My ideas to improve the late game

[Future_Gang]

I think we all can agree late game is kinda boring when you have overpowered troops and stats, so heres my ideas on how they can fix it to make it more interesting.

1: Lock out the high level gear from noobs. Its way too easy to get the best weapon at the start of the game and by the time you become a vassal you probably have some heavy plate armor and a 50 damage greatsword.

2: Make the bandits grow in numbers, gear and stats as you level up. So we can have elite bandit armies that can actually be a challange to you instead of just a nuisance you click for your knights to trample.

3: Make troops evolve in gear. Maybe after 3 ingame years a swadian recruit could stop carrying pitchforks and clubs they start bringing spears and swords, nord veterans bring a better axe, khergit horse archer switch their bows for lances, etc you get the point they slowly change their army so you have to come up with new tactics and bring higher level armies to deal with enemies.

If you have any other ideas comment below so Taleworlds can see.

 

[Rhugar]

Spoiler

I think we all can agree late game is kinda boring when you have overpowered troops and stats, so heres my ideas on how they can fix it to make it more interesting.

1: Lock out the high level gear from noobs. Its way too easy to get the best weapon at the start of the game and by the time you become a vassal you probably have some heavy plate armor and a 50 damage greatsword.

2: Make the bandits grow in numbers, gear and stats as you level up. So we can have elite bandit armies that can actually be a challange to you instead of just a nuisance you click for your knights to trample.

3: Make troops evolve in gear. Maybe after 3 ingame years a swadian recruit could stop carrying pitchforks and clubs they start bringing spears and swords, nord veterans bring a better axe, khergit horse archer switch their bows for lances, etc you get the point they slowly change their army so you have to come up with new tactics and bring higher level armies to deal with enemies.

If you have any other ideas comment below so Taleworlds can see.

Are you talking about Warband? or Bannerlord?

Because if you're talking about Bannerlord, it's a little early to talk about boring late game.

 

[Terco_Viejo]

Boy, have you ever played Warband?

@Orion You see how you rushed to close Vader's thread. Even my idea of the pivots could be inside. 

 

[KucukEniste]

I think we all can agree late game is kinda boring when you have overpowered troops and stats, so heres my ideas on how they can fix it to make it more interesting.

1: Lock out the high level gear from noobs. Its way too easy to get the best weapon at the start of the game and by the time you become a vassal you probably have some heavy plate armor and a 50 damage greatsword.

2: Make the bandits grow in numbers, gear and stats as you level up. So we can have elite bandit armies that can actually be a challange to you instead of just a nuisance you click for your knights to trample.

3: Make troops evolve in gear. Maybe after 3 ingame years a swadian recruit could stop carrying pitchforks and clubs they start bringing spears and swords, nord veterans bring a better axe, khergit horse archer switch their bows for lances, etc you get the point they slowly change their army so you have to come up with new tactics and bring higher level armies to deal with enemies.




If you have any other ideas comment below so Taleworlds can see.

1: Could be annoying after a few playtrough.

2: Have you played warband?

3:Have you played warband?

 

[Seleucid]

1) The only reasonable idea. But it should be more you can get good armor but to get the best you need to have special access.

2) Bandit parties go from 10 to 50 in size(in warband). This is not fun if you lose a battle or generally have few troops. Since travelling with a small party is a thing it is likely that they've removed the scaling bandits that is likely an improvement.

3)Changing troop types should not be a thing that happens normally it would be interesting if weapons and armor improved over time but the time of the game is less 100s of years.

They've addressed how they'll make the game more interesting by adding late game politics clans and dynasties along with the much anticipated nord invasion DLC.

 

[Roccoflipside]

1) The only reasonable idea. But it should be more you can get good armor but to get the best you need to have special access.

2) Bandit parties go from 10 to 50 in size(in warband). This is not fun if you lose a battle or generally have few troops. Since travelling with a small party is a thing it is likely that they've removed the scaling bandits that is likely an improvement.

3)Changing troop types should not be a thing that happens normally it would be interesting if weapons and armor improved over time but the time of the game is less 100s of years.

They've addressed how they'll make the game more interesting by adding late game politics clans and dynasties along with the much anticipated nord invasion DLC.

