Multicultural armies are boring and make no sense

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froggyluv

Master Knight
NW
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Id like to keep troops more cultural distinct merely because THATS the the only form of distinction this game has. If every lord has a random personality and a mixed bag of Sturgia/Vlandia/Aserai/Battania/Khuzait/Empire troops -then the game lacks any distinction anywhere.

Also i have very little knowledge of medieval kingdom military makeups but i'd bet my house there were no defected camel Lords from N.Africa joining the Nordic Tribes..
 

redmark

Veteran
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Also i have very little knowledge of medieval kingdom military makeups but i'd bet my house there were no defected camel Lords from N.Africa joining the Nordic Tribes..
Defected lords are sort of the opposite problem, though.
 

Bigamo

Banned
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Id like to keep troops more cultural distinct merely because THATS the the only form of distinction this game has. If every lord has a random personality and a mixed bag of Sturgia/Vlandia/Aserai/Battania/Khuzait/Empire troops -then the game lacks any distinction anywhere.

Also i have very little knowledge of medieval kingdom military makeups but i'd bet my house there were no defected camel Lords from N.Africa joining the Nordic Tribes..
Indeed, they all have their own personality based not on culture. The only real difference between kingdoms is the troop rooster. I for one, even being a vlandian have zero fiefs with vlandian culture. My army is a mix of Sturgian, battanian and empire. And I am a Vlandian lord. Sorry, but it makes NO SENSE!

I loled hard in the comment about camel lords! LOL
 

TheShermanator

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Agreed that, as a matter of degree, culture should be more meaningful - especially at the army level. You should still be able to have some variety, but in general the structural dynamics of the game should prompt AI and player parties to have more in-culture troops.

One possible structural element that could facilitate that: Conquest should result in gradual cultural transformation of fiefs - such that off-culture notables are slowly replaced by in-culture notables until the ratio of new vs. original culture notables in a fief was about 1:1. That should take some time, and the rate of that cultural transformation could be further modified by kingdom policies, governor choices, maybe even castle/town policies once those exist, etc.
 

Blood Gryphon

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WBVC
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Indeed, they all have their own personality based not on culture. The only real difference between kingdoms is the troop rooster. I for one, even being a vlandian have zero fiefs with vlandian culture. My army is a mix of Sturgian, battanian and empire. And I am a Vlandian lord. Sorry, but it makes NO SENSE!

I loled hard in the comment about camel lords! LOL
Why don't you just go recruit in vlandia if you want a vlandian army? Is the game forcing you to not recruit there?
 

Lord Irontoe

Master Knight
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I wouldn't mind it if conquered fiefs switched to the conquerers culture. It would definitely make the armies look more unified. But the main issue I have with that is once a faction's been defeated, those troops would be gone for good, and that would suck because I do like mixing my troops.

One way to get around that would be to have deserter parties. If a faction's destroyed, its deserters turn into rebels and roam around their old territories. That way you could still have access to those troops from prisoners, and it would add some tougher bandits to spice up the map.
 

TheShermanator

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I wouldn't mind it if conquered fiefs switched to the conquerers culture. It would definitely make the armies look more unified. But the main issue I have with that is once a faction's been defeated, those troops would be gone for good, and that would suck because I do like mixing my troops.

One way to get around that would be to have deserter parties. If a faction's destroyed, its deserters turn into rebels and roam around their old territories. That way you could still have access to those troops from prisoners, and it would add some tougher bandits to spice up the map.
You could calibrate it so that, ultimately, half the fief's notables were from the original culture (with original culture troops) and half were from the conquering culture. (Or, you could play with the ratio if 1:1 is not optimal for some reason I'm not considering).
 

Bigamo

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You could calibrate it so that, ultimately, half the fief's notables were from the original culture (with original culture troops) and half were from the conquering culture. (Or, you could play with the ratio if 1:1 is not optimal for some reason I'm not considering).
Or you can have defeated cultures units spawning in taverns as Mercenaries.
 

froggyluv

Master Knight
NW
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Why don't you just go recruit in vlandia if you want a vlandian army? Is the game forcing you to not recruit there?
Thats hardly the point or solution. For instance, i have hundreds of hours in this game but havent fought in any wars against the Aserai nor Khuzaits yet -id like to think that when i finally do encounter them ill be treated to if not a new warfare -at least new troops i havent encountered before. These are the things that keep games fresh and interesting imo. Now if all Lords are already running around with a mishmash granola army of all troop types anyways -kinda ruins that experience.
 

Bigamo

Banned
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Thats hardly the point or solution. For instance, i have hundreds of hours in this game but havent fought in any wars against the Aserai nor Khuzaits yet -id like to think that when i finally do encounter them ill be treated to if not a new warfare -at least new troops i havent encountered before. These are the things that keep games fresh and interesting imo. Now if all Lords are already running around with a mishmash granola army of all troop types anyways -kinda ruins that experience.

This! Plus making a jorney to vlandia everytime one wants to recruit doesn't make sense.
 

