Lords ALWAYS want peace at exactly the wrong time.

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Doofus

Veteran
In my starting post I commented; "Why can't the kingdom strength actually reflect the total of all the armies of the lords in the kingdom (plus mercs) instead of including the town/castle defenses? I would like to know how my empire's fighting force matches against theirs. If I have 20 of their lords in prison, do they even have a fighting force? Should I expect an army of 1k to try to stop me from taking a town or do they only have a total of about 300 mobile troops?" The new game I started with 1.5.10 (the above comments were on 1.5.9. Now in 1.5.10 they don't tell you how many holding you or the enemy have taken. Why? In my opinion, the most important thing in war is taking territory. Now they don't even track it? WTF Taleworlds?
 

Doofus

Veteran
http://prntscr.com/14gsn7n Sooo...the losers in my kingdom want to declare war on the Western Empire. Looks good on the surface, right? Well...here's our current status...

http://prntscr.com/14gsy2k We are already in 3 wars, although realistically we haven't really fought the Khuzaits. They aren't even close to us. Sturgian war looks good, right? Well...

http://prntscr.com/14gtbjn This is our armies. Erdurand's & Leontia's Armies are both fighting the Sturgians. Its basically been a draw there since I whomped on1000 of their troops at the start of that war. After that I had to go fight the Aserai as they had taken at least a town and castle and no one else was even fighting them. Sooo....here's the Aserai war...

http://prntscr.com/14gtyrz I came down and gathered a force of over 1600. Defeated about 1k of them at Askar. Besieged Sanala & defeated their garrison of 900+. then fought a battle outside of Sanala killing another 1k. Finally, I tried to take back Iyakis. They attacked me while besieging it there with another 1k, which they lost. But although it shows me with 611 troops remaining, I only have 254 healthy attackers in my army. Iyakis is out of food, but they have over 330 troops defending it & I'll likely be attacked again before getting a reasonable opportunity to take it. So overall, we've lost at least a castle here and traded Iyakis for Sanala. that might be considered a decent result, but beside the 3 armies I showed previously the closest parties are 5-6 days away, so they will likely be taking Sanala back.

So tell me why, logically, over 90% of this empire (Vlandia) think declaring war on the Western Empire is a good idea. Incidentally, I think the only holdings bordering the Western Empire are mine (I hold Epicrotia, Gersegos Castle, Hertogea Castle, Lageta, Jalmarys, and Ortysia)d, so its not like these lords have land disputes with the Western Empire. Incidentally, no, I'm not the ruler of the kingdom either, so I can't override them.
 
So tell me why, logically, over 90% of this empire (Vlandia) think declaring war on the Western Empire is a good idea.
The power of thier field parties and garrisons exceeds the needed amount based on the prosperity value of the fiefs so they want more and more wars. The better they do the more they will want. Or something like that, it's to make a faction have a hard time steamrolling other factions.

It's probably working huh? faction's making you do a lot of work to carry it on your back and defeat all the enemy armies 💪
If not for your handy work they would eventually face some set backs from so many wars and become less aggressive. However if they lose too much they again become very aggressive.
 

Apocal

Grandmaster Knight
http://prntscr.com/14gsn7n Sooo...the losers in my kingdom want to declare war on the Western Empire. Looks good on the surface, right? Well...here's our current status...

http://prntscr.com/14gsy2k We are already in 3 wars, although realistically we haven't really fought the Khuzaits. They aren't even close to us. Sturgian war looks good, right? Well...

http://prntscr.com/14gtbjn This is our armies. Erdurand's & Leontia's Armies are both fighting the Sturgians. Its basically been a draw there since I whomped on1000 of their troops at the start of that war. After that I had to go fight the Aserai as they had taken at least a town and castle and no one else was even fighting them. Sooo....here's the Aserai war...

http://prntscr.com/14gtyrz I came down and gathered a force of over 1600. Defeated about 1k of them at Askar. Besieged Sanala & defeated their garrison of 900+. then fought a battle outside of Sanala killing another 1k. Finally, I tried to take back Iyakis. They attacked me while besieging it there with another 1k, which they lost. But although it shows me with 611 troops remaining, I only have 254 healthy attackers in my army. Iyakis is out of food, but they have over 330 troops defending it & I'll likely be attacked again before getting a reasonable opportunity to take it. So overall, we've lost at least a castle here and traded Iyakis for Sanala. that might be considered a decent result, but beside the 3 armies I showed previously the closest parties are 5-6 days away, so they will likely be taking Sanala back.

