Non-polearm mounted combat is basically useless

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kekkuli5

Regular
I'm also finding it very hard to hit anything from horseback. Even with spears I probably land only 1/5 hits. Honestly have no idea what is happening as I was quite good at it in Warband.

Edit: Maybe the e-peen warriors can have an uber ultra warrior mode where they can preen and show off, and for the rest of us a few adjustments to make the fights a bit more enjoyable.

Nah, this game is pretty much designed for just those e-peen warriors, and i don't think it will change.
 

Mawotb

Recruit
No, I was literally just whinging about this to my friend that insists on defending the devs. Then it hit me. You can ride mules into combat. They are a legitimate mount. Thus because they are no doubt WAY shorter than horses, the angles for swinging is based on these mounts. I bet you if you try a mule you will aim exactly like we did in warband and have no problem with the shortest weapons. Its all about the angle. Having to stare at the ground and lose all spacial awareness just to make a regular weapon connect with a dome is stupid. This is another testing and development oversight by not making mules and horses different angles. The animation is perfect but the angle is not. I have a super oversensitive razor mouse and I have to force myself to aim way lower than I need to compared to war band. Between using a bow and two quivers and a one handed is an easy choice. Let alone the whole damage attenuation with arrows is stupid. Add to that archers dont fire all that further than rock lobbing looters. In warband I could use 20-30 good archers and annihilate triple my army count by harrying the encroaching army, splitting them up and trickling them into focus fire. Now I can tell going to meat grinder tactics is superior until archery is balanced. having to use 2-3 arrows on average on an archery main character is stupid; even headshots at close range arent reliable killshots anymore.
 
Honestly, I've felt the same thing, even with longer reach weapons. Lance thrusts that would've hit in warband (which I've played for 1000 hours, so please don't bull**** about it being on me or a lack of experience) just miss. The reach of weapons and hitbox is just pretty weird. I've also heard that the height slider might have something to do with it. I'd have to try a midget character to see if they have an easier time hitting people from horseback due to being closer to the ground haha.
 

Kniggit

Squire
WB
I can relate to this lol. I find my swings are too high. After some practice I have to resort to looking at the floor for every swing. This presents its own issues of course, I keep running into trees and rocks.
 

Ni

Veteran
M&BWBWF&SVC
I can deal with the shorter weapon ranges, in Warband you could hit troops standing in front of your horse with the right sword, having to stare at the ground is just annoying though.

I mean it's becoming instinct now so I'll get over it. I just think for a lot of us that have 1,000 - 1,500+ hours into Warband we just need to get over muscle memory and retrain ourselves.

I just wish I could find a lance that would reach past my horses nose.
 

Mawotb

Recruit
I can deal with the shorter weapon ranges, in Warband you could hit troops standing in front of your horse with the right sword, having to stare at the ground is just annoying though.

I mean it's becoming instinct now so I'll get over it. I just think for a lot of us that have 1,000 - 1,500+ hours into Warband we just need to get over muscle memory and retrain ourselves.

I just wish I could find a lance that would reach past my horses nose.
I disagree, the fact of having to give up spacial awareness just to make a strike connect is counter intuitive. War band felt so right because the angle wasnt an issue, it was optimising the strike on a target to maximise damage plus the fact it was easy to deal killing blows to looters. Base hp is higher now and it seems to me like balancing was done because mules are a mount and were probably used in press release for light hearted positivity to help overlook the sharp lack of overall development. It is far easier to argue that the aiming angle on horseback should not be the same as if riding a mule. I also note that the swing animations are different than warband. Right handed sweeps were deeper implying a hit box at the horses side towards its neck, not half way between a mounted horseman at a horizontal level and a head far, far lower (and donkeys). there is now a need for three angles with one control. staring at the feet of an footman to connect with their head is bad design.
 

zMasterofPie

Recruit
WBWF&SNWVC
I'd say just practice. I at first absolutely could not hit anyone, and I still have trouble, but now I can hit people most of the time as long as long as I have a fairly long weapon. Or, you know, just use a lance, menavlion, or spear (the fine steel menavlion is slow af but it can be swung 2 handed, used like a spear with a shield, AND couched)
 
Basically, the longer the weapon the farther forward the enemy needs to be when you release the swing. If you've got a shorter weapon, like a mace or axe, swing when they're almost beside you and you'll take the head. If you're using something long, like the war razor (or other weapons ~115 in length) you basically need to swing when the enemy is at your horse's nose or the shot will whiff -- which basically requires that the blade somehow passes right through them if they're any closer. It shouldn't be an optimal swing when they're that close, but it shouldn't be a complete whiff, either.