Keep in mind no discussion has actually been made about a nord dlc (or any dlc for that matter) outside of "naval travel/warfare won't be present at release". I keep seeing people talk about the dlc like it's been promised, but TW's has literally never said anything about it, just us fans.

 

[Seleucid]

1) The only reasonable idea. But it should be more you can get good armor but to get the best you need to have special access.

2) Bandit parties go from 10 to 50 in size(in warband). This is not fun if you lose a battle or generally have few troops. Since travelling with a small party is a thing it is likely that they've removed the scaling bandits that is likely an improvement.

3)Changing troop types should not be a thing that happens normally it would be interesting if weapons and armor improved over time but the time of the game is less 100s of years.

They've addressed how they'll make the game more interesting by adding late game politics clans and dynasties along with the much anticipated nord invasion DLC.

Keep in mind no discussion has actually been made about a nord dlc (or any dlc for that matter) outside of "naval travel/warfare won't be present at release". I keep seeing people talk about the dlc like it's been promised, but TW's has literally never said anything about it, just us fans.

I was being sarcastic about the DLC that every recruit with 2 posts is ecstatic for.

 

[Roccoflipside]

Ah, fair enough. Seemed like you were convinced it was coming, my bad. Carry on then 

 

[Noudelle]

I think we all can agree late game is kinda boring when you have overpowered troops and stats, so heres my ideas on how they can fix it to make it more interesting.

1: Lock out the high level gear from noobs. Its way too easy to get the best weapon at the start of the game and by the time you become a vassal you probably have some heavy plate armor and a 50 damage greatsword.

2: Make the bandits grow in numbers, gear and stats as you level up. So we can have elite bandit armies that can actually be a challange to you instead of just a nuisance you click for your knights to trample.

3: Make troops evolve in gear. Maybe after 3 ingame years a swadian recruit could stop carrying pitchforks and clubs they start bringing spears and swords, nord veterans bring a better axe, khergit horse archer switch their bows for lances, etc you get the point they slowly change their army so you have to come up with new tactics and bring higher level armies to deal with enemies.

If you have any other ideas comment below so Taleworlds can see.

This is silly.

1: Not having access to higher grade equipment because of an arbitrary number (player level) doesn't make any sense whatsoever. If the player decides to grind money early in the game to get the best equipment, that's their choice. It's an aspect of the game that bugs me too to be honest, but the alternative is just worse. How **** would it feel to see other characters use weapons that you can't for the sole reason that you haven't killed enough people yet. The level system doesn't work that way anymore but you get my point

2: Excuse me but why are we talking about bandits? We're talking about late-game here. Late-game is defined by large-scale battles and sieges between lords and kings. Not chasing bandits. Not to mention that this also makes no sense within the context of the game either.

3: Again, how does this make any sense? Why would peasants start with anything more than a pitchfork later on in the game? If you want them to carry spears and swords, I don't know maybe you could... Upgrade them? Not to mention that recruitment in Bannerlord works in a completely different way than in Warband. In Warband, you recruit peasants in villages for ten bucks apiece. In Bannerlord, you purchase units from constables. Their quality/tier being determined by your relation with said constable.

And as others have mentionned, are we even talking about Bannerlord here? The game isn't out and none of us have a clear idea of how the campaign will play like. I agree that effort should be put in making the late-game more interesting and less tedious, but the suggestions here aren't it. It also seems like TW are putting a lot of effort in that regard considering the new dynasty and clan mechanics.

 

[vicwiz007]

I am in agreement that Warband's late game is very boring. However, I don't think these suggestions are necessary.

For starters, BL has a lot more features. Sieges and kingdom management (imo) were the most tedious part. Both those things seem to be addressed.

And you will never get to this incredibly overpowered stage because your character eventually dies, meaning progress is reversed a bit and at the very least you have a fresh new character to try out.

 

[HoloNesan]

Have you ever played M&B? Your ideas has already been achieved in Native in 2008

 

[Oxtocoatl]

Ckii has defensive pacts that smaller kingdoms can form against large ones. This could balance the endgame.
Another idea would be to make huge empires more prone to civil wars and factionalism.
I can see the problem the OP is describing, but the solutions offered seem too small to matter in the end. I think the answer lies in having the AI start working together against a large player kingdom, while your more powerful vassals start scheming to oust you from power or gain independence.

