Is the opinion which there is so many new players introduced to M&B series with Bannerlord a myth?

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Most people play with mods, and steam is actually extremely helpful for such.
There was no such thing like Steam Workshop when Warband released, at the very best Steam was a non-issue for Warband mods, but it was detrimental for ones that made more invasive changes before TW adapted the game to those.
 

Roy1012

Banned
There was no such thing like Steam Workshop when Warband released, at the very best Steam was a non-issue for Warband mods, but it was detrimental for ones that made more invasive changes before TW adapted the game to those.
Im not talking about the steam workshop lol. Im talking about the fact that all mods can easily be kept in the steam/steam apps/warband/modules folder. It’s as simple as extracting it there. Idk what you do on a non steam version, but it can’t be more simple than that.
 

Lord Grindelvald

Sergeant at Arms
WB
First of all, a disclaimer. r/mountandblade subreddit founded at Jun 3, 2009. So demographically, there is huge chance that this subreddit consists so many of old players but still this is the largest social platform directly related M&B series ever.

As I ventured this forum, I stumbled upon and disagreed with the opinion that Bannerlord player base consists of considerable amount of new players who introduced M&B series with Bannerlord. So a while ago I did a poll asking the question "How many of players are introduced Mound and Blade series with Bannerlord". Unfortunately, after thousands votes reddit shows the number in the form of 1k, 2k etc. So there is 2k participants in this poll and 223 voters says "I only played Bannerlord" which makes of ((223/2000)*100) 11.65 % of the participants. There is a new poll posted by the user Madzieg.
ofvdR.png

So the poll is like this. This is relatively new poll and there is 2 days before it is closed. I know there is still time but after certain voters participate in the poll, the percentage number of the choices does not change much. As of right now, there is 381 voters and 30 of them says "I play Bannerlord (never played Warband before)" which makes 7.87 % of the voters. With respect to the polls made in this subreddit, new player base somewhere at 10%. Imho, this number is not significant and I think Bannerlord failed to attract considerable amount of new players to the series. Of course, time could change this number.

I did another poll regarding if the players need mods to enjoy the game and 37.66 % of the voters said yes. I think it is considerable amount of the players.

All I am saying is I have strong opinion that TW tried to attract new players with their approach of developing their game which I think a lot of forum user here share this opinion but this number is a failure in my book. I think TW should abandon their approach and try to look what made Warband successful.

Aren't you already skewing the poll results by posting a link to the poll in the Bannerlords General Discussion subforum? Or is this also being posted in the other General Discussions?
 

Duh_TaleWorlds

Developer
What the hell are you talking about? Most people play with mods, and steam is actually extremely helpful for such.
He is entirely right imo. It was also not an option to download older warband versions on steam IIRC whereas TW offered them on their website. Many warband mods did not keep up with game updates for notable amounts of time.
 

Ananda_The_Destroyer

Grandmaster Knight
He is entirely right imo. It was also not an option to download older warband versions on steam IIRC whereas TW offered them on their website. Many warband mods did not keep up with game updates for notable amounts of time.
If you have time post in this thread you have time to add war elephants! ?
 

AxiosXiphos

Sergeant Knight
M&BWBWF&SNWVC
He is entirely right imo. It was also not an option to download older warband versions on steam IIRC whereas TW offered them on their website. Many warband mods did not keep up with game updates for notable amounts of time.
Nevermind Warband mods.

I remember having to keep track of the version original M&B was on so I could install the correct version of Sword of Damocles!

Talking of which - everyone keeps complaining about missing Warband features in Bannerlord...

But what about the missing M&B features in Warband?!

Dark Knights! When?!