So tell me why, logically, over 90% of this empire (Vlandia) think declaring war on the Western Empire is a good idea. Incidentally, I think the only holdings bordering the Western Empire are mine (I hold Epicrotia, Gersegos Castle, Hertogea Castle, Lageta, Jalmarys, and Ortysia)d, so its not like these lords have land disputes with the Western Empire. Incidentally, no, I'm not the ruler of the kingdom either, so I can't override them.
Just to expand a bit on the response by @murtega, your faction is currently getting hit with the "Top Dog" effect; all the other factions are basically ganging up on you while your nobles are far more willing to fight it out with them, being so much more powerful than any other individual faction.
 

Doofus

Veteran
Regarding Khuzaits, I think we've had war declared by them a couple years ago and neither one of us has besieged anything of the others. They are about 3 towns away from us at their closest point. I have another thread about that, but thats basically a war in name only. What's interesting is at one time it showed they had 1 successful raid to our none. Now it doesn't even show their raid.

Apocal, I kind of understand the others wanting to gang up on us and take us down. If we are in multiple wars, its the perfect time for it. But why are my lords wanting that (besides the stupidity of the War 'logic')? Logically they should just want to wipe the floor with the opponent(s) we already have. I mean, if they had territory next to the Western Empire they might want to expand there figuring they would be awarded anything bordering their holdings. But I'm the only one with borders on Western Empire territories. Logically they should want to get back what they lost to the Aserai, but instead the only parties even in Aserai Territory are part of my army. I recruited them before entering Aserai territory and I think 3 parties were already in their territory. Two of those I believe were mercenary parties. The rest I brought down here. Not a single other party has come down to help here despite us having 14 clans. Does this surprise me? No, I've played enough that it doesn't. But is it logical? Absolutely not. To be blunt, I post this to try to embarrass Taleworlds into fixing it.
 

Apocal

Grandmaster Knight
The new game I started with 1.5.10 (the above comments were on 1.5.9. Now in 1.5.10 they don't tell you how many holding you or the enemy have taken. Why? In my opinion, the most important thing in war is taking territory. Now they don't even track it? WTF Taleworlds?
Hey, do you not see the successful sieges when you hover your mouse over the towns/castles on the war screen?
 

murtega

Knight
Regarding Khuzaits, I think we've had war declared by them a couple years ago and neither one of us has besieged anything of the others. They are about 3 towns away from us at their closest point. I have another thread about that, but thats basically a war in name only. What's interesting is at one time it showed they had 1 successful raid to our none. Now it doesn't even show their raid.

I meant Khuzaits as a general issue rather than specific to your playthrough. They are (actually how TW refuses nerfing them is) the reason why we have this frustrating campaign AI and war/peace cycle at the moment. It is trying to stop you from taking over Calradia, doesn't matter as your ally or enemy.
You're apparently stronger than the 3 kingdoms you're fighting at the moment, so AI thinks "Let's bring in a 4th enemy on board to balance things out". You're also paying them tribute it seems and AI hates it more than anything the war brings. Losing half of our towns to enemy? No problem, as long as they pay us when we make peace!
Logical way should have been that WE declares war on you but they're probably having another going on at the moment and AI is also programmed to avoid multiple wars if they're not stronger than enemy combined. It is why your allies instead are doing the trick.
The worst is this weird solution didn't even stop Khuzaits to be OP anyway. They still steamroll, though just slower than before. I played tens of campaigns and they never ever lose a single fief to anybody.
 

