots (will post new ones on forum and add them here):

Uniforms:

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Российская Империя

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Other rank's helmet, Vladimir Infantry Regiment

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Officer's helmet, Moskow Dragoon Regiment

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Infantry

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Officer of Vladimir Infantry Regiment

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Borodino Infantry Regiment

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Susdal Infantry Regiment

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Sevsk Infantry Regiment

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4th Rifle Battalion

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Plastun of Black Sea Cossacks

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30th Naval Detachment

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Cavalry

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Kiev Hussars

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Ural Cossack

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Moskow Dragoon

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Le Second Empire Français

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Shako of 7th Line Regiment

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Infantry

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2nd regiment of grenadiers of foot of the Imperial Guard

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1st regiment of voligeurs of the Imperial Guard

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1st regiment of Foreign Legion

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1er bataillon de chasseurs à pied

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1er régiment de ligne (compagnie des fusiliers)

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7e régiment de ligne (compagnie des grenadiers)

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18e régiment de ligne (compagnie des voltigeurs)

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22nd light infantry regiment

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28th line infantry regiment, company of fusiliers (wearing "crimeenne")

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35th line infantry regiment, company of voltigeurs

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42nd line infantry regiment, company of voligeurs (wearing "crimeenne")

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57th line infantry regiment, company of grenadiers (wearing "crimeenne")

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74th line infantry regiment, company of grenadiers

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French Chasseurs d'Afrique

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British Empire

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Infantry

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1st (Grenadier) Regiment of Foot Guards

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Coldstream Guards

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Scots Fusilier Guards

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18th (Royal Irish) Regiment of Foot

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19th (Yorkshire) Regiment of Foot ("The Green Howards")

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23rd Regiment of Foot (Royal Welch Fusiliers)

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28th (North Gloucestershire) Regiment of Foot

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33rd (The Duke of Wellington’s) Regiment of Foot

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41st (Welch) Regiment of Foot

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42nd (Royal Highland) Regiment of Foot (Black Watch)

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49th (the Princess Charlotte of Wales or the Hartfordshire) Regiment of Foot

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57th (West Middlesex) Regiment of Foot ("The Die Hards")

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68th (Durham) Regiment of Foot at Inkerman

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93rd (Sutherland Highlanders) Regiment of Foot (The Thin Red Line)

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95th (Derbyshire) Regiment of Foot

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Rifle Brigade

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Cavalry

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2nd (Royal North British) Regiment of Dragoons (The Royal Scots Grey)

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5th (Princess Charlotte of Wales's) Dragoon Guards

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6th (Inniskilling) Dragoons

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4th (Queen's Own) Light Dragoons

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11th Hussars (Prince Albert's Own)

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17th Lancers (Duke of Cambridge's Own)

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In game:

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Buildings

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Tower of the Winds, Sevastopol

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Modmakers team:
Ivkolya
Conway
Mechanic00

If someone wants to help (especially with scripts, we have a lot of ideas) - we'll be glad to see you in team

 

[BerserkerRezo]

Very nice! Good luck

 

[matmohair1]

good luck!

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CRIMEAN WAR TURKISH UNIFORMS

http://www.ottoman-uniforms.com/crimean-war-turkish-uniforms/

1840 TILL CRIMEAN WAR (1855) OTTOMAN CAVALRY

http://www.ottoman-uniforms.com/1840-till-crimean-war-ottoman-cavalry/

CRIMEAN WAR TURKISH FOREIGN AUXILIARY CONTINGENTS: EGYPT & TUNISIA

http://www.ottoman-uniforms.com/crimean-war-turkish-foreign-auxiliary-contingents-egypt-tunisia/

OTTOMAN COSSACK REGIMENTS 1853 TILL 1857

http://www.ottoman-uniforms.com/ottoman-cossack-regiments-1853-till-1857/

1840 TILL CRIMEAN WAR (1855) OTTOMAN INFANTRY & ARTILLERY

http://www.ottoman-uniforms.com/1840-till-crimean-war-ottoman-infantry-artillery/

OTTOMAN IMPERIAL NAVY TILL 1853 & CRIMEAN WAR PERIOD

http://www.ottoman-uniforms.com/ottoman-imperial-navy-till-1853-crimean-war-period/

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[Foeurdr]

good luck !

