I personally think that the devs made a big mistake trying to force a main story into a sandbox game.
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Main questline restricts gameplay and is plain boring.
- Thread starter Dhargo
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So far we can consider there is no real main story.
Nonetheless, M&B WFAS was good in this regard, so there is no real problem to have a story in game like M&B.
Actually I'd welcome a reuse of this story with this modernized engine. They could consider reusing older stories to provide content to the reworked engine.
I also had problems with finding the 10 nobles. I think that's the only really downside of the quest. I found the first after 60 days the second after a hundred. Because I thought I only need 10 random nobles I stayed a long time at the same place, but of course I did not found any other leaders there. After day 300 I finally decided to finish this quest and could found the needed lords with the help of the encyclopedia. But yeah after 3 lords I had given up the main quest, because I just wanted to play and not to run over the map.
I see why they decided to the quest like this and I liked the story, but man this map is too huge. Also if you play on realistic speed and have 40 foot units you can't catch up with most of the lords even if they are in huge armies. And then you have to bribe your way into the keeps in the cities, which is reasonable, but doesn't help with the quest but also doesn't really matter since the lords do not to tend to stay more than 2 hours in a city for some reason.
I see why they decided to the quest like this and I liked the story, but man this map is too huge. Also if you play on realistic speed and have 40 foot units you can't catch up with most of the lords even if they are in huge armies. And then you have to bribe your way into the keeps in the cities, which is reasonable, but doesn't help with the quest but also doesn't really matter since the lords do not to tend to stay more than 2 hours in a city for some reason.
Yeah... I think people that like to read stories in games might appreciate the lenghty dialogues, but personally the story did not grab my attension enough to immerse me. It's just nobles talking about stuff that happened long ago which you have no business with. Well, the quest MAKES IT your business, I guess...
Also, it wasn't very immersive that kings would just tell such lengthy stories in the middle of a field somewhere to a complete stranger.
And why did it have to be TEN nobles? Just having them be the kings would have been intuitive. Someone clearly didn't pay attention to how the gaming community has come to hate dull fetch quests.
Oh and how come only the quest giver woman has voiced dialogues? Lolol
That was so weird to have it come in out of nowhere. So confusing.
I love playing the game despite everything, but I'm beginning to think they should have gone for a September release. Clearly they ran out of money, and wanted bug testers that payed THEM instead of the other way around.
Also, it wasn't very immersive that kings would just tell such lengthy stories in the middle of a field somewhere to a complete stranger.
And why did it have to be TEN nobles? Just having them be the kings would have been intuitive. Someone clearly didn't pay attention to how the gaming community has come to hate dull fetch quests.
Oh and how come only the quest giver woman has voiced dialogues? Lolol
That was so weird to have it come in out of nowhere. So confusing.
I love playing the game despite everything, but I'm beginning to think they should have gone for a September release. Clearly they ran out of money, and wanted bug testers that payed THEM instead of the other way around.
Everyone in this thread needs to go to where they load their save games and the versions are listed. Notice how there’s two different versions listed for a campaign mode and a sandbox mode? Stop complaining about the campaign not being a sandbox when they’re two different things lol
Dhargo
Recruit
My feedback was not about not having a sandbox mode, but about the story being bad. But yeah, I think they also announced that they would only have the campaign mode for now as singleplayer content and will launch the sandbox later down the road. I think you are correct that some people may not be fully aware of that.
The main story of the game is really bad.
First of all, there should be a choice for those who do not want to participate in the story.Apart from that, it has no story background.
He goes to find our little brothers and we are told to find the banner pieces.(I think he's been dying trying to find it, as seen in the encyclopedia.)A return from the brother can be added in this regard.For example, after talking to lords, you may need to meet your brother. After a series of rescue missions continue, you can decide what to do with your brothers. Many clans in the game have their own family.Then it may be a nice touch to be asked to choose whether to add one of your brothers to your own clan (optional.).
The part after finding the banner is already a problem in itself. It is really unreasonable to talk to 10 people. You can take you to a historian in the inn, and then you may need to speak to one of some kingdoms with the information you get from him.
The task of ''stopping conspiracy'' after making a choice is very simple, what conspiracy?, what do I need to stop?, what do I need to do for this? Isn't it ridiculous to say go and stop something?In this section, a series of task add-ons that we need to do about conspiracy can be added.