Doofus

Veteran
Previous campaign I played Aserai & we pretty much steamrolled the Khuzaits. Before I became leader of the Aserai I held 5 Khuzait towns and they had moved to a different area. One thing they seem to have fixed with the 1.5.9 update is you can get more than 2 or 3 holdings now. Although I also try to use strategy when attacking the enemy so that I'm the only one next to the town/castle we just took, whenever possible.

Apocal, thank you. Never hovered over the graphs before. I do see, now, where it shows what castles & towns have been taken, as well as what lords are prisoners. I find the raid thing interesting though. It shows what successful raids my faction has made, but not them..Funny seeing my current screen with Aserai. We have one successful raid ('Medeni'). They have 24 successful raids ('There is no successful raid for Aserai').
 

Doofus

Veteran
Actually, there's apparently bugs with the castle/town thing as well. My war with the Sturgians it says both sides have taken Ov Castle, which is accurate. We have also taken Omor, they have taken no towns, and this is reported accurately. But with my Aserai war it says neither side has taken castles or towns. They started with Sanala. We've taken it, I think, 3 times and currently hold it. They've taken it back at least twice. Also, although I'm not sure because this war has been going on a while, I believe we started with Iyakis and have not taken it back at all. But it doesn't say they've taken that either.
 

Apocal

Grandmaster Knight
Actually, there's apparently bugs with the castle/town thing as well. My war with the Sturgians it says both sides have taken Ov Castle, which is accurate. We have also taken Omor, they have taken no towns, and this is reported accurately. But with my Aserai war it says neither side has taken castles or towns. They started with Sanala. We've taken it, I think, 3 times and currently hold it. They've taken it back at least twice. Also, although I'm not sure because this war has been going on a while, I believe we started with Iyakis and have not taken it back at all. But it doesn't say they've taken that either.
Yeah, something is bugged there and I'm trying to figure out exactly what it is before I drop a report.
 

Doofus

Veteran
Looks like it only shows recent changes. Whether that is last day, last 7 days, last season or what I couldn't say, but its definitely not for the duration of the war, so in the long run it doesn't really work right, imho. Most important thing for me in a war is how much territory a side gets in the war. I don't care whether thats for 1 day or for 200 days. I want to know for the whole war duration.
 

mexxico

Sergeant Knight
Looks like it only shows recent changes. Whether that is last day, last 7 days, last season or what I couldn't say, but its definitely not for the duration of the war, so in the long run it doesn't really work right, imho. Most important thing for me in a war is how much territory a side gets in the war. I don't care whether thats for 1 day or for 200 days. I want to know for the whole war duration.
Yes there is a bug there. Probably it is showing only recent ones. Actually I prefer showing successful sieges to player with one additional bar like in old days because it is something satisfying to see for player. Player should see it at first glance and get direct info (without moving mouse 4 different places) about process of war. I reported it internal. However there is no place for extra information there. I hope they lower font size and bar height and place successful sieges data over successful raids info or at least show all data correctly at mouse over.
 

iRkshz

Regular
you forgot to add something
when your lords propose to declare war, you have 48 hours to make decisions (this time gives you the opportunity, for example, to leave enemy territory or get out of a potential encirclement)
but when you (as a king) want to declare war, it happens instantly, so very often your lords with their army will be captured, because they were AFK in the potential enemy's town or castle
it's awful, especially when these lords have massive t5 troops

time must be given to make decisions, and a command must be triggered for friendly lords (during this decision) to leave a potentially enemy town or castle and go into friendly territory
 

Doofus

Veteran
The time limit also applies for peace declarations. I use that time for a couple of things...1) If I'm close to a town with some prisoners in it I'll quick unload them for extra ransom before the peace takes place. 2) If I'm we are in the process of besieging a town/castle I try to wait before accepting in the hopes that the lord doing the sieging is able to complete the siege before the cease fire goes through. If I'm the besieger I'll try hard to get the siege done & if I'm not the besieger I'll try to join the besiegers, if they are close, to help and complete the siege.

Doesn't always work out, but taking an extra town or unloading lord prisoners before the time limit doesn't change the terms of the peace offering.
 

