Jesus Christ, fix your AI

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CookedShroom

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I have been playing the game for a few dozen hours now and in my most advanced game have become a vassal of the khuzait. Here a few ((minor)) issues I have:
The kingdom system feels deeply ungrateful. I have fought with dozens of armies, helping conquer cities and castles I haven't seen the shadow of afterwards. When I do get a settlement, it's ALWAYS a border sh****le that I have to defend against impossible odds or lose (given that my faction has apparently no interest in defending my settlements although it always goes to defend the others).
I have one of the largest parties in the kingdom and by far the most deadly. I have managed to hold Epicrotea, a key strategic position at the border of 3 kingdoms, for over a year now and have systematically destroyed armies passing even remotely nearby even though they were 2-3 times my size. Despite that, my reputation with the kingdom is abysmal because I dared push for one (1) city (epicrotea) and not just the occasional atrocious castle bound to be lost in 5 sec flat. I also have the gall to propose peaces which the king always refuses because, wouldn't you know, he declares whenever he has the occasion (or has someone declare on him when he forgot) and then proceeds to do nothing of use (and stubbornly refuses peace). Despite theoretical dominance, my kingdom does nothing and I am continuously bled dry to fix the mistakes of retarded AI while reaping NONE of the benefits. Fix this ****show. If anything close to this had happened historically the king would have lasted all of 5 minutes before being overthrown.
Stop incessant wars. Stop easily breakable peace deals. Rebalance rewards relative to contribution to the war. NOW. Late game is a bad joke as is.
 

Mabons

Knight at Arms
M&BWBWF&SNWVC
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A bit of a harsh tone but even Warband was renowned for having the most bat**** crazy AI and I was hoping that was something that would be improved upon coming into Bannerlord.
 

markp27

Veteran
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You do realise that the game is in Early Access and that means the game is still in development?

If you wanted the finished product you should of waited before buying it. Lists of problems are being sorted slowly. Till then take a chill pill and stop making demands. Asking for improvements is often a better way of getting things done.
 

Apocal

Sergeant Knight
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I have been playing the game for a few dozen hours now and in my most advanced game have become a vassal of the khuzait. Here a few ((minor)) issues I have:
The kingdom system feels deeply ungrateful. I have fought with dozens of armies, helping conquer cities and castles I haven't seen the shadow of afterwards. When I do get a settlement, it's ALWAYS a border sh****le that I have to defend against impossible odds or lose (given that my faction has apparently no interest in defending my settlements although it always goes to defend the others).

<snip tales of valor and woe>

Despite theoretical dominance, my kingdom does nothing and I am continuously bled dry to fix the mistakes of retarded AI while reaping NONE of the benefits. Fix this ****show. If anything close to this had happened historically the king would have lasted all of 5 minutes before being overthrown.
Stop incessant wars. Stop easily breakable peace deals. Rebalance rewards relative to contribution to the war. NOW. Late game is a bad joke as is.
You should be amassing huge amounts of influence. You can use that influence to boost up other people's chances during elections and make friends with literally every other clan in your kingdom. A 100 point vote in their favor is worth at least 30 points of relations, more if you have high Charm, and is enough to take you from neutral to friend in a single-shot. At that point, they'll using their influence to vote for your proposals and for your clan whenever a fief comes up.

The campaign AI being dumb... eh...
🤷‍♂️
 
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People dont get instantly unconscious wittnessing your awesomeness? Truely a bad game
But lets get real. The AI could use some improvement for sure. We will see in the future how that works out. Just be patient and dont get toxic. Reasonable criticism is good but just ranting wont do much for you or anyone.
 

voronius

Sergeant
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Warband AI is a joke still, fate of the world depends on looters :smile:. The lords quit siege to chase looters they should know they can't catch (by comparing army speed) over half the map.
Then they throw a feast. Same thing when they should be defending.
So i expect the AI will still be bad in here, at least for a while.
 