 

[SeanBeansShako]

A good idea, but I have a few suggestions worth considering. NW modules based on singular conflicts that have limited or shared factions rarely get played due to the clan based nature of the community so it might be worth considering the following?

1: Give each faction their own slot and pretty much fill up and replauce the default NW regiments with era appropriate ones. You'll have plenty of room for early and late war uniform combinations with each faction. Even consider using the rank system with each unit to mix things (IE have two privates one in early war gear the other in late).

2: Consider perhaps using the weapons swap mechanic in the regiment/unit selection with most units and give each faction the choices of flintlock/percussion cap musket or rifle depending on the unit to keep things balanced. From what I have seen with NW, unbalanced factions and units rarely get used. Because of their lack of rifles barely anyone plays France.

3: Consider the possibility of making it more of a 1840-50 era module and the addition of both an Italian state and the Ottomans to spice things up visually.

I suggest getting in contact with ExParrot and Willhelm of Blood & Iron. They can give you some resources that'd help you out, especially with France.

These are just my thoughts though, at the end of the day do what you feel is right development wise. I'll be watching with interest. Good luck. If you need British unform examples I can dig out some reference stuff for you as well.

 

[Captured Joe]

3: Consider the possibility of making it more of a 1840-50 era module and the addition of both an Italian state and the Ottomans to spice things up visually.

Which should be in anyway since the Ottomans were very important in the Crimean War and the Italians had troops with the allies as well.

You could consider adding the Austrian-Hungarians as well for some "what if" historical scenario, since the Austrians came very close to join the war as well.

 

[SeanBeansShako]

Pretty much. Plus, putting the Crimean allies all together in one team might make things quite crowded whilst the Russian pool would be quite loose.

EDIT: Oh, also I wouldn't force historical accuracy too much by combining the factions into one. It is a lot more fun to play out what if scenarios and have factions that are allied face off with each other too. People do enjoy that sort of thing now.

 

[Ivkolya]

Thank you for your adwises and suggestions, I'll think about it.
But idea of this mod is to make something like 3D-reenactment or 3D-excursion of Sevastopol and Crimea in different days of that war - there are very detailled descriptions of russian and allied fortifications in all periods of siege of col. Totleben and others, so I want make maps like "Malachov Kurgan  in october 1854 before 1st bombing", "Alma positions on left flank", "4th bastion after 2nd bombing", "Malachov Kurgan in time of 1st assault" etc. So you can see, that in that idea there is no place to "what if" scenarios 

Besides, if I'll make 5 factions replacing existing factions of NW and replacing NW uniforms with uniforms of 1854-1855, it will be another NW with new uniforms, and who will want to play it, if there is already Napoleonic Wars (and that period is much more interesting for people) and you don't need to search and download extra mod (or anyway there are a lot of other more interesting mods). So - if you want play "what if" scenario - you always can play NW with his abstract fields of castles. If you want to play exact France versus Germany - you will choose Blood and Iron. And if you want to play  exact Russia versus France, Britain and Turkey - you will choose this mod 

I realize that Crimean war is not so interesting as Napoleonic wars or Civil War are, and I doubt that I can do something so amazing new in gameplay on my own, so this mod is rather  for that people who just like history, or has interest in this war.
Of course, if I'm wrong and there will be big interest for epoque of 1850-s, it's not big deal to make more factions for each nation and there will be place to even keep this my "Allies" faction 

 

[Foeurdr]

If people want to make France battle England they just need to make both faction on the map allies, no ?
Will you change the musician too ? I don't know much about music in this era is it the same as in the napoleonic or it's different ? Not a major feature but I really like it.

 

[Bluehawk]

The NW Russians use drum and fife signals from a manual that accompanies the 1848 regulations, in other words they already use Crimean War era signals. The British and French might need updating though.