Doofus

Veteran
More or less bumping this thread.

Current game, 1.6.0. I'm the leader of the Aserai. We are currently in 3 wars. Here's the status of each. http://prntscr.com/1l9oi9i, http://prntscr.com/1l9or3g, http://prntscr.com/1l9p0bx

Southern Empire war has been going on forever. I'm guessing over a year in game time. They declared on us and I ended another war that was going on almost immediately. I'm basically the only one fighting it, occasionally by creating an army with others, mostly just on my own. Mostly a stalemate other than the prisoners, raids & casualties inflicted. Probably 1/2 their military is mercs. We've mostly gained Morenia without losing territory, but recently they've taken Sestadaim, which, of course is the only one mentioned by the game so it should be considered a draw with them receiving unreasonable losses. Most of the time they've wanted tribute from us to end it, but occasionally (even before they took Sestadaim) they've offered tribute.

We've been at war with Khuzait for a while now. I believe we declared on them because I didn't want to waste the influence overriding my lord's decision (100% voted for it, of course) and I also figured they would be more likely to end the Southern Empire war if we had another another opponent. Despite my lack of involvement we've taken 2 or 3 territories from them, including Makeb. They've taken nothing. Of course the game mentions only one castle we've taken. The Khuzaits have been offering us tribute to end it pretty much the whole time.

The Northern Empire war is fairly recent. They declared on us. They've recently taken both Makeb & a Khuzait castle (Jogurys) from us. We've taken nothing. Mostly they've been wanting tribute from us, but since they recently took 2 of our territories they are willing to pay us now.

So...here's some points... Since the war with the Southern Empire started 0% of my lords have wanted peace with anyone. I've checked numerous times, particularly since the war with the Khuzaits started. I tend to check more often when one of our holdings is being besieged figuring maybe my lords don't want to lose their territories..

Here's some questions...

My war strategy is balanced (I never change it). Why do they have a total of 38 successful raids and I have a total of 0? I don't particularly like raids and don't do them myself, but I would certainly think some of my lords would, particularly the one or two mercs I've hired.

Why do 100% of my lords ALWAYS want war? Even when their territories are being besieged with no one going to defend them they don't want to end the war to avoid losing their territory. I'm willing to pay influence to end wars and occasionally I propose ending a war even with 0% support (hoping maybe I can end it with maybe 400-500 influence). But it always would cost between 900 & 1100 influence to override my lords. Honestly this is my biggest complaint as far as this thread is concerned. I only have about 1500-2000 influence at any time and if I spend 1k of it when I am not desperate I won't have it once I become desperate. I can understand some lords wanting to continue wars, maybe even over 50%. But in a year of game time you are going to tell me not one lord is EVER going to want a war to end, even when we are warring 3 kingdoms and even when they are about to lose a territory if the war continues? Fix this ****, Taleworlds.

Someone mentioned earlier in this thread that the lords love money and resist ending war when they have to pay money. Right now they could choose any of the 3 that we are at war with and gain tribute. Nope. They don't want it.

Quite frankly what would make sense would have been to make peace with the Southern Empire probably 10 game days ago when they were offering us tribute and we had gained a territory (which doesn't show). It would also make sense to make peace at pretty much any time against the Khuzaits after taking Makeb, a castle, and possibly one other territory, when they were offering us tribute. Then we could concentrate on the Northern Empire and probably successfully defended our territories or, if not, certainly would be able to take them back.
 
i feel the devs are balancing the game in a way where they prefer the players behave like their AI rather than program AI to behave like how the players would. kinda shows how little they are playing their own game.
 

Blood Gryphon

Master Knight
WBVC
More or less bumping this thread.

Current game, 1.6.0. I'm the leader of the Aserai. We are currently in 3 wars. Here's the status of each. http://prntscr.com/1l9oi9i, http://prntscr.com/1l9or3g, http://prntscr.com/1l9p0bx

Southern Empire war has been going on forever. I'm guessing over a year in game time. They declared on us and I ended another war that was going on almost immediately. I'm basically the only one fighting it, occasionally by creating an army with others, mostly just on my own. Mostly a stalemate other than the prisoners, raids & casualties inflicted. Probably 1/2 their military is mercs. We've mostly gained Morenia without losing territory, but recently they've taken Sestadaim, which, of course is the only one mentioned by the game so it should be considered a draw with them receiving unreasonable losses. Most of the time they've wanted tribute from us to end it, but occasionally (even before they took Sestadaim) they've offered tribute.

