The mod didn't make it into the top 100 which I figured it wouldn't. But I can tell that even with the 3.92 release being delayed and completely missing the 3.93 release that the mod was still very close to the top 100 ranking. Unfortunately the only Warband mod to make it to the top 100 was Mount & Musket, and well... we all know how that is. Anyways I still haven't even pulled out the big guns yet. There are a lot of things happening in the background of the mod. Much of the stuff I have is just sitting on my laptop waiting to be implemented. Before I really start getting into the inner workings of 3.93 the mod needs to have EVERY Item in-game rebalanced, even the native items. After that is done I can focus on balancing the troops. So let's go big for 2012, and for the playing please take the time to vote, donate (which will be established later), or pitch in some ideas and suggestions. Even smallest things count! I know I can't mod on my energy so community activity is a big boost for me. Thanks everyone for playing the mod, next time let's get this mod in the top 10 spot.
Let's do it BIG in 2012!
- Thread starter Computica
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Bismarck
Knight
Formations: Marina needs a proper spearwall! I guess you're watching the progress of Caba'drin's PBOD mod, but will it be implemented and when?
Balancing: personally, I like Ron Losey's Realistic Combat Model, but he never delivered the promised Warband version. His balancing was way more realistic. It made heavy armour much more useful because those could only be penetrated with proper weapons like hammers, picks, bolts etc. He also made two-handed weapons slower than the one-handed ones. Native is far too arcade.
You've mentioned an alternative version of SoD called bloodshed or so. Would this support sea battles? I've always wanted to board other nations with my mighty Marinian fleet.
Balancing: personally, I like Ron Losey's Realistic Combat Model, but he never delivered the promised Warband version. His balancing was way more realistic. It made heavy armour much more useful because those could only be penetrated with proper weapons like hammers, picks, bolts etc. He also made two-handed weapons slower than the one-handed ones. Native is far too arcade.
You've mentioned an alternative version of SoD called bloodshed or so. Would this support sea battles? I've always wanted to board other nations with my mighty Marinian fleet.
Alavaria
Sergeant Knight at Arms
I thought that PoP had a system like that.Halrik said:
Or rather, if you beat down the enemy lords and took all their fiefs, they would go from a 200-strong mixed force to a 50-strong force of crap. It worked the other way around too, so it would get harder and harder to stop one faction that starts steam rolling.
But it would be really cool, because with all the many towns about, if an enemy faction got HUGE, wow - imagine Antarian lords running with 300+ men or 500+ (as the AI factions just stack more and more fiefs on its lords). Actually, that is painful..
Daedelus_McGee
Sergeant at Arms
Could we add a "Scholar" or "Sage" in every town so that all the expository dialogue missing from the mod gets deposited in one place in a simple format that I can do the coding for?
One of the drawbacks of being the most complex mod functioning is that it isn't fun when you can't understand the features, or even know they are there. It's great that the connoisseurs all love this mod, but to get the votes, we need to get a lot of folks playing.
If you want, we can have a general purpose "Scholar" available in the taverns, and a "Court Sage" included in the court rooms for those willing to part with a certain amount of coin. Each would cover different aspects of the game play.
As nice as the features are, they aren't clear to a lot of the players. I have no idea how to designate a duelist in a battle, for instance. I like the duel system, but the stakes of the contest and how to improve your side's standing are not clear from anything in the game. This and a lot of other stuff should be clear to the meanest understanding from methods readily discoverable in the game. I'm willing to do the instruction material for game features.
We need to delight the new mod players to get their votes. Even though you're probably getting a huge degree of support from the mod-builders, the players are a bunch more numerous.
One of the drawbacks of being the most complex mod functioning is that it isn't fun when you can't understand the features, or even know they are there. It's great that the connoisseurs all love this mod, but to get the votes, we need to get a lot of folks playing.
If you want, we can have a general purpose "Scholar" available in the taverns, and a "Court Sage" included in the court rooms for those willing to part with a certain amount of coin. Each would cover different aspects of the game play.
As nice as the features are, they aren't clear to a lot of the players. I have no idea how to designate a duelist in a battle, for instance. I like the duel system, but the stakes of the contest and how to improve your side's standing are not clear from anything in the game. This and a lot of other stuff should be clear to the meanest understanding from methods readily discoverable in the game. I'm willing to do the instruction material for game features.
We need to delight the new mod players to get their votes. Even though you're probably getting a huge degree of support from the mod-builders, the players are a bunch more numerous.
The Lich
Master Knight
Why not also add some tutorial based notes to the game log as well. If you have ever played Chronicles of Talera, a mod for Vanilla Mount and Blade, there was a pretty good explenation of factions and their kings. Before I read it I was "Hmm very cool, there are 5 different factions in the game that I don't know of, and I am roaming without a purpose in a land that I don't know of"; after I read it I became "OMG, I am going to bow before the undead king of Lich king and learn the dark arts from it's master, that his past is very known. Maybe he will teach me how to raise the dead too. I am eager to begin my wicked experiments on orc and human dead, to see which of the races are more useful. Oh god I better keep away from inquisitors too..." it goes off, because there were many things I was going to do.
