In Progress Learning rate (and thus subsequently leveling) math is wrong

[Hunterzen]

I'm hoping this bug is why skill progression is abysmally slow, beyond just a visual fudging of numbers on the visual end.
As it is right now, if the experience rate is intentional and it's just the tooltips that are wrong, companion progression are completely nonexistent.

Here's an example, I'm day 707 into this campaign and I've had my surgeon from week 1.
She's only gained FIVE (5) skill points in medicine. 700 days and countless battles, only five skill ups?
This can't be what was intended, at this rate my entire party would be dead from old age before she even gets to spend a perk choice. 707 days is 8 ingame years.
Edit: I just noticed I have an unspent focus point (the game did a really bad job of notifying me whenever this happened) so this example is scuffed.

However, my point still stands. My other combat focused companions have never seen a single focus point to distribute. What's the difference between my shieldmaiden compared to a freshly generated one sitting around in a tavern all game long?

Yeah I've never spent a point in any of my 5 companions they don't level up period. I'm at day 635 been in hundreds of battles most being autocomplete just checked still no points for them to spend also auto allocate is turned off.. Also my trade skill doesn't seem to level I have a caravan I go around buying and selling I have 2 focus points in it, but its still level 14 and has been forever.

 

[pryt]

As far as I'm aware your trade skill only raises if you trade personally, and then only goods you've bought somewhere cheap to sell them somewhere else expensive. The caravan is not helping you, since they do everything by themselves.

 

[Ted Striker]

That doesn't seem to be the case, my engineering has hit a hard wall and according to the learning rate factors it shouldn't have just yet.

Yep that should be 10 and instead it's 0 and you're stuck. Same with me and my trade skill in my newest game. It's stuck at 18 just like this but I didn't bother checking the numbers to see if something wasn't adding up correctly.

This is a very severe bug.

I also wonder if a rate of x 155.66 would be too much (bottom right of OP). This needs to be fixed ASAP so we can test the new, correct rate.

Again, this is a very severe bug. It is the #1 complaint players have about this game so far: abysmally slow skill gain. This was reported Monday and hasn't been fixed yet. It needs to be their #1 top priority.

 

[Mrhazard1989]

This is a very serious problem and is killing my desire to play.

same, you can mod it tho but I have lost the desire to bug test this game with various mods.

 

[Tim-Ab]

Damn it, what skills would I have now with normal leveling!
Despite this, the desire to play is still with me.

 

[Ted Striker]

I'm actually starting to think this might just be a visual error. Let me get in game and take screenshots of what I mean.

Ahh shoot I added a focus point and messed up what I wanted to show, but anyway it was this:

I have

Social 2
- Charm 5
- Leadership 6
- Trade 18

Charm and Leadership are both Learning Rate x 1.89, broken down as this:

Base +1.05
Social +10.84

That adds up to +11.89, and visually looks like x 1.89.

All my skills add up this way. My bow is Base +1.05, Control +31.68, Skill Focus +93.16, which adds to 125.89 and in game shows as x 5.89

My Trade however is different. Now this is assuming in game is correct and I've exceeded my learning limit:

Base +1.05
Social +10.84
Learning Limit exceeded -1.89

That adds to 10 and shows as x 0.00 in game, or in other words I cannot learn any more.

In my previous save before I hit Trade 18 it looks like this:

I do not know why the hundredths and tenths digits are being dropped but I'm suspecting it's working correctly behind the scenes. To make my Trade Learning Rate x 0.00 to reflect that I can't learn any more the tooltip didn't reduce the total by -11.89 but -1.89. In my screenshot it reduced it by -1.79 to make it x 0.11 (with rounding) so it's very slow to level but not yet at the cap.

Something is definitely weird.

 

[teedis]

I'm actually starting to think this might just be a visual error. Let me get in game and take screenshots of what I mean.

Ahh shoot I added a focus point and messed up what I wanted to show, but anyway it was this:

I have

Social 2
- Charm 5
- Leadership 6
- Trade 18

Charm and Leadership are both Learning Rate x 1.89, broken down as this:

Base +1.05
Social +10.84

That adds up to +11.89, and visually looks like x 1.89.

All my skills add up this way. My bow is Base +1.05, Control +31.68, Skill Focus +93.16, which adds to 125.89 and in game shows as x 5.89

My Trade however is different. Now this is assuming in game is correct and I've exceeded my learning limit:

Base +1.05
Social +10.84
Learning Limit exceeded -1.89

That adds to 10 and shows as x 0.00 in game, or in other words I cannot learn any more.

In my previous save before I hit Trade 18 it looks like this:

I do not know why the hundredths and tenths digits are being dropped but I'm suspecting it's working correctly behind the scenes. To make my Trade Learning Rate x 0.00 to reflect that I can't learn any more the tooltip didn't reduce the total by -11.89 but -1.89. In my screenshot it reduced it by -1.79 to make it x 0.11 (with rounding) so it's very slow to level but not yet at the cap.

Something is definitely weird.

The fact they have not fixed this, or even mentioned it leads me to believe it is visual. Along with this. Definitely needs balancing if that is the case. But I don't think you can seriously talk about balancing when there are missing features and half the skills and perks don't work at all.