We've been at war with Khuzait for a while now. I believe we declared on them because I didn't want to waste the influence overriding my lord's decision (100% voted for it, of course) and I also figured they would be more likely to end the Southern Empire war if we had another another opponent. Despite my lack of involvement we've taken 2 or 3 territories from them, including Makeb. They've taken nothing. Of course the game mentions only one castle we've taken. The Khuzaits have been offering us tribute to end it pretty much the whole time.

The Northern Empire war is fairly recent. They declared on us. They've recently taken both Makeb & a Khuzait castle (Jogurys) from us. We've taken nothing. Mostly they've been wanting tribute from us, but since they recently took 2 of our territories they are willing to pay us now.

So...here's some points... Since the war with the Southern Empire started 0% of my lords have wanted peace with anyone. I've checked numerous times, particularly since the war with the Khuzaits started. I tend to check more often when one of our holdings is being besieged figuring maybe my lords don't want to lose their territories..

Here's some questions...

My war strategy is balanced (I never change it). Why do they have a total of 38 successful raids and I have a total of 0? I don't particularly like raids and don't do them myself, but I would certainly think some of my lords would, particularly the one or two mercs I've hired.

Why do 100% of my lords ALWAYS want war? Even when their territories are being besieged with no one going to defend them they don't want to end the war to avoid losing their territory. I'm willing to pay influence to end wars and occasionally I propose ending a war even with 0% support (hoping maybe I can end it with maybe 400-500 influence). But it always would cost between 900 & 1100 influence to override my lords. Honestly this is my biggest complaint as far as this thread is concerned. I only have about 1500-2000 influence at any time and if I spend 1k of it when I am not desperate I won't have it once I become desperate. I can understand some lords wanting to continue wars, maybe even over 50%. But in a year of game time you are going to tell me not one lord is EVER going to want a war to end, even when we are warring 3 kingdoms and even when they are about to lose a territory if the war continues? Fix this ****, Taleworlds.

Someone mentioned earlier in this thread that the lords love money and resist ending war when they have to pay money. Right now they could choose any of the 3 that we are at war with and gain tribute. Nope. They don't want it.

Quite frankly what would make sense would have been to make peace with the Southern Empire probably 10 game days ago when they were offering us tribute and we had gained a territory (which doesn't show). It would also make sense to make peace at pretty much any time against the Khuzaits after taking Makeb, a castle, and possibly one other territory, when they were offering us tribute. Then we could concentrate on the Northern Empire and probably successfully defended our territories or, if not, certainly would be able to take them back.
Your lords don't want peace because you aren't losing, your strength is 12,507 vs 8,353(2,011+2,540+3,802) so they would probably be willing to fight another war.

Something you need to understand is when you vote for peace, even if the enemy would pay tribute, you are admitting defeat and getting a worse deal then if the enemy asks for peace.

In 1.6.0 enemy kingdoms can not ask the faction a player is in for peace, but in 1.6.1 they finally implemented this.
Kingdoms and Diplomacy
  • Enemy factions can now send peace offers to the player’s faction. The player can see these offers on the right part of the screen via notifications. If the player is the leader of the faction they can accept or decline these offers. If the player is a vassal then the offer is considered through the voting feature.
Now even if your lords dont want peace you should start to get offers from enemy kingdoms that don't want to fight a big kingdom like yours anymore. As king you don't even have to consult your lords.
 
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murtega

Knight
Southern Empire war has been going on forever. ... Probably 1/2 their military is mercs.
Rhagaea and her magical abilities to hire every single minor clan during a war. This woman probably ****s gold, otherwise I don't know how she's able to afford it. Ehm...
 
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