Talking to Istiana (or argazos.), For example, take 3 settlements of this kingdom, loot 2 settlements, defeat 5 lords of that kingdom or go to somewhere and persuade someone to take their side, so that for the main task of the game. It also gives a continuity and a tasteful purpose.
First of all, there should be a choice for those who do not want to participate in the story.Apart from that, it has no story background.
He goes to find our little brothers and we are told to find the banner pieces.(I think he's been dying trying to find it, as seen in the encyclopedia.)A return from the brother can be added in this regard.For example, after talking to lords, you may need to meet your brother. After a series of rescue missions continue, you can decide what to do with your brothers. Many clans in the game have their own family.Then it may be a nice touch to be asked to choose whether to add one of your brothers to your own clan (optional.).
The part after finding the banner is already a problem in itself. It is really unreasonable to talk to 10 people. You can take you to a historian in the inn, and then you may need to speak to one of some kingdoms with the information you get from him.
The task of ''stopping conspiracy'' after making a choice is very simple, what conspiracy?, what do I need to stop?, what do I need to do for this? Isn't it ridiculous to say go and stop something?In this section, a series of task add-ons that we need to do about conspiracy can be added.
Talking to Istiana (or argazos.), For example, take 3 settlements of this kingdom, loot 2 settlements, defeat 5 lords of that kingdom or go to somewhere and persuade someone to take their side, so that for the main task of the game. It also gives a continuity and a tasteful purpose.
Yeah, I enjoy the story, but it needs to be optional and not gated-content. A bonus, not an obligation.
For example: you can create your own kingdom from the start, but then you would just be a rebellious upstart that get hated on and no recognition. Having the restored banner would give you a huge boost popularity and right-to-rule, etc..
For example: you can create your own kingdom from the start, but then you would just be a rebellious upstart that get hated on and no recognition. Having the restored banner would give you a huge boost popularity and right-to-rule, etc..
vemerce
Regular
I think that the way they're intending for this to work out, by the time the game is actually live, is that you'll do the quest once and then the factions will actually survive through the ages (and not be dominated in the first year) and you'll continue to play as your own heirs over and over again, so that you don't need to regularly restart with a brand new campaign.
It should also be said, though, that the main quest is able to be skipped once you're turned out into the open world. It'll fail all on its own after 10 years in the game have passed and you didn't finish it. That's the part I really don't agree with... If I want to back burner the main quest for 10 generations, whatever heir I have at the time should be able to go found their own kingdom. There should also be more than one way to start your own faction. Oh, and also, they should change it so that you can talk to ANY noble and they'll give you info, not just one specific person here and there.
It's a brilliant tutorial for learning basic follies of troop types, and eventually I hope also differying AI behaviour (ever aggressive Battanian, divided Vlandians, insubordinate Western Empire etc) that also sends you bouncing around the map, collecting Shiny nobles.
But while functionally great, I agree it feels more like a side-quest.
Which reminds me, did we ever actually buy back our loved ones?
Anyhow, the conspiracy thread could likewise reflect our knowledge of quest types issued in given region, or info from Spy Party quests if there are repeat offenders. Pushy gang leaders. Conversations about politics. I keep wondering how many tags are used for text blocks in quests. That portion of the game I hope could carry some logic logging tags you cleared (ie having been a caravan escort, hearing thoughts about politics of a shifty lord, having released a lord from capture, clearing X margin in barter or trade etc), we'll see if it comes thtough mods or main, but I'm pretty sure people will have fun playing with that.
But while functionally great, I agree it feels more like a side-quest.
Which reminds me, did we ever actually buy back our loved ones?
Anyhow, the conspiracy thread could likewise reflect our knowledge of quest types issued in given region, or info from Spy Party quests if there are repeat offenders. Pushy gang leaders. Conversations about politics. I keep wondering how many tags are used for text blocks in quests. That portion of the game I hope could carry some logic logging tags you cleared (ie having been a caravan escort, hearing thoughts about politics of a shifty lord, having released a lord from capture, clearing X margin in barter or trade etc), we'll see if it comes thtough mods or main, but I'm pretty sure people will have fun playing with that.
My 2 cents about this: Same like viking conquest make the option to do a storyline run or a sandbox run.
- Lost family: This segment of the game should be about fighting the different bandits, interacting with gang leaders and ransom brokers that got a hold on your brothers (You do a mission for them and the tell you the info/You kill them and make the gang leader a prisioner until he/she spills the beans) Finally you would found that they are slaves of a minor faction giving you the choice to storm their headquarters, barter their freedom, sneak into their turf or abandon your kin.