 

[Ted Striker]

The fact they have not fixed this, or even mentioned it leads me to believe it is visual. Along with this. Definitely needs balancing if that is the case. But I don't think you can seriously talk about balancing when there are missing features and half the skills and perks don't work at all.

Well in the meantime there's Bannerlord Tweaks which can make the skill gain tolerable. Vanilla is broken. There's no way they intend it to be this slow.

 

[andycott]

Thread "Leveling up your character decreases your skill learning rate for all skills" may be worth looking at also about possible troubles with EXP and levelling up.

 

[GuitarGangster]

Ok, i think the tooltip wrongly adds the learning limit to the actual learning rate, thats where those high numbers come from.
On the attribute, there is (Attribute -1) * 10 added
For Focus points there is FP * 30 added
Subtract them and everything seems right. Pretty sure its a tooltip bug.

 

[Somnorila]

Ok, i think the tooltip wrongly adds the learning limit to the actual learning rate, thats where those high numbers come from.
On the attribute, there is (Attribute -1) * 10 added
For Focus points there is FP * 30 added
Subtract them and everything seems right. Pretty sure its a tooltip bug.

Most likely.

But there is another possible issue. Where the learning rate decays. You level up, put your desired focus point and will see the new learning rate multiplier number. Play a bit and check again and it's probable that the multiplier is smaller now. I noticed when i leveled up and maxed focus points in trading, the multiplier was 12. Now, after the skill got two levels more, i checked and it shows 11.2
So it's either another issue or the decay is normal. I think a game manual would been good to check if some behaviors are normal or out of the ordinary. As from a role playing point it might have sense. When you level the skill, so you get closer to the skill learning limit, it would be logical that the learning multiplier to drop. Because of fatigue from doing the same thing. And also when learning something, the more advanced the material is, your learning speed decreases.
This helps to not reach max level too fast in a skill while the rest of the skills are low. This approach, paired with the main level mechanic, compels you to level other skills too and get a more balanced character.
So is it a bug or not? I'm not sure.

 

[andycott]

Most likely.

But there is another possible issue. Where the learning rate decays. You level up, put your desired focus point and will see the new learning rate multiplier number. Play a bit and check again and it's probable that the multiplier is smaller now. I noticed when i leveled up and maxed focus points in trading, the multiplier was 12. Now, after the skill got two levels more, i checked and it shows 11.2
So it's either another issue or the decay is normal. I think a game manual would been good to check if some behaviors are normal or out of the ordinary. As from a role playing point it might have sense. When you level the skill, so you get closer to the skill learning limit, it would be logical that the learning multiplier to drop. Because of fatigue from doing the same thing. And also when learning something, the more advanced the material is, your learning speed decreases.
This helps to not reach max level too fast in a skill while the rest of the skills are low. This approach, paired with the main level mechanic, compels you to level other skills too and get a more balanced character.
So is it a bug or not? I'm not sure.

Not quite. If I understood right, when you level up, every skill becomes harder to upgrade, not only the ones, which are already high. So you will not get the balanced character, but rather a mediocre one in everything if you will keep upgrading all the skills and not only important ones.
But only if I understood the calculation right.

Thread "Leveling up your character decreases your skill learning rate for all skills" may be worth looking at also about possible troubles with EXP and levelling up.

Read this tread to understand my point correctly.

 

[GuitarGangster]

I really get the impression the developers want to encourage players to specialice more, or at least award players that do so.
There is the learning limit that makes it clear its impossible to master every skill. Then there is the learning limit decrease that makes it increasingly harder to level, the more different skills you use. And of course you need to increase more skills to gain a level with every levelup aswell. And on top of that there is a tooltip that states you get an attribute point every three levels but in the EA release version its one point every four levels. This makes me beliefe it is in fact on purpose. But who knows what the devs have in mind... ?

 

[Adrivan]

Was this touched by the 1.1.0 beta?

 

[kalarhan]

Was this touched by the 1.1.0 beta?

1.1.0.beta

• Fixed attribute and focus point tooltips to reflect correct numbers.

 

[Tim-Ab]

1.1.0.beta

Am I finally going to be better than my wife?

 

[teedis]

Am I finally going to be better than my wife?

They reduced the XP required to to learn higher level skills and said troops can upgrade more easily. They didn't say percentages though so we shall see. Hopefully after 70 hours of game play I can actually level up a companion this time lol

 

[andycott]

I really get the impression the developers want to encourage players to specialice more, or at least award players that do so.
There is the learning limit that makes it clear its impossible to master every skill. Then there is the learning limit decrease that makes it increasingly harder to level, the more different skills you use. And of course you need to increase more skills to gain a level with every levelup aswell. And on top of that there is a tooltip that states you get an attribute point every three levels but in the EA release version its one point every four levels. This makes me beliefe it is in fact on purpose. But who knows what the devs have in mind... ?

Maybe that's why there was no EXP gain in tournaments, as if I take part in these all the time, I upgrade secondary weapon skills, which I won't ever use in battles outside the tournaments.