Blood Gryphon

Knight
WBVC
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Thats hardly the point or solution. For instance, i have hundreds of hours in this game but havent fought in any wars against the Aserai nor Khuzaits yet -id like to think that when i finally do encounter them ill be treated to if not a new warfare -at least new troops i havent encountered before. These are the things that keep games fresh and interesting imo. Now if all Lords are already running around with a mishmash granola army of all troop types anyways -kinda ruins that experience.
At what point are you fighting them? If you fight them while they are contained to their homeland then you get to fight a majority of their troops. If you fight them after they've snowballed and the front line is not in their homeland then yes you will fight a mixed army.

I'm not against some of the suggestions here, but a lot of your basis for these changes are based on peoples limited experience with the game. I suggest you do a different kind of playthrough to experience what you feel like you are missing. I don't see this mixed troop issue besides with kingdoms that snowball and own different cultures territories.

If you guys remember the AI use to only recruit from their owned villages instead of any village and it led to hardcore snowballing because defeated kingdoms could not raise armies efficiently. The change to let them recruit from any village helped smaller kingdoms last longer.

If you want troop types to change and to limit armies to only their culture, the limited ability to actually raise an army will return and snowballing will get worse. We know this because of past issues.

This! Plus making a jorney to vlandia everytime one wants to recruit doesn't make sense.
It does if you want to keep a Vlandian only army. If you don't then recruit where you want. The point is you can play how you want too, nothing is forcing you to not go back to vlandia. The reason the AI do it is for the reasons stated above.
 

froggyluv

Master Knight
NW
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At what point are you fighting them? If you fight them while they are contained to their homeland then you get to fight a majority of their troops.
Im not sure i tend to get like 200 days in and then something forces a restart. Im a level 13 character if that tells you anything. Anyways just yesterday being a vassal of S.Empire i voted for war against Sturgia - i guess i was encountering a Lord that had recently lost as she only had maybe 50 troops but upon looking at her army makeup (via Alt key) say she had troops from at least 3 cultures if not more. I have noticed this every playthru and its irksome. Also whenever I see Camels running around in the snowy North this leads me to the same dismay

I would recommend a negative morale modifier for mixing troops that the AI lords would also have to factor in -so in that they favor their own which is generally how the world works naturally
 

Blood Gryphon

Knight
WBVC
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Im not sure i tend to get like 200 days in and then something forces a restart. Im a level 13 character if that tells you anything. Anyways just yesterday being a vassal of S.Empire i voted for war against Sturgia - i guess i was encountering a Lord that had recently lost as she only had maybe 50 troops but upon looking at her army makeup (via Alt key) say she had troops from at least 3 cultures if not more. I have noticed this every playthru and its irksome. Also whenever I see Camels running around in the snowy North this leads me to the same dismay
Are you sure you aren't fighting a mercenary that is fighting for sturgia? I find it hard to believe a sturgian lord traveled all the way to aserai to recruit. Unless your telling me sturgia has conquered territory there. I do not witness this in my playthroughs that get up to 1k days (most recent 1.5.1).

Actually if you saw camels then it must of been a mercenary, the only camel troop is the jawwal camel rider. Or she defeated a party with them as prisoners and recruited them.
 
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MarcusU

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I agree with OP's original post. This has been one of my biggest criticisms of the game since Warband.
 

froggyluv

Master Knight
NW
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Are you sure you aren't fighting a mercenary that is fighting for sturgia? I find it hard to believe a sturgian lord traveled all the way to aserai to recruit. Unless your telling me sturgia has conquered territory there. I do not witness this in my playthroughs that get up to 1k days (most recent 1.5.1).
Her name is Svana and Im 188 days in. Not saying their was def Aserai but again had at least 3 different cultures making up her troop type. Another female Sturgian lord Skiva is now a Vassal of the Khuzait -that is a Nordic female warrior is now fighting for a desert asiatic mongol type horde -so early in the game? Sits well with you?....ok
 

Bigamo

Banned
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I am with 1000k days, 4 children, 2 dead wife's and looking for the third victim. In my playthrough the frontiers don't exist anymore. The map is mostly a mess with everyone having territory everywhere, notable exceptions being Asserai that as usual are in their starting area and Khuzaits, that have only lost a bit of territory but are in the same place. Vlandia and the southern empire are in a big war to decide who has more power. (Tied right now but vlandia is losing the war) and all the territories of vlandia, southern empire and the Bathanians are a big mess. Like I said there are no thing as frontiers anymore. At all.
 

NPC99

Baron
M&BWBWF&SVC
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Only a quarter of the army led by Emperor Romanus to Manzikert in 1071 were professional Byzantine soldiers. Most of his forces were provincial troops, peasant levies, private retinues and mercenaries. Those mercenaries included Frankish, Anglo-Saxon, Norman, Georgian, Armenian, Bulgarian, Turkic Pecheneg & Cuman troops.
The opposing Seljuk forces included a sizeable contingent of ghulams - subject warriors from conquered enemies.
What would be more interesting than forcing ahistorical uniformity in Bannerlord armies would be to allow defections. At Manzikert the Emperor's Turkic mercenaries defected to the Seljuks.