Melee cavalry is underpowered at the moment (Suggestions updated)

[Dabos37]

BTW, here you have the save game to try this battle using 30 Vlandian Vanguard:

https://wetransfer.com/downloads/43...13a7d778947d73b232a3b49e20201121012706/2a1319

Maybe some great commanders like @hruza or @Dr-Shinobi want to teach us how to use cavalry xD (without abusing map borders or things like that).

 

[Dr-Shinobi]

Im working on an project right now you can read if you like, Im no expert in cavs though but even me can make em effective so idk how you can fail in this

 

[Dabos37]

Is this a joke? If not, I do not get the point of this video.

 

[Dr-Shinobi]

Is this a joke? If not, I do not get the point of this video.

Its because you dont know what strategy is when its there...Hens no point trying to show you. So why ask when you dont want to be tought ? I just had a match when some infantry blocked almost all our archer shower so thats that to...and you know what ? we used cav to open them up when they where to pinned. Was a prerfect timing even if it was risky

 

[Dabos37]

Its because you dont know what strategy is when its there...Hens no point trying to show you. So why ask when you dont want to be tought ?

Anyway, why do not try the save game I have provided you? You just have to play this battle (realistic difficulty) and show everyone how wrong I am. It is simple, right?

Please show me your great strategy skill in the battle I have posted above. I am wishing to learn how to play like you.

 

[Dr-Shinobi]

Anyway, why do not try the save game I have provided you? You just have to play this battle (realistic difficulty) and show everyone how wrong I am. It is simple, right?

Please show me your great strategy skill in the battle I have posted above. I am wishing to learn how to play like you.

Can follow my project if you like. Never claimed to be an expert strategist which baffles me that you struggle with it.
Have no time for your little games

 

[Dabos37]

Can follow my project if you like. Never claimed to be an expert strategist which baffles me that you struggle with it.
Have no time for your little games

Well, it looks like you have ample time answer my posts in seconds, so why do not invest some small time helping a forum mate to learn how to make cavalry great in this game? Your project about winning battles which are 10:1 in your favor does not help much to understand your point.

 

[Dr-Shinobi]

Well, it looks like you have ample time answer my posts in seconds, so why do not invest some small time helping a forum mate to learn how to make cavalry great in this game? Your project about winning battles which are 10:1 in your favor does not help much to understand your point.

Because we have spent so much time already to try to teach your stubborn ass Told you if youre interested i have tons of vids you can watch

 

[Dabos37]

Because we have spent so much time already to try to teach your stubborn ass Told you if youre interested i have tons of vids you can watch

You continue spending time on my every time you answer me. Why do not play this fast battle instead of writing here? It will be worth for you in terms of saving time if you teach me how to use cavalry, so you won't have to waste more time on me. It would be more instructive for me, please help.

 

[Ananda_The_Destroyer]

I hate the whole "just watch the video" part of contemporary culture. "Looking for a 2 sentence explanation for some softwhere or website feature... just watch my 10 minute YouTube video DON'T OFRGET TO LIKE SUB COMMENT AND I HAVE A PAYnPAY and a hOrnyfans and....."

If you can't concisely describe your strategy then it isn't one. Sometimes they land their attacks and sometimes they don't and die, so watching a video where they land them doesn't mean anyting.

They still miss too much and die too fast and the advance command seems like a suicide order too lol

 

[Dabos37]

Archers vs Cavalry performance in a nutshell (beta 1.5.5):

(All battles played in the same game difficulty and against the same army. I also used the same army but adding 30 Master Archers when testing archers and adding 30 Vanguard when testing cavalry)

- First try using archers:





- First try using cavalry:



- Second try using cavalry:



- Third try using cavalry:





Some annotations:

- In the first battle when playing with archers you are going to see some weird orders, this is due to I am not totally habituated to new controls yet
- Please do not pay attention to my skill when killing myself enemies, I was really not playing seriously and I just wanted to test units performance.
- If you think that I used my units poorly, please play this battle yourself and show us how good cavalry is in your hands.
- I just managed to win this battle with cavalry, if using the map border to trap Khuzait's HA.
- An advice: if you want to win battles easily, just bring archers. Do not bother with cavalry units, they are garbage in 1.5.5 again because now archers are again pretty deadly and shieldwall is not useful for cavalry anymore due to speed penalty.

@Dr-Shinobi Ok, I think that I am now learning how to master cavalry in this game. I have been almost able to win the same battle this time, it has been closer this time. You can compare with the above videos and check how cavalry performed much better this time.



xD

 

[Dr-Shinobi]

I hate the whole "just watch the video" part of contemporary culture. "Looking for a 2 sentence explanation for some softwhere or website feature... just watch my 10 minute YouTube video DON'T OFRGET TO LIKE SUB COMMENT AND I HAVE A PAYnPAY and a hOrnyfans and....."

If you can't concisely describe your strategy then it isn't one. Sometimes they land their attacks and sometimes they don't and die, so watching a video where they land them doesn't mean anyting.

They still miss too much and die too fast and the advance command seems like a suicide order too lol

Well if you actually had read this thread lol xD

 

[Dabos37]

I did it!!!! Finally I have won this battle with vlandian vanguard. I am starting to love cavalry now:



Talking seriously, goodbye. I will come back to this game when units get properly balanced. Hopefully in 1.5.6 something change.

@Dr-Shinobi BTW, you are the only one who is actually wasting everyone's time with pointless videos, comments and talking about something which you clearly have no idea, and this is the only reason because you are too scared to accept the challenge and play this battle showing how supposedly good cavalry is.