Well there is a help menu in-game, I just haven't touched it yet, It might be easier to do that then plant a sage or a scholar.
Yes, I plan to implement this in the next release. Read the latest Mod History Page log, I think I called it "Fresh Air".Alavaria said:
Aye, the game doesn't check if lords have too many troops, so I'm planning on doing this for lords and making there excess troops into deserters or mercenary bands.Alavaria said:
Daedelus_McGee
Sergeant at Arms
Remember how many features you've added in the last year? A lot of it is great stuff, but if it isn't documented nobody knows about it from just downloading the mod.Computica said:
I don't need to have the sage/scholar per se, but people absorb knowledge better in the form of a story. In any case, because the point is to bring in a lot of new fans quickly, finding ways to get them to enjoy play faster is a priority.
Also, because you are from the real US, you have a certain amount of humility common to those of us in flyover country. One of the results of this is that you don't spend time blowing your own horn because you consider it obnoxious. I'm not asking you to change that, largely because I consider it obnoxious as well, but the message of how great this mod you're building is needs to get out so you can get the votes.
I have my own reasons for wanting to tell stories about the features of the game, but in this case, my goals and yours are complimentary. Those stories can be relayed by the Wandering Ashik, the Traveller, the Book Merchant (by the way, we need more books, and more of a Morrowind presentation), the Tavern Keeper, or the Ransom Broker without adding new characters.
I think compy's time at the moment is all about adding his new content, I know that half the stuff he is implemented isn't even working to the level that he wants it yet, from the talks that I have had with him half the stuff he is implementing is wheels within wheels and will do and have far more impact on the way everything works in the future, so adding a tutorialesc content at this moment maybe obselete with each new incarnation. 4.0 is where (I think) everything is planning to really come together, including story and such so i think explanations of features may have to wait until then as that is where (I think) the features of the mod will be working in a far more fully realised way.
So for now we will have to explore the realms of panovosa in that oh so mysterious way. Also I know that compy is very active on here and has always answered my questions on the forums within a couple of days, so if you get really stuck with something post a Q about it and I am sure an answer shall fall upon us all with the power of lightning!
So for now we will have to explore the realms of panovosa in that oh so mysterious way. Also I know that compy is very active on here and has always answered my questions on the forums within a couple of days, so if you get really stuck with something post a Q about it and I am sure an answer shall fall upon us all with the power of lightning!
Daedelus_McGee
Sergeant at Arms
1. I don't think 70,000 people will be willing to explore blindly or take the time to read (and translate) the archives here.LibSpit said:
2. If 70,000 people start playing the mod, Computica won't be able to answer all the questions. He'll be lucky to be able to answer any of the questions.
This is a matter of scope, and without in-game help that is readily available and fun, the mod won't build the scope. As charming as we all think we are, we are fairly hard-core gamers. We need to be able to attract the newbs and keep them playing long enough to vote.
Yes but like I said the game isn't even finished yet....So the rush to attract more players and get a higher ranking isn't computica's priority right now as he hasn't even finished his vision yet, so a lot of newbs won't necessarily be that interested until they have a story etc. to play through.
What Lib just said...LibSpit said:
Daedelus you have a good point, this is something I have planned to do at the beginning of the game. But I need to hold off as soon as the new features are in and finalized. Like I said before, the mod is about to get really complicated (By complicated I mean it will gain an steeper learning curve) and without documentation for the coming/preparation of 4.0.Daedelus_McGee said:
Define in detail what you mean by "RPG content"; are you talking story wise or feature wise. If feature what types of features. If by companions then yes. If by gameplay, then explain to what means/extent.Master Ronin said:
Alavaria
Sergeant Knight at Arms
Ah that would be amazing. So if the AI takes a castle with a bunch of prisoners, in a little bit the area will be filled with evil deserters.Computica said:
Is it possible to have deserter bands (rather than single unit parties) like how the bandits can group up? Organized ones though, like a bunch of Rhodoks excape, so they form a little group compete with spearmen, crossbows and a few scouts.
With Prisoners? No, probably not. Lords can earn too many prisoners, I had to limit the amount of prisoners bandits were getting though, there combined amounts were getting really ridiculous. If a castle is filled with prisoners the AI slowly converts them into troops, same for the player. I haven't capitalized on this system though. Yes it's possible to have deserter bands but I wouldn't do something like that myself.Alavaria said:
The Lich
Master Knight
Any kind of RPG content. Feature wise or story wise, doesn't matter. Are you planning any? Just curious...
At the beginning you start with a small company. Around 50 soldiers including some elite and low tier troops, as well as 3 nobles. Have no aim but making money, fame and experience. Possibly an army too- the same thing we do in every Mount and Blade singleplayer module. You do some merchant quests, join tournaments, rescue kidnapped girls, fight with bandits; maybe pillaging villages and looting caravans if you have an evil personality - the same thing we do in every Mount and Blade single player module. Later on we do serve a lord or gather an army very quickly to capture a castle as the base of our future empire - the same thing we do in every Mount and Blade single player modules.
