Marnid & Borcha - What good are they?
- Thread starter lokiju
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There was a thread a while back about this.
The reasons are obvious: You can delegate party and training skills to them so you can spend your own points on something else, and although they're crap to start with, after they get some experience and proper equipment, they're deadlier than any unit in the game.
The reasons are obvious: You can delegate party and training skills to them so you can spend your own points on something else, and although they're crap to start with, after they get some experience and proper equipment, they're deadlier than any unit in the game.
Exactly. And their combat skills are an added bonus, not to mention that getting them new gear gives you something to do after you run out of ways to spend money on yourself.
JohnathanStrange
Recruit
Borcha (whispering to Marnid): What are they saying about us?
Marnid (with his ear to the forum): Something about you being useless.
Borcha (raises voice in protest): Me? You're the one who got knocked out by those peasant women!
Marnid (becoming agitated): Well, there were a dozen of them!
Borcha (interrupting): They were on our side!
Marnid: And you, always going off on your own, never listening to orders...
Borcha (angrily): Enough! Borcha doesn't follow the orders of some so-called hero who barely can remember which end of a broadsword to hold!
Marnid (angrily): Lot of good you were at Rivacheg yesterday...
Borcha (enraged) pulls out club, swings wildly at Marnid knocking him unconscious even as Marnid's hastily thrown helmet in return sends Borcha to dreamland.
Marnid (with his ear to the forum): Something about you being useless.
Borcha (raises voice in protest): Me? You're the one who got knocked out by those peasant women!
Marnid (becoming agitated): Well, there were a dozen of them!
Borcha (interrupting): They were on our side!
Marnid: And you, always going off on your own, never listening to orders...
Borcha (angrily): Enough! Borcha doesn't follow the orders of some so-called hero who barely can remember which end of a broadsword to hold!
Marnid (angrily): Lot of good you were at Rivacheg yesterday...
Borcha (enraged) pulls out club, swings wildly at Marnid knocking him unconscious even as Marnid's hastily thrown helmet in return sends Borcha to dreamland.
JohnathanStrange
Recruit
Ingolifs said:
In the absence of anything more worthwhile to do in Caladria, I have been carefully shepherding the dynamic duo through the levels by assisting them in their combats and allowing them to gain the x points for the kill. However, even at the higher levels, they're just as knock-out-able (my own invented word).
I've seen them make spectacular kills from time to time and occasionally fight very well, but their general combat sense, their tactics, remain limited. It's not their strength levels or power strike or agility or whatever that needs adjusting, it's the intuition that it's better to avoid enemy mobs and best to keep moving if several enemies can reach you quickly.
Temujin
Banned
JohnathanStrange said:
could boosting their tactic level be a solution to this problem? does annyone know this?
or maybe the weapon you give them can be of influence? I've equiped both with bows as primary weapons, and often (especially Marnid) will try to keep some distance and circle around the mobs while shooting at them.
No, the only way to influence their behaviour at all is shouting orders and giving them different weapons.
Usually, if it looks like they're going to get into trouble, I tell them to follow me and gallop away from the enemy. This only works if they're still pretty far away from their foes, since all troops will ignore your orders when there are enemies within a certain range.
Usually, if it looks like they're going to get into trouble, I tell them to follow me and gallop away from the enemy. This only works if they're still pretty far away from their foes, since all troops will ignore your orders when there are enemies within a certain range.
dorni
Recruit
I've got them both decked out now. They used to look ridiculous in whatever armor I happened to pick up off the battlefield, but now they're stylin' 
Both fight with balanced swords of war. Marnid is in black armor, on an armored (heavy) charger. Borcha is in full silver armor atop a warhorse. They've both about level 24.
From what I've read in other treads, it could be very risky to equip them with range weapons. If they can shoot you (it seems), they will. I don't even let them hold rocks.
I used to think of Marnid as a clown who'd draw arrow fire for me and get the enemy to lower their shields and reveal their backs. He'd ride to one side of the enemy (with their spears, arrows and bolts) and then I'd go the other way, brandishing my deadly bow.