AnandaShanti

Knight at Arms
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Press the leave kingdom button and show them how bad of a dude you really are.

I did a double take that this was about campaign AI. Of course that AI is useless too, It;s just as bad when you're the king too, at first it's okay but once you're a real kingdom with lots of vassals they all vote for war constantly and run you out of hundreds of influence constantly and wander around doing nothing productive while you fight of the entire map.

You do realise that the game is in Early Access and that means the game is still in development?
You do realize the game didn't just turn out like this on it's own, somebody had to code it all in to for the AI to be annoying and stupid all the time.
They need to be told how annoying and stupid it is until they figure out how to fix it.
 

Revverie

Knight
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People dont get instantly unconscious wittnessing your awesomeness? Truely a bad game
But lets get real. The AI could use some improvement for sure. We will see in the future how that works out. Just be patient and dont get toxic. Reasonable criticism is good but just ranting wont do much for you or anyone.
It should, it's an rpg
 

Rangah

Knight at Arms
WBWF&SNWVC
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Asking for improvements is often a better way of getting things done.
That's literally what he's doing, albeit in a somewhat aggressive manner, but still. He was even quite detailed about his grievances too.

Whining and mad players > "iT's eA" zombies
 

MostBlunted

Squire
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People already said 3-4 months ago that the AI needs improvement, not much has changed since then.

TW has the wrong focus, we don´t need more quests at the moment or more auto save slots. We need working basics of the game like AI, kingdom management and stuff like this.
 

CookedShroom

Recruit
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Yeah just came back to this post and I'll admit I was VERY salty when I wrote it. Although I regret going a little too agressive in the wording, I stand by the points I was making. To those implying I wanted to be 2kewl4school and dominate the world easily, that's really not the case. I was even going in with the intention of roleplaying a vassal and taking things slow, eventually stopping around the level of a duke and never seizing control of the kingdom. I realise the game is early access and honestly I don't feel cheated out of my money. I already have upwards of 50 hours of mostly fun gameplay and believe the game has huge potential. It's just maddening to get stuck in this endless loop unless you just go for absolute domination and steamroll everything. Think of CK2 or EU4: you can aim to become a superpower through constant wars or you can just take a nation where you want it to go, reacting to the evolutions of the world around you. M&B aims to be an RPG. What it needs right now isn't more work going into the quests (although yes, they will need some in the future) but rebalancing the core mechanics of the game. As things stand, once you leave the merc stage the game isn't much of an RPG anymore, it's a laundry list of battles you have to go through to have some semblance of freedom in the game.
 

CookedShroom

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You should be amassing huge amounts of influence. You can use that influence to boost up other people's chances during elections and make friends with literally every other clan in your kingdom. A 100 point vote in their favor is worth at least 30 points of relations, more if you have high Charm, and is enough to take you from neutral to friend in a single-shot. At that point, they'll using their influence to vote for your proposals and for your clan whenever a fief comes up.

The campaign AI being dumb... eh...
🤷‍♂️
Thanks for the advice, I was using influence somewhat wrongly and I'll give that a shot.
 

AxiosXiphos

Knight
M&BWBWF&SNWVC
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I often wonder where people get their standards for A.I from. Every game forum its "fix your A.i," or "A.I is so dumb". I have yet to see a single game ever which had an impressive A.I (minus that bot that beat a top DOTA team - but that took years to develop and was still very very limited).

My point is A.I is just not very good yet; we as a species have not developed A.I that can compete with humans on any game which has more then 6-10 moving parts.

Now my issue here is yes bannerlord A.I can be dumb. But so it total war A.I. So is civilisation A.I. So is Crusader Kings A.I. so is Skyrim A.I. Literally any game ever in a similar genre to Bannerlord could be accused of having dumb A.I...

So where the hell are people getting their high standards from? Because it ain't other games...
 

