Multiplayer experience.

[Tork789]

If he would take any weapon and onehit people one after each other (if they had proper gear) this would indeed be taken seriously

Crossbow, most bows at headshot, lance and I think you can onehit less armoured people in warband with glaive, but I've rarely used two-handed weapons while on horseback in warband, in fact rarely played khergits since the competitive community just never used them, so I can't be sure.

Damage output of 2h weapons on cav is too high. Everyone with the slightest amount of brain will agree to this.

Everyone with slightest amount of brain try not deal in absolutes. What's the point of taking a 2h weapon if you can't even onehit anyone? You sacrifice your protection against projectiles and huge protection the shield provides in group melee for only one thing - the damage. No one will bother with glaves or menavlions if they won't be able to oneshot.

 

[부부를 넘어서 가자]

Crossbow, most bows at headshot, lance and I think you can onehit less armoured people in warband with glaive, but I've rarely used two-handed weapons while on horseback in warband, in fact rarely played khergits since the competitive community just never used them, so I can't be sure.


Everyone with slightest amount of brain try not deal in absolutes. What's the point of taking a 2h weapon if you can't even onehit anyone? You sacrifice your protection against projectiles and huge protection the shield provides in group melee for only one thing - the damage. No one will bother with glaves or menavlions if they won't be able to oneshot.

Yes you can oneshot less armoured people as cav. If they have proper gear this usually doesn't happen. even with a 2handed weapon. Ranged weapons are different as they require alot more skill and have a much easier counter to it. Shields are a thing in warband. With drops, without doesn't matter.
Imo 2h cav could be removed if they can't fix it. It's not fun to play against. It's only useful if it's op. You can easily cut down 33% damage from the weapon and you could still 1shot people. However at a lower rate. It would reward going for full speed hits that are also risky for the rider. The current numbers allow you to 1shot any class in the game without even being on a fast horse.
Or remove the ability to bump hit with the weapon so people are safe if they block it.

 

[Tork789]

Yes you can oneshot less armoured people as cav. If they have proper gear this usually doesn't happen. even with a 2handed weapon. Ranged weapons are different as they require alot more skill and have a much easier counter to it. Shields are a thing in warband. With drops, without doesn't matter.
Imo 2h cav could be removed if they can't fix it. It's not fun to play against. It's only useful if it's op. You can easily cut down 33% damage from the weapon and you could still 1shot people. However at a lower rate. It would reward going for full speed hits that are also risky for the rider. The current numbers allow you to 1shot any class in the game without even being on a fast horse.

I doubt that, I had plenty of occasions where I landed a nice slashing strike on the head of someone armoured while going full speed and it didn't kill him.

But regardless, you talk about the damage of the two-handed weapons right now, which is debatable. But I was pointing out how people use videos of them noobstomping and claiming that the entire class is op.

 

[부부를 넘어서 가자]

I doubt that, I had plenty of occasions where I landed a nice slashing strike on the head of someone armoured while going full speed and it didn't kill him.

But regardless, you talk about the damage of the two-handed weapons right now, which is debatable. But I was pointing out how people use videos of them noobstomping and claiming that the entire class is op.

Because this is obviously the best way to Show what the weapon can do as of right now. What would it do if I show myself with glaive doing nothing. In my clip I land like 8 hits. 5 of them are more than 100 damage and onehit the opponent. One is a hit on a dismounted cav that has good armour. It does more than half his HP without any speed. Another one is a bumpstab for 80 damage. The last one is a standing still no speed hit with 70 damage. This was not a Montage. Literally an unedited gameplay.

 

[Scar]

I doubt that, I had plenty of occasions where I landed a nice slashing strike on the head of someone armoured while going full speed and it didn't kill him.

But regardless, you talk about the damage of the two-handed weapons right now, which is debatable. But I was pointing out how people use videos of them noobstomping and claiming that the entire class is op.

Doesn't matter whether that infantry is the best player on the server or a complete beginner, as soon as the cavalry hits him with their twohander, he is dead. Oneshot kills in comparison to infantry regularly needing up to 4-6 hits to kill someone is, by definition, unbalanced/overpowered.

 

[Tork789]

Because this is obviously the best way to Show what the weapon can do as of right now. What would it do if I show myself with glaive doing nothing. In my clip I land like 8 hits. 5 of them are more than 100 damage and onehit the opponent. One is a hit on a dismounted cav that has good armour. It does more than half his HP without any speed. Another one is a bumpstab for 80 damage. The last one is a standing still no speed hit with 70 damage. This was not a Montage. Literally an unedited gameplay.

Doesn't matter what you show in that case, what matters is the argument. They don't say that the menavlion is the problem, they say the cav is.

Oneshot kills in comparison to infantry regularly needing up to 4-6 hits to kill someone is, by definition, unbalanced/overpowered.

No? There are many more variables at play than just pure damage. By that logic Warband isn't balanced either, since couch lance still exists and crossbows can oneshot people.

 

[Shemaforash]

Cool you're using me as an example but I think both of them are too strong

 

[부부를 넘어서 가자]

Doesn't matter what you show in that case, what matters is the argument. They don't say that the menavlion is the problem, they say the cav is.


No? There are many more variables at play than just pure damage. By that logic Warband isn't balanced either, since couch lance still exists and crossbows can oneshot people.

Menavlion and glaive are a problem. Cav is also a problem but that has nothing to do with the weapon being one.
couch lance has obvious downsides and crowsbows do too. (in warband!!)