When you finish this quest your brothers should join your clan and party.
- Older Brother: Great warrior, tactitian, etc... great for creating another party.
- Younger Brother: Great merchant, charm and fast, ideal for creating a caravan.
- Younger Sister: Great Stewardship, engineering and medic ideal for a governor.
- Banner saga: Until this point only minor wars has broken out, the status quo is mostly mantained as wars would without conquest and only gold taken. However rumors of someone seraching for the remmants of the banner have worsened the relationships between realms. Now the real war starts while you are searching for the dragon banner.
I could see missions being:
The sturgian part: after asking lords about it they will point that it is said that the sturgians took the banner so you should aks them. A sturgian lord may tell you the story if your relationship is beyond x or x+ if you are from the empire or tell you for free if you are sturgian. They tell you that the banner was broken and while the high king kept the pieces 2 of them were stolen in a stormy night. In the end the only way to get the sturgian part is to beat the king in either a war, in a tournament or stealing sneaking in the keep.
The Asarai part: After you get 1 part you will encounter a courier from a rich merchant in Asarai, it seems that the got a hold on the 2º part and he wishes to purchase yours as well. The truth is that he is the child of the depised Asarai hero, and he intends to get the banner to clean his father name. So you can accept the offer and gain 100.000 on spot or you can decline, however if you decline bandits and mercenaries will try to hunt you down (big stacks not 4-15 stacks) When you confront the merchant about this he propose to make a bet to see who is more fitted to reforge the banner he taunts you to a gold race, the one who can make more gold in 1 month/year wins the bet and the banner: You can accept, you can sneak or you can decline and seize the banner by force.
The Empire part: The three emperors quarrel about who should have the banner while they stay in Licarion (no war between empires) So it is time for a trial in which you should convince and/or find ways to blackmail the emperors into submission in this matter. Of course you can be sneaky to and get the banner or fight the 3 emperor army and the garrison of Lycarion to retrieve it.
After you get the 3 parts of the banner you should decide between:
- Give the banner to a faction: You enter as vassal of said faction and recieve a huge recruitment bonus and lower wages for your soldiers.
- Unite the realm: Conquer everything.
- Lost family: This segment of the game should be about fighting the different bandits, interacting with gang leaders and ransom brokers that got a hold on your brothers (You do a mission for them and the tell you the info/You kill them and make the gang leader a prisioner until he/she spills the beans) Finally you would found that they are slaves of a minor faction giving you the choice to storm their headquarters, barter their freedom, sneak into their turf or abandon your kin.
When you finish this quest your brothers should join your clan and party.
- Older Brother: Great warrior, tactitian, etc... great for creating another party.
- Younger Brother: Great merchant, charm and fast, ideal for creating a caravan.
- Younger Sister: Great Stewardship, engineering and medic ideal for a governor.
- Banner saga: Until this point only minor wars has broken out, the status quo is mostly mantained as wars would without conquest and only gold taken. However rumors of someone seraching for the remmants of the banner have worsened the relationships between realms. Now the real war starts while you are searching for the dragon banner.
I could see missions being:
The sturgian part: after asking lords about it they will point that it is said that the sturgians took the banner so you should aks them. A sturgian lord may tell you the story if your relationship is beyond x or x+ if you are from the empire or tell you for free if you are sturgian. They tell you that the banner was broken and while the high king kept the pieces 2 of them were stolen in a stormy night. In the end the only way to get the sturgian part is to beat the king in either a war, in a tournament or stealing sneaking in the keep.
The Asarai part: After you get 1 part you will encounter a courier from a rich merchant in Asarai, it seems that the got a hold on the 2º part and he wishes to purchase yours as well. The truth is that he is the child of the depised Asarai hero, and he intends to get the banner to clean his father name. So you can accept the offer and gain 100.000 on spot or you can decline, however if you decline bandits and mercenaries will try to hunt you down (big stacks not 4-15 stacks) When you confront the merchant about this he propose to make a bet to see who is more fitted to reforge the banner he taunts you to a gold race, the one who can make more gold in 1 month/year wins the bet and the banner: You can accept, you can sneak or you can decline and seize the banner by force.