WAzBt67.jpg
 

Bjorn The Upset

Grandmaster Knight
WBVCNWWF&SM&B
Aren't you already skewing the poll results by posting a link to the poll in the Bannerlords General Discussion subforum? Or is this also being posted in the other General Discussions?
As i said so many times before, the percentage numbers of the choices does not change much after certain voters participate. There were two times i shared a poll link here before it closed and guess what, it did not change the numbers. If this is not enough, we can look at the numbers at the moment i shared here because at the time i shared the poll, the amount of participant was already enough for statistic results. As i said in previous posts, 384 participant is enough to draw statistic result with 95 percentage confidence level and 5 percentage confidence interval.

Edit:
This poll I shared here before it closed.
The number in percentage before I shared here (381 voters):

-I play Warband (never played Bannerlord before) 96 votes, 25.2 %
-I came back to Warband (played Bannerlord before) 38 votes, 9.97 %
-I play both of them 79 votes, 20.73 %
-I play Bannerlord only (never played Warband before) 30 votes, 7.87 %
- I play Bannerlord (played Warband before) 138 votes, 36.22 %

The numbers right now which means after I shared the poll here (888 voters):
a4MRw.png

-I play Warband (never played Bannerlord before) 230 votes, 25.90 %
-I came back to Warband (played Bannerlord before) 94 votes, 10.59 %
-I play both of them 180 votes, 20.27 %
-I play Bannerlord only (never played Warband before) 56 votes, 6.31 %
- I play Bannerlord (played Warband before) 328 votes, 36,94 %

So as I said before so many times and shared sample size calculator numbers and shared a article which says in the perspective of statistics after certain sample size for a certain population size, trying to increase the sample size does not get your results significantly more accurate and right now presented how this statement is true with data, after 507 new voters, the numbers in percentage did not change much.

So there is no such a thing as skewing.
 
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Lord Grindelvald

Sergeant at Arms
WB
So as I said before so many times and shared sample size calculator numbers and shared a article which says in the perspective of statistics after certain sample size for a certain population size, trying to increase the sample size does not get your results significantly more accurate and right now presented how this statement is true with data, after 507 new voters, the numbers in percentage did not change much.

So there is no such a thing as skewing.

What? Trying to increase sample size does yield better results but what also matters, and what my point was here, where you field those samples from. If I wanted to know if Nike had better sportshoes then Adidas and I'd walk into the Adidas headquarters to ask my questions, the results would be incredible onesided as theres a clear bias.

So if u wanted to see how popular A vs B is and you ask a forum dedicated to B then ofcourse youre gonna have a bias towards B.

And the absolute statement of there being no such thing as skewing is ludacris.
 

Bjorn The Upset

Grandmaster Knight
WBVCNWWF&SM&B
What? Trying to increase sample size does yield better results
Do you actually read and see what I just posted or read my previous posts or read the article I shared? I am backing up my statements with numbers, countering your arguments with article and the real data I just shared.

One of my previous post:
As I said in the disclaimer, this is true but this is the biggest platform to do that. And after certain number, you can not get more accurate than this as stated here in the perspective of statistics.

A good maximum sample size is usually 10% as long as it does not exceed 1000​

A good maximum sample size is usually around 10% of the population, as long as this does not exceed 1000. For example, in a population of 5000, 10% would be 500. In a population of 200,000, 10% would be 20,000. This exceeds 1000, so in this case the maximum would be 1000.

Even in a population of 200,000, sampling 1000 people will normally give a fairly accurate result. Sampling more than 1000 people won’t add much to the accuracy given the extra time and money it would cost.
If we approach the subreddit like a poll, the people who reached this niches of the Subreddit which has 230k members should be reflection of the real player base.

Edit: I do not really get it. 230k members is not a small number of a subreddit of a game which sold 5-10M.
Edit 2: This subreddit is not TW headquarters, these people here are consumers of a product which consist of 230k members. Even your example does not make sense.
 
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Lord Grindelvald

Sergeant at Arms
WB
Do you actually read and see what I just posted or read my previous posts or read the article I shared? I am backing up my statements with numbers, countering your arguments with article and the real data I just shared.