I did the full practice range when I booted the game up, and noticed that hit detection felt wonky then. After missing one of those clay pots with my backhand swing for the Nth time (backhand used to be my specialty in Warband, so I was pretty indignant about it :wink: ), I stopped the horse right beside the pot, and started experimenting with swings and angles.

The number of times that sword passed right through the pot without breaking it was absolutely ridiculous. Unless I swung so that I hit the pot while it was beside my arm -- with the bottom third of the sword blade, instead of the top third -- it wouldn't register the hit.


If the collision meshes are that wonky everywhere else, I'm not surprised people are feeling it's off. I've adjusted and make it work in game now, but only by tossing logic out the window.
 

Fritz1776

Recruit
Perhaps the characters should be more exaggerated in how far they lean over to hit enemies below them, especially if the character in question is particularly tall. Like, 75 degrees if you are aiming straight down, although dynamically reduced if your weapon is long enough that it would be scraping the ground.
 

Mawotb

Recruit
Perhaps the characters should be more exaggerated in how far they lean over to hit enemies below them, especially if the character in question is particularly tall. Like, 75 degrees if you are aiming straight down, although dynamically reduced if your weapon is long enough that it would be scraping the ground.
I dont even want to touch this, warband worked fine. This has issues and has been explained in many ways. Some are claiming hitreg issues and others like me a stating angular inconsistencies. changing animations to fix hit box problems kinda misses the mark...
 

giltirn

Recruit
Given the responses here I can't help but feel that the combat has become too complicated. In WB the player was definitely much stronger than the AI opponents, but there are a crapload more of them so you need the boost to actually make your presence felt on the battlefield. And yes, of course it is very unrealistic, but damn me I just want to go out and bash some heads every so often. It's not like we get to spend much time fighting given that most fights are over within 2 minutes.
 

Mawotb

Recruit
Given the responses here I can't help but feel that the combat has become too complicated. In WB the player was definitely much stronger than the AI opponents, but there are a crapload more of them so you need the boost to actually make your presence felt on the battlefield. And yes, of course it is very unrealistic, but damn me I just want to go out and bash some heads every so often. It's not like we get to spend much time fighting given that most fights are over within 2 minutes.
the game is literally in the earliest stages of fevelopment, EA is literally a 'subject to immense change' kind of deal. lots of things are not balanced, because its self evident. TW needs to focus on getting content in to sustain the consumer audience then do nuanced balancing later on. if its not game breaking it will just delay them from getting content in and risks causing double handling of the same problems. expecting an EA to be polished before all content is in is elitist and whiny. just stop.
 

giltirn

Recruit
the game is literally in the earliest stages of fevelopment, EA is literally a 'subject to immense change' kind of deal. lots of things are not balanced, because its self evident. TW needs to focus on getting content in to sustain the consumer audience then do nuanced balancing later on. if its not game breaking it will just delay them from getting content in and risks causing double handling of the same problems. expecting an EA to be polished before all content is in is elitist and whiny. just stop.

This is just me giving my feedback, as I signed on for when I paid for this EA game. If I didn't believe it would change there would be little point in complaining about it, no?
 

Hhg93

Recruit
I died to an archer's one handed sword while charging at him at full speed with my lance couched today(228 dog to the head)₩ and thats when I decided to take a break for today.. so he is probably right I'm not having trouble with hitting enemies with my one handed sword but died to a lot of stupid situations so there is something weird going on but I can't tell if its hitboxes or animation or maybe game registers some hits when it shouldn't be registering..
 

user32167

Recruit
Due to terrible combat animations and shorter length of non-polearm weapons, it's essentially useless to bring a sword or an axe when fighting mounted. More often than not, the weapon will just sweep right above the head of the target and miss.

In fact, combat animation in Bannerlord is much worse than what it was in Warband. It'd be nice if key mapping can be added for each animation so that the user can at least choose which one to execute,
 
Honestly I think that's fine. I can hit enemies with 1handers but it's hard. Spear or lance should be the weapon of choice for cavalry.
 
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