 

[Captured Joe]

The NW Russians use drum and fife signals from a manual that accompanies the 1848 regulations, in other words they already use Crimean War era signals. The British and French might need updating though.

Did the overcoats the Russians used in the Crimea have much differences to the Napoleonic ones anyway?
An their peakless caps too, by the way?

 

[Ivkolya]

If people want to make France battle England they just need to make both faction on the map allies, no ?

Yes, they can do so, but IMHO for battle France vs. England original NW is much better (and english uniforms 1812 are pretty similar to 1854).
Or I'll make 1 faction for 1 nation if this mod will be interesting, but who will play russians with their old muskets so? 

Will you change the musician too ? I don't know much about music in this era is it the same as in the napoleonic or it's different ? Not a major feature but I really like it.

Yes, like Bluehawk said, in NW are already many russian marshes and signals from 1848 regulations, but anyway I'll add new music for Russia and for Allies, but I didn't make researches of music yet.

Did the overcoats the Russians used in the Crimea have much differences to the Napoleonic ones anyway?
An their peakless caps too, by the way?

Russian greatcoat in 1812 had 7 buttons in front, in 1854 it had 6 buttons and there was number of regiment on the buttons. In 1812 there were 5 gathers on back, in 1854 - 7 (not sure, didn't find exact information). Style, material and colour were the same. Also in 1854 soldiers could tuck the skirts of greatcoats.
Peakless caps - you mean like here?

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They were almoust same, there were numbers  of companies and new colours of edging for different battalions.

 

[SeanBeansShako]

Or I'll make 1 faction for 1 nation if this mod will be interesting, but who will play russians with their old muskets so? 

You know you can script each regimental unit to have up to three different switchable weapons in the selection screen right? EG Napoelonic Wars the light infantry.

Then people can choose to play a historical or ahistorical armed Russia and no faction gets left out of play.

 

[Bluehawk]

Well, there were six buttons down the greatcoat instead of seven with the same number embossed on them as on the shako/helmet plate, and shoulder straps now had distinctions of rank. The biggest difference was on the inside though, with the addition of loops and leather toggles for gathering up the "skirt" and pinning it in place so that the greatcoat never exceeds the knee (a side-effect of this is that it makes it poof out a bit), and then in hot weather it can even folded up even higher with another toggle and loop. This method of pinning back the coat was already in use in the Napoleonic Wars as a soldier's innovation, but in 1851 it was approved by the War Ministry.

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Forage caps were unchanged in shape, but the system of piping for battalions changed after 1844: 1st battalion had red, 2nd: white, 3rd: light blue, 4th: yellow, 5th: dark green, and 6th: light green. Also grenadier companies now were indicated for privates and NCOs similar to the fusilier/musketeer companies with "1. Г. Р." (or with colons instead of periods) cut out of the red band for the 1st battalion's grenadier company, "2. Г. Р." for the 2nd, etc. The regular companies were numbered by regiment, so the 3rd regular company of a 6th battalion wore "18. Р." In the Jaegers, the heavy companies were called Carabiniers so they cut out the letters "К.Р." instead, and the headband was dark green. There were also Carabinier Regiments that collected the best men from the Jaegers, in the same way the Grenadiers consolidated the best of the Infantry regiments.

Warning - while you were typing 2 new replies have been posted. You may wish to review your post.

 

[Ivkolya]

You know you can script each regimental unit to have up to three different switchable weapons in the selection screen right? EG Napoelonic Wars the light infantry.

Then people can choose to play a historical or ahistorical armed Russia and no faction gets left out of play.