 

[Dr-Shinobi]

I did it!!!! Finally I have won this battle with vlandian vanguard. I am starting to love cavalry now:



Talking seriously, goodbye. I will come back to this game when units get properly balanced. Hopefully in 1.5.6 something change.

You still have a long way to learn i see but yeah come back when you do and stop baiting people....
Keep at it and even you will become an great commander one day. However every commander knows that learning from your mistakes is key to success

 

[Ananda_The_Destroyer]

Well if you actually had read this thread lol xD

Read what? I play the game myself, what do you have to say? Y

 

[Dr-Shinobi]

Read what? I play the game myself, what do you have to say? Y

Well if you jump in to an conversation making accusations like that you should have listening to the whole thing right ? Stop wasting my time when you have it all in this thread

 

[Ichon]

To add:
If you have a long spear you can stab over the shield wall..A sword and a shield you can stay in front no problem. But you need to know when to attack and when to fall back. Also that youre a soldier like the rest but with more maneuverability and hit harder at times. Its also possible to do heavy infantry early on but then you must play more conservatively since you are slow because of the weight. And if you get surrounded and not saved by an cav man or an miracle from the greek gods

When you choose your character you can tailor that in the beginning to along with the story. You get pretty much skills on the tailored you choose. However you cant be alot at once if you want to be really good at it

Unless you are playing on low damage I don't see how you can survive in the shieldwall as your shield will fall apart in less than 10 seconds from multiple hits. You should be able to kill a few enemy but you'll go down and lose the ability to command your troops. Stabbing with a spear over the shielwall is probably the best way if you want to remain static, otherwise posting on the flank and being careful you aren't flanked yourself it is usually possible to survive the entire battle.

I haven't seen anyone post a video of them standing in the middle of the shieldwall and surviving a real fight vs mid to high tier units in equal numbers in more than a skirmish. Maybe someone out there can but that would require luck as well as skill.

I do agree about agility (athletics in game) and fighting conservatively are primary attributes of surviving as infantry. I have rambo'd some bandit hideouts but it is rare you will fight more then 4-5 at a time in those and most experienced MB players with decent gear can handle that.

 

[Dr-Shinobi]

I haven't seen anyone post a video of them standing in the middle of the shieldwall and surviving a real fight vs mid to high tier units in equal numbers in more than a skirmish. Maybe someone out there can but that would require luck as well as skill.

Not sure what situation youre talking about here but if i got you right i have provided pleanty of times support behind an shield wall while my AI friends have been holding them off even against higher Tier soldiers. Sure sometimes they break thru but its usually no biggie because of your second line soldiers or archers. Sure flanks can be good to since you have more space to fight as well as stabbing them in the back or in the sides while they are busy...However then youre also open against archers and sneaking cav which you are anyways at all times Its situational in my meaning. Are you a lot surrounded keep behind the wall in my opinion then support flanks if needed
Or did i get you wrong here ? Shields can still tank pretty well at highest diff setting...One thing ive noticed though is that enemy throwing axes does almost non damage to your shield which is a shame. Got hit with two on my ****ty shield yesterday and still had like 98% left or something

 

[Ichon]

Not sure what situation youre talking about here but if i got you right i have provided pleanty of times support behind an shield wall while my AI friends have been holding them off even against higher Tier soldiers. Sure sometimes they break thru but its usually no biggie because of your second line soldiers or archers. Sure flanks can be good to since you have more space to fight as well as stabbing them in the back or in the sides while they are busy...However then youre also open against archers and sneaking cav which you are anyways at all times Its situational in my meaning. Are you a lot surrounded keep behind the wall in my opinion then support flanks if needed
Or did i get you wrong here ? Shields can still tank pretty well at highest diff setting...

IN the shieldwall... plenty of people can stand behind it- there is really no difference from sitting behind on a horse shooting arrows, using a crossbow and shield, poking with a spear, etc. I am saying as it stands players can't stand IN the shieldwall front rank or usually even the 2nd rank because the AI are suicidal and go for kills over self preservation and shields fall apart after a handful of hits so there is really no point in playing infantry like that.

Already mentioned several ways to play infantry and your videos have shown those too- I am only making the point that in current M&B it is impossible to fight IN the front ranks if you want to last the battle. I've last pretty long by conserving attacks to the bare minimum and picking up the shields of those who fell and the situation is better than at launch when melee infantry could phase through each other so 4-6 attacks arrived at the same time instantly shattering the shield but M&B is still made to play as a 2nd or 3rd line fighter despite in history most of the skilled fighters fought on the front line because they had the best equipment and discipline.

M&B is a game and without stamina and several other mechanics that are missing will never model historical fighting. Unfortunately, M&B has called behind- it was revolutionary at the beginning but not several other games are doing the fighting better and the only thing M&B has is the blend of RPG and action fps fighting- neither done very well. So all the talk about historical this or that- at its core M&B fails at the main focus of the game so unless that is fixed all the rest of the discussion based on history is pointless and TW should just focus on making it fun.

 

[Dr-Shinobi]

IN the shieldwall... plenty of people can stand behind it- there is really no difference from sitting behind on a horse shooting arrows, using a crossbow and shield, poking with a spear, etc. I am saying as it stands players can't stand IN the shieldwall front rank or usually even the 2nd rank because the AI are suicidal and go for kills over self preservation and shields fall apart after a handful of hits so there is really no point in playing infantry like that.

Like this ?

Damn OP cav ...thought i had this one in the bags but nope ^^ Prob since i forgot about my infantry still attacking and they got punished ^^ Had such good formation with them why mess it up xD Also should had split my cav 10/10 on each side