MostBlunted

Squire
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You´re right, there is no real AI yet. But you really need examples why the Bannerlord AI is especially bad? You never played the game?

Like trying to siege settlement A, halfway there they change direction to settlement B but then again back to settlement A. Of course then they run out of food and disband the army? AI not really able to use the ladders? AI not really able to defend the gate when the gate get´s destroyed? One mounted unit is enough so that all 40 archers turn around and try to shoot him instead of the 50 infatary dudes in front of them?

That´s all what we can expect?
 
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CookedShroom

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I often wonder where people get their standards for A.I from. Every game forum its "fix your A.i," or "A.I is so dumb". I have yet to see a single game ever which had an impressive A.I (minus that bot that beat a top DOTA team - but that took years to develop and was still very very limited).

My point is A.I is just not very good yet; we as a species have not developed A.I that can compete with humans on any game which has more then 6-10 moving parts.

Now my issue here is yes bannerlord A.I can be dumb. But so it total war A.I. So is civilisation A.I. So is Crusader Kings A.I. so is Skyrim A.I. Literally any game ever in a similar genre to Bannerlord could be accused of having dumb A.I...

So where the hell are people getting their high standards from? Because it ain't other games...
I'm not asking for 200 iq big brain strategic genius here. There are ways to fix the main issues I (and many others) have raised:
-an agressive expansion system keeps in check kingdoms too war-prone
-actual economic consequences. If an enemy nation keeps having to pay the ransom for its generals that were captured, at some point they shouldn't be able to keep creating expensive doomstacks or there should be the risk of them refusing to pay and the prisonner to be executed, depleting it's nobility. As of right now, winning battles has no other consequence than turning a quick buck and gaining a day of respite.
-end of war rewards calibrated according to the percentage of casualties inflicted/ prisonners taken/ settlements sieged successfully.
-scale the propensity of the king's ai to declare war according to the new total enemy force. AKA, when considering declaring a second or third war, compare the kingdom's strength to all enemy nations. In short: the more soldiers you're already fighting, the less you want to add numbers to the pile.
-add more incentives to remaining at peace: valuable trade deals, extra growth in border settlements, defensive alliances etc.
These are just a few off the top of my head.
 

Dabos37

Knight
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I often wonder where people get their standards for A.I from. Every game forum its "fix your A.i," or "A.I is so dumb". I have yet to see a single game ever which had an impressive A.I (minus that bot that beat a top DOTA team - but that took years to develop and was still very very limited).

My point is A.I is just not very good yet; we as a species have not developed A.I that can compete with humans on any game which has more then 6-10 moving parts.

Now my issue here is yes bannerlord A.I can be dumb. But so it total war A.I. So is civilisation A.I. So is Crusader Kings A.I. so is Skyrim A.I. Literally any game ever in a similar genre to Bannerlord could be accused of having dumb A.I...

So where the hell are people getting their high standards from? Because it ain't other games...
This.

Plus the campaign AI in Bannerlord is pretty decent. It still needs some work but I do not find It awful as people state.
 

Apocal

Sergeant Knight
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-actual economic consequences. If an enemy nation keeps having to pay the ransom for its generals that were captured, at some point they shouldn't be able to keep creating expensive doomstacks or there should be the risk of them refusing to pay and the prisonner to be executed, depleting it's nobility. As of right now, winning battles has no other consequence than turning a quick buck and gaining a day of respite.
This actually does happen but the effect (losing money due to defeat; 5% of their denars, up to the 10,000 denar cap, plus having to pay to recruit more soldiers) is balanced around the need to ensure players have something substantial to fight in the late-game. If the AI can wreck itself economically by waging war, then the winning move is to simply avoid it and rule the ashes. Not so good in a game centered around fighting battles.

-add more incentives to remaining at peace: valuable trade deals, extra growth in border settlements, defensive alliances etc.
These are just a few off the top of my head.
The developers have been fairly upfront that diplomacy options are still in the cooker.