Of course, I will do it. And this will not be non-historical, because in russian army each company had 24 soldiers with shtutzers (or rifles) and there were also Shooters Battalions, where all were with shtutzers or rifles and also Tshernomorskie (it means from Black-Sea Cossack Troops) Plastuns had only Belgien shtutzers. Also during the war there were many trophy rifles in russian army.
So it will be historical correct if in each Line Infantry or Jaeger regiment will be choice of rifle and musket. But bots of these regiments (maybe not all, maybe in some regiments will be random weapons) for Commander battle mode will have smoothbore percussion muskets (except sailors-artillery, who will have old flintlock musketons), these muskets were 80% of infantry weapons.
And, as far as I know, it was no such big difference between Russian and French armies in weapons, French army of that period was also backward comparing to Britain. So in "Allies" faction French and Turkey Line Infantry units will equalize Russians and game will be more balanced.

Bluehawk, nice uniform knowledge, do you can read Viskovatov work in russian or is there some english translation for it?

P.S. How can I paste here not only quote of text, but also information of who's quote is it?

 

[usnavy30]

Simple, add a quote author= with the Quote button

As displayed

P.S. How can I paste here not only quote of text, but also information of who's quote is it?

As the bbcode

[quote="Ivkolya"]
P.S. How can I paste here not only quote of text, but also information of who's quote is it? :?
[/quote]

 

[Bluehawk]

Bluehawk, nice uniform knowledge, do you can read Viskovatov work in russian or is there some english translation for it?

A little from Column A and a little fromColumn B. Mark Conrad's translation has a few random transcription errors, but he also annotates Viskovatov's own errors or vague language, and it has the full footnotes intact for if you want to look up a law in the PSZ, for example. There was one table of divisions in particular from 1809 that differed in PSZ than in Viskovatov's book. Conrad's translation doesn't include the illustrations though. I read them side by side.

 

[The Great Dictator]

Sooo, any chance we could see the Egyptian/Ottoman Khedive Body Guard cuirassiers? Would be cool just to add variety to the Allied cav, simply due to the fact that there weren't any other cuirass bearing cavalry during this war. (I think? Feel free to prove me wrong, I'm certainly not an expert on this subject).

 

[Ivkolya]

Simple, add a quote author= with the Quote button

As displayed

P.S. How can I paste here not only quote of text, but also information of who's quote is it?

As the bbcode

[quote="Ivkolya"]
P.S. How can I paste here not only quote of text, but also information of who's quote is it? :?
[/quote]

Thanks!

A little from Column A and a little fromColumn B. Mark Conrad's translation has a few random transcription errors, but he also annotates Viskovatov's own errors or vague language, and it has the full footnotes intact for if you want to look up a law in the PSZ, for example. There was one table of divisions in particular from 1809 that differed in PSZ than in Viskovatov's book. Conrad's translation doesn't include the illustrations though. I read them side by side.

Never heard about Mark Conrad, it can be usefull. I know about Viskovatov's errors and the best source to know the maximum truth still is Full collection of orders of Russian Empire but there is a lot to read

Sooo, any chance we could see the Egyptian/Ottoman Khedive Body Guard cuirassiers? Would be cool just to add variety to the Allied cav, simply due to the fact that there weren't any other cuirass bearing cavalry during this war. (I think? Feel free to prove me wrong, I'm certainly not an expert on this subject).

Sorry, but I wil make only troops who took part in battles in Crimea and is well known - like 93rd Highlanders are known for "Thin Red Line". And, as I know (I didn't finish reading description of Crimean war yet, but anyway), there were no such regiment, at least in battles. But there will be British Dragoons, who had also nice uniform and helmets

 

[Ivkolya]

Have an idea but don't know is it possible: I want change structure of squad in Commander Battle mode and add to squad musician (or two) and maybe colour bearer (not nececcary), so, as example, when you yell to your lancers "17th, CHARGE!" and trumpeter will play signal to attack (and sound will be from trumpet, not just in air somewhere near you).

And another idea - add to Specialists one female healer to each side - Dasha Sevastopolskaya for Russians and Lady Florence Nightingale for Allies. I know that there are Priests in Blood & Iron, but don't know if are they healers.
I thought I can give them speciall "weapons" with +HP damage, so I changed damage for pistol from "70" to "-70" but nothings changed. So it must be done in scripts, but unfortunatelly I'm not a bit scripter 

So, does anyone have any suggestions how to make these ideas come true?