Because after some time, it feels like the only thing you do is hiring mercenaries from taverns, selling prisoners to the ransom brokers, managing your fiefs -the same thing we do in every Mount and Blade single player module.
Well the last thing is, exceptional with the features of this mod. Nonetheless, it's not enough. It requires time and lots of it. The sword of damocles has very good features such as new and various factions, lots of troops, mercenaries, combat AI improvement, duelling before battles and others I am not aware of yet. Still, all of these are not major features. If this is a RTS mod, we should be planning our strategy all the time.
Yet planning a strategy is not a hard thing with unlimited money. Since you can make 230k from a tournament betting, or make profit because of your enterprises throughout Ponavosa... In that case RTS element somewhat fails. My suggestion is completely removing enterprises and tournament bettings. But making the player to start with a castle of our own empire. Or better, making the player to spawn with 80 elite troops; near a neutral castle with 40-50 troops. Beginning the story of our hero with a starting quest of conquesting the castle. (In this case the castle can be taken at all costs but not veery easily. The player should feel a little challenge, so he/she can enjoy the victory afterwards.) This would be a quick start-up and let the player to dive into RTS very quickly, as it's the main offering of this mod. In addition, our close neighbours should be feudal lords with 1 fief and should be enemy to the player's faction from the beginning. So there can be some competition between close neighbours. Therefore the player will be forced to conduct a good strategy from the very beginning. No need to say it will be the player's second quest to construct a monarchy (the questgiver can be an old advisor from the player's court). After this quest is completed the player should be faced with Ponavosan factions, thus this brings to the 3rd and 4th quests "expanding borders", "establishing an empire". The main idea to all of these is making the player to be in action all the time. At least that is the way I see how a top 10 mod should be.
______ ______
______*______
I believe what is expected from a game/module is keeping the player busy, all the time. As long as you are planning to do something, you won't get bored. That is like a golden rule. Just like living a life without a goal feels like you're living a regular day, it is the same thing. Of course idleness can be good if you enjoy it in life, but it is unlikely for games. A game you do nothing feels like waste of time. That's why community feedback is very important for developers, since developers don't have time as much as players have. Deserters and those kind of details are cool, but in my point of view there is a major factor lacking currently; something to arouse interest at the earlier stages of the game. Possibly at the latter stages of the game too.______*______
At the beginning you start with a small company. Around 50 soldiers including some elite and low tier troops, as well as 3 nobles. Have no aim but making money, fame and experience. Possibly an army too- the same thing we do in every Mount and Blade singleplayer module. You do some merchant quests, join tournaments, rescue kidnapped girls, fight with bandits; maybe pillaging villages and looting caravans if you have an evil personality - the same thing we do in every Mount and Blade single player module. Later on we do serve a lord or gather an army very quickly to capture a castle as the base of our future empire - the same thing we do in every Mount and Blade single player modules.
Because after some time, it feels like the only thing you do is hiring mercenaries from taverns, selling prisoners to the ransom brokers, managing your fiefs -the same thing we do in every Mount and Blade single player module.
Well the last thing is, exceptional with the features of this mod. Nonetheless, it's not enough. It requires time and lots of it. The sword of damocles has very good features such as new and various factions, lots of troops, mercenaries, combat AI improvement, duelling before battles and others I am not aware of yet. Still, all of these are not major features. If this is a RTS mod, we should be planning our strategy all the time.
Yet planning a strategy is not a hard thing with unlimited money. Since you can make 230k from a tournament betting, or make profit because of your enterprises throughout Ponavosa... In that case RTS element somewhat fails. My suggestion is completely removing enterprises and tournament bettings. But making the player to start with a castle of our own empire. Or better, making the player to spawn with 80 elite troops; near a neutral castle with 40-50 troops. Beginning the story of our hero with a starting quest of conquesting the castle. (In this case the castle can be taken at all costs but not veery easily. The player should feel a little challenge, so he/she can enjoy the victory afterwards.) This would be a quick start-up and let the player to dive into RTS very quickly, as it's the main offering of this mod. In addition, our close neighbours should be feudal lords with 1 fief and should be enemy to the player's faction from the beginning. So there can be some competition between close neighbours. Therefore the player will be forced to conduct a good strategy from the very beginning. No need to say it will be the player's second quest to construct a monarchy (the questgiver can be an old advisor from the player's court). After this quest is completed the player should be faced with Ponavosan factions, thus this brings to the 3rd and 4th quests "expanding borders", "establishing an empire". The main idea to all of these is making the player to be in action all the time. At least that is the way I see how a top 10 mod should be.
Well, I voted for you on mod db, not only for the over-the-top quality of your mod, but how responsive you are to new idea's and you've got to be the friendliest mod developer I've met.
Thanks Goldbrandz, that's nice of you to say that. When it comes down to it, I just want people to play fun & interesting games. Hopefully one day I can start making games professionally.Similar threads