You're quite literally the only person defending the weapon in its current state. And it's your main class.

 

[Tork789]

Cool you're using me as an example but I think both of them are too strong

I don't care what you think Shema, since you never bother presenting arguments. I just used you as an example, since you've done the same thing I've described in example here, relax.

You're quite literally the only person defending the weapon in its current state. And it's your main class.

Yeah and? If I play a certain class I'm not allowed to give my opinion about it? Or that I'm alone makes me inherently wrong?

 

[Shemaforash]

ok that’s cool tork when you letting me know time and place? Since you challenged me to a ft7

 

[부부를 넘어서 가자]

I don't care what you think Shema, since you never bother presenting arguments. I just used you as an example, since you've done the same thing I've described in example here, relax.


Yeah and? If I play a certain class I'm not allowed to give my opinion about it? Or that I'm alone makes me inherently wrong?

No that's not it. But if literally every competetive warband player (including cav players) belive that the weapon is currently too strong there might be a good reason for that dont you think.
Also you#re not even providing arguments. you're only saying these players a bad so it works lol

 

[Scar]

No? There are many more variables at play than just pure damage. By that logic Warband isn't balanced either, since couch lance still exists and crossbows can oneshot people.

I don't have to explain you what counterplay is. You yourself should be an expert on what can go wrong with couch lances. The fact that crossbows can but won't in 95% of the cases oneshot players regardless of where they hit doesn't support your argument either. There are very obvious downsides to both couch lances and crossbows in Warband, nobody in their sane mind would question that.

I'm not talking about the pure damage of the weapon, but the damage calculation overall that decides whether someone that got hit dies or not. Most of these variables are controlled by the cavalry (=/ counterplay), and are obviously calibrated in a way to leads to a bad experience for everyone. It does not matter how fast a cavalry is approaching, it does not matter for how long he held his swing, it does not matter how far away his target was and where he hit him, it does not matter what armor his target wore, etc.

Whatever though, you are obviously too proud to accept you are wrong, even though the vast majority of anyone with basic understanding of the matter tells you otherwise.

 

[Karl_Magnus]

I don't play multiplayer, but watching the original post video, it looks like some maps should have classes restrictions. Why allow cavalry in cramped towns?

 

[Mabons]

I don't play multiplayer, but watching the original post video, it looks like some maps should have classes restrictions. Why allow cavalry in cramped towns?

That cramped town is probably the most open map we have for cavalry right now if you don't counter Harbour of Ovsks for TDM or any of the Siege maps when you sally out.

Class restrictions is a cheap way out and prevents people being properly creative.

 

[Karl_Magnus]

Fair enough.

 

[Alyss]

The main issue with class limits is that it doesn’t fix the problem at all. One cav could still one hit the other team. I was finally able to test multiplayer properly yesterday and I tested menavlion in skirmish. I was solo cav (and I’m not a cav player in Warband) and I went 24-1 quite easily. The damage needs to be nerfed by at least 30% and even more. This thing is more op than LA or GLA on horseback

 

[Mabons]

The main issue with class limits is that it doesn’t fix the problem at all. One cav could still one hit the other team. I was finally able to test multiplayer properly yesterday and I tested menavlion in skirmish. I was solo cav (and I’m not a cav player in Warband) and I went 24-1 quite easily. The damage needs to be nerfed by at least 30% and even more. This thing is more op than LA or GLA on horseback

The exact kind of scores I get regularly when I abuse cav. It's just too easy.

 

[Alyss]

The exact kind of scores I get regularly when I abuse cav. It's just too easy.

Ye I don’t really think that I deserved that score by playing cav. (in term of skill I mean). I was literally charging the enemy spawn and one hitting everyone before they reached a flag

 

[Askey]

When I play Bannerlord I relish the chance of killing cav. There is something satisfying about killing a more superior class. I have realised recently that polearms practically do little to help against them and have started using ranged weapons instead- often dropping spears to the ground to free up weapon slots and make it easier to switch between melee and ranged. Shooting the rider is far more effective.

Perhaps the solution is making polearms do significantly more damage to cav depending on the speed they ride towards you. If a polearm/two-handed weapon on horseback can do extra copious amounts of damage from the speed damage multiplier then surely using a polearm against said cav should also do copious amounts of damage. There are also comments regarding the idea that polearms are "useless" in the forums, although I don't completely agree I believe this would also help.

Edit- (Perhaps a bad idea to generate constructive criticism on the cav class in the middle of an argument )

 

[Tork789]

No that's not it. But if literally every competetive warband player (including cav players) belive that the weapon is currently too strong there might be a good reason for that dont you think.

Which one of those are cav mains? But yeah, sure, if a lot of people tend to have the same opinion it's definitely worth investigating, but I'm not arguing against that. I'm arguing against accepting that as a fact simply because I'm in a minority, especially when provided arguments are flawed.

Also you#re not even providing arguments. you're only saying these players a bad so it works lol

Arguments for what? I'm not exactly stating anything here. I just found the provided arguments for the statement dubious and called it out. It's not exactly an argument that something is broken if you can use it against noobs. Show me the same great play against a stack of adequately skilled players and then we'll talk. That's why I insist that we need both ranked and tournaments before we start deciding what's broken and what's not.

you are obviously too proud to accept you are wrong

No I'm not and I did in the past. It's just when your whole explanation consists of unbacked statements about "95% of the cases ", "obviously" and "the vast majority of anyone with basic understanding of the matter tells you otherwise" I'm not really getting convinced.