The Empire part: The three emperors quarrel about who should have the banner while they stay in Licarion (no war between empires) So it is time for a trial in which you should convince and/or find ways to blackmail the emperors into submission in this matter. Of course you can be sneaky to and get the banner or fight the 3 emperor army and the garrison of Lycarion to retrieve it.
After you get the 3 parts of the banner you should decide between:
- Give the banner to a faction: You enter as vassal of said faction and recieve a huge recruitment bonus and lower wages for your soldiers.
- Unite the realm: Conquer everything.
+1 for your ideas.I would like to start the game with my family members.The banner part also good, it can be everything for me.Just please more main missions like viking conquest.
Scosha
Recruit
Totally agree that the main story line quest restricts game play and hinders it later if you decided to go more sandbox. For instance if you join other factions and take part in wars you maybe blocked from the towns that the main story characters are located in making it impossible to continue the story. Not that is goes anywhere at the moment, but it would stop you from getting the flag, going independent etc.)
1. This is early Access!
2. Nope they did not run out of money, they opened the game to early access because the community wanted it.
3. Yes we are bug testers, yes you could think this is not your job, but since this is early access there is no point in complaining about a unfinished game.
I think a big problem with the main quest is that it doesn't even teach you the game mechanics you really need to know. There's the short tutorial at the training field, but that only teaches basic fighting mechanics and you can do that without the storyline. The rest of the quest just has you chasing people around the world and clearing bandit hideouts. If you never played Mount & Blade before, you might think the main point of the game was clearing bandit hideouts.
If they really wanted to push the dynastic aspect of the game, they could create an intro sequence where you start out playing as your character's parent, who's already an experienced commander leading troops in battle. And then they could give you battle-related missions that teach you all the different aspects of commanding armies in battle and on the worldmap, and maybe even introduce some of the political aspects of gameplay. And at the end of the tutorial, the intro character dies in a big battle and you pick up as their child starting from square one, which would drive home the whole multi-generational idea that they seem to be going for. The big battle could be the very same one you have to ask the lords about, so they could dump all that lore on you by having you experience it firsthand rather than having it told to you by 10 different people. Something like this would give you a taste of what the game was all about right at the beginning, so when it sets you out on your own you have a better idea of what you're working towards.
If they really wanted to push the dynastic aspect of the game, they could create an intro sequence where you start out playing as your character's parent, who's already an experienced commander leading troops in battle. And then they could give you battle-related missions that teach you all the different aspects of commanding armies in battle and on the worldmap, and maybe even introduce some of the political aspects of gameplay. And at the end of the tutorial, the intro character dies in a big battle and you pick up as their child starting from square one, which would drive home the whole multi-generational idea that they seem to be going for. The big battle could be the very same one you have to ask the lords about, so they could dump all that lore on you by having you experience it firsthand rather than having it told to you by 10 different people. Something like this would give you a taste of what the game was all about right at the beginning, so when it sets you out on your own you have a better idea of what you're working towards.
andycott
Sergeant
TW, please, pay attention to this.
Just give us a choice, whether we want to play with the main storyline or what most fans wanted from the start - sandbox without this story.
This mod may solve the problem, but f.e. it's incompatible with beta 1.3. And when it will be, every new patch will have a chance for it to become incompatible again, etc.
Personally for me it means I won't start a new campaign until these are compatible, because I find the story and the quests in it horrible and boring and have no wish to go through them again.
Just give us a choice, whether we want to play with the main storyline or what most fans wanted from the start - sandbox without this story.
Personally for me it means I won't start a new campaign until these are compatible, because I find the story and the quests in it horrible and boring and have no wish to go through them again.
Really nice suggestion... A little reminiscent of AC Odyssey, but I like it, and it makes more sense than what is currently on offer.
StewVader
No actually, they aren't clear about anything. We don't know if the game is 20% developed or 80%. We have no information about the current state of development.
Main questline is 100% unfinished and should not be in the game until it is. Even then it should be optional and not nearly as restrictive, not a fan of the VC like story where I had to chase my mother i just met across brittania, but now its my siblings. Just let me sandbox in the native warband fashion. Your siblings don't even exist in the files yet, chaikand is just a placeholder for your brother since he's not actually set to go anywhere.
We shouldn't even be able to pretend we're nobles in the main questline, its just dumb, let us work up to it.
We shouldn't even be able to pretend we're nobles in the main questline, its just dumb, let us work up to it.