One of my previous post:
As I said in the disclaimer, this is true but this is the biggest platform to do that. And after certain number, you can not get more accurate than this as stated here in the perspective of statistics.

If we approach the subreddit like a poll, the people who reached this niches of the Subreddit which has 230k members should be reflection of the real player base.

Edit: I do not really get it. 230k members is not a small number of a subreddit of a game which sold 5-10M.
Edit 2: This subreddit is not TW headquarters, these people here are consumers of a product which consist of 230k members. Even your example does not make sense.

The sample size is not at all a problem, because as I said, what my point is where those numbers come from.

Lets look at my former analogy again: I had it simplified but I could try and ELI5.

"So if u wanted to see how popular A vs B is and you ask a forum dedicated to B then ofcourse youre gonna have a bias towards B."

A = Warband and B = Bannerlord.

If one of my voting options is: I've played Warband but never played Bannerlord then nobody at the subforum dedicated to Bannerlord would vote for that option. Because we can assume that anybody roaming the Bannerlord subforums have played Bannerlord atleast once.

But since the poll was also posted at the general mountandblade subreddit, there will be SOME people who will vote for that option. And since you dont know how many voters came from source AB (subreddit) or just from source B (Bannerlord subforum) the outcome of that particular voting option means nothing anymore.
 

Bjorn The Upset

Grandmaster Knight
WBVCNWWF&SM&B
r/mountandblade is a subreddit dedicated to M&B series not Warband and also official and also has triple the size of r/Bannerlord. The polls in question also want the attention of old Warband players. There is no proper place to do these polls than r/mountandblade.

I aslo can assume that r/mounandblade subreddit members at least once heard about a game called Bannerlord, watched gameplay footage if they want to buy it or not, read reviews and such.
 

Lord Grindelvald

Sergeant at Arms
WB
r/mountandblade is a subreddit dedicated to M&B series not Warband and also official and also has triple the size of r/Bannerlord. The polls in question also want the attention of old Warband players. There is no proper place to do these polls than r/mountandblade.

Yeah, thats my point again. r/mountandblade is dedicated to the entire series and would've been a viable polling source. But since the poll was also posted on this subforum (aka an unviable polling source considering the nature of the questions) the results were skewed.
You could've brought them back into balance by also posting them in the Warband General Discussions. A + AB + B instead of AB + B.
 

Lord Grindelvald

Sergeant at Arms
WB
That is my point. And as I said "I aslo can assume that r/mounandblade subreddit members at least once heard about a game called Bannerlord, watched gameplay footage if they want to buy it or not, read reviews and such."
I think you're purposefully missing the rest of my comment there. For the second time in a row. EDIT: Third time. So I'll bid you adieu and have a great day.
 

Bjorn The Upset

Grandmaster Knight
WBVCNWWF&SM&B
Yeah we could do that. Since r/Bannerlord subreddit members could have never heard or stumble upon r/mountandblade subreddit within these 2 long years?
 

Mad Vader

Duhpressed
Duke
M&BWB
I am one of the guys who started playing the series with Bannerlord and never touched Warband, also i happen to be the guy with most hours streamed on Twitch over the past year.

i got interested in the game back when it released and even in that broken state i felt it was something i never experienced before and wanted to try. got the game January 2021 and played 4K hours since then.

What the hell are you talking about? Most people play with mods, and steam is actually extremely helpful for such.
Back in the Warband days, you did manual installs for SP mods and played offline/non-Steam, so you were not counted by Steam.
 

Bjorn The Upset

Grandmaster Knight
WBVCNWWF&SM&B
Just for better presenting it,

I will write all of the difference in percentage for each choices before I shared the poll here and after I shared,

The choicesDifference in percentage before and after
-I play Warband (never played Bannerlord before)0.7
-I came back to Warband (played Bannerlord before)0.62
-I play both of them0.46
-I play Bannerlord only (never played Warband before)1.56
- I play Bannerlord (played Warband before)0.72
 
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