 

[Mad Vader]

If you want to prevent the player from winning, you can simply crash the game if he's too successful. But enough about Paradox games.
A more interesting idea is to give him advanced challenges like a NORD INVA... wtf? that wasn't me... like a very difficult series of battles against new OP opponents. It's not against the law to introduce new and interesting content in the late game.

 

[monoolho]

Is that... a reference to CKII's... AZTEC INVASION?

OH GAWD, RODERIGO RIBOVALDO! You unleashed the Ice Kraken with the longships landing at the northern beaches of Calradia, under heavy fire from catapults and bowmen!

Funny, I haven't reached Bannerlord's late game yet.

 

[Roccoflipside]

Is that... a reference to CKII's... AZTEC INVASION?

OH GAWD, RODERIGO RIBOVALDO! You unleashed the Ice Kraken with the longships landing at the northern beaches of Calradia, under heavy fire from catapults and bowmen!

Funny, I haven't reached Bannerlord's late game yet.

Yeah, I keep getting stuck at the part where steam asks me for money, but there's nowhere to put it? Anyone else have this bug with BL?

 

[monoolho]

Yeah, I keep getting stuck at the part where steam asks me for money, but there's nowhere to put it? Anyone else have this bug with BL?

Dude, I thought that was just me! I know, let's start an international class-action suit against Steam and TaleWorlds for this stupid bug.

Imma review it "Can't even install, 0/10, where's my refund?"

 

[Lord Brutus]

It's amazing to me that people show up with complaints about Warband and think that these complaints somehow will apply to Bannerlord.

 

[Roccoflipside]

It's amazing to me that people show up with complaints about Warband and think that these complaints somehow will apply to Bannerlord.

Outside of the general layout of the game, I am waiting to pass judgement on BL until it's released. I mean, they spent ~2 years developing their own engine specifically for this game, and people still think the cow-herdin quest needs to be removed? 

 

[Kentucky 『 ＨＥＩＧＵＩ 』 James]

1: Lock out the high level gear from noobs. Its way too easy to get the best weapon at the start of the game and by the time you become a vassal you probably have some heavy plate armor and a 50 damage greatsword.

2: Make the bandits grow in numbers, gear and stats as you level up. So we can have elite bandit armies that can actually be a challange to you instead of just a nuisance you click for your knights to trample.

3: Make troops evolve in gear. Maybe after 3 ingame years a swadian recruit could stop carrying pitchforks and clubs they start bringing spears and swords, nord veterans bring a better axe, khergit horse archer switch their bows for lances, etc you get the point they slowly change their army so you have to come up with new tactics and bring higher level armies to deal with enemies.

1. Gear progression in warband is either about picking what looks the nicest or picking what has the best stats. If you lock this stuff until the late game, you're stifling the pace of the game just to coerce people into playing until all the other fun in the campaign has gone. I don't like this idea.

2. Level scaling amounts to little more than slowing the player down in some aspect. I have never seen it done well in any game of any genre. It just means that, at best, the player is aware that every time they level up the game is going to take some of that way, and at worse, players actually avoid levelling up altogether to avoid the game becoming grindier. Level scaling for enemies is particularly egregious because not only does it destroy the worldbuilding, but it forces everyone to invest in combat points. If the developers want to add increased stakes over time, they should at least have it happen over time and not have it tied to player level.

3. I theory I don't mind this idea, but in game I really don't like the idea of troops becoming "better" over time. If the game mechanics make old troops obsolete over time, then tactics and player choices are going to mean less and less, and the game becomes more of a number cruncher than a strategy RTS. Warband suffered immensely from this, with lower tiers existing solely to upgrade into cavalry. It feels silly when you have these great looking mid tier infantry who you know are basically useless because of the sheer importance the game puts on levels and stats.

There's a common theme here. I think what taleworlds needs to learn from warband is that the pacing in that game was terrible, and they should accept that with the amount of actual gameplay mechanics they have, campaigns should probably be no longer than about 10 hours from start to finish, assuming the player is trying to become king of the world or whatever the implied "endgame" is. Currently you have to personally besiege hundreds of settlements in near identical sieges, and grind for hours to even participate in the kingdom play of the midgame. The reason the lategame is so boring is because by that time, the campaign has long since outstayed its welcome.

 

[Scyrius]

and here I thought there was a whole other section of the forums dedicated to discussing Warband