Now, though, that the pair are getting up into knight-range levels, they seem to pull their own weight. I still see them getting knocked out now and then, but I don't know how they compare to the knights in the party (which are pretty interchangable).
Both fight with balanced swords of war. Marnid is in black armor, on an armored (heavy) charger. Borcha is in full silver armor atop a warhorse. They've both about level 24.
From what I've read in other treads, it could be very risky to equip them with range weapons. If they can shoot you (it seems), they will. I don't even let them hold rocks.
I used to think of Marnid as a clown who'd draw arrow fire for me and get the enemy to lower their shields and reveal their backs. He'd ride to one side of the enemy (with their spears, arrows and bolts) and then I'd go the other way, brandishing my deadly bow.
Now, though, that the pair are getting up into knight-range levels, they seem to pull their own weight. I still see them getting knocked out now and then, but I don't know how they compare to the knights in the party (which are pretty interchangable).
JohnathanStrange
Recruit
Temujin said:
If by tactics you mean the skill "Tactics" on the character screen - that doesn't refer to tactical ability but to the number of your troopers that start each combat with you. Boosting their tactics level in the sense of increasing their A.I. is probably way more difficult!
Giving them bows keeps them from being easily swarmed, true, because they do keep their distance and they can make kills but...well let me give an example: Borcha (level 33) and Marnid (level 36) and I (level 49) run into easy prey: 15 river pirates. It doesn't get much easier than pirates. I hang back so the gruesome twosome can make some kills. Borcha with a 1h sword and warhorse rides into the mob and is killed within a couple of minutes, Marnid with a bow rides around wildly shooting, occasionally hitting, but otherwise doing little damage for 5 minutes. I get tired of that so I join the fray. Borcha's killed one, Marnid two, and I take the rest.
Borcha's and Marnid's flaws are often hidden when you have a team of knights and horsemen. Against lower level or outnumbered enemies, they seem fairly competent. The mistakes of attacking large groups or not staying mobile or not persistently firing on the same enemy - these are all less severe when your teammates are at your side. In fact, Borcha and Marnid can look very impressive against everyone from pirates to Dark Knights.
I still think their best use is to develop their non-battle skills (like surgery or pathfinding) so you can concentrate on developing your battle skills.
Qwertyest
Recruit
JohnathanStrange said:
Just wondering, how many game days did it take you to get Borcha and Marnid up to those levels?! LOL
I've been trying to play with a party of just me, Borcha, and Marnid, and have been finding them two to be complete useless in combat, even though both are riding Hunters, both have very good armour, and both have watered-steel Scimitars!
They generally get themselves knocked unconscious in the first minute of the battle, leaving me to kill everyone by myself!
JohnathanStrange
Recruit
Qwertyest said:JohnathanStrange said:
Just wondering, how many game days did it take you to get Borcha and Marnid up to those levels?! LOL
I've been trying to play with a party of just me, Borcha, and Marnid, and have been finding them two to be complete useless in combat, even though both are riding Hunters, both have very good armour, and both have watered-steel Scimitars!
They generally get themselves knocked unconscious in the first minute of the battle, leaving me to kill everyone by myself!
In that game, it's well over 700 days.
Your experience is mine.
Without other knights/troops to cover for them, Borcha and Marnid may as well stay in the tavern. After too many battles with the three of us against every type bandit in Caladria, I no longer call us "The Three Amigos."
Mithfindel
Recruit
With only the two partially-competent fellows and you, using those commands does make a big difference.
Commanding 'Follow me' and starting to make quick hit&run type charges on the enemy will keep them alive longer. Likely, they are knocked down at some point if you are facing a superior opponent, but they do last longer.
Commanding 'Follow me' and starting to make quick hit&run type charges on the enemy will keep them alive longer. Likely, they are knocked down at some point if you are facing a superior opponent, but they do last longer.
