HugoTheFrenchMan
Grandmaster Knight
Thanks for info!
+1Thanks for your strong efforts -i really do hope terrain still becomes more meaningful in the future
Truth. ??Good stuff mex, I like the initiative .
Time to add a page or two of fluff and celebration for mexxico's sake.
According to these results we have 117 snowball score at 1.5.4, 104 at 1.5.5, 61 at 1.5.6 and I think 1.5.7 will be around 45 with new developments mentioned in last posts :
1-Reducing cavalry speed bonus to 40% from 60%. I did not get approve for this yet because I fear it to be rejected but I will apply it. Because it seems this is a must. I do not want to risk this.
2-There will be a bit higher horseman troop ratio in 7 non-Khuzait factions. Parties will tend to upgrade their troops not 50% - 50% randomly if they have 2 options they will upgrade according to troop tree to reach horseman troops more if their cavalry ratio is low.
3-Rebel clans will join weaker factions & same culture ones more instead of joining powerfull kingdoms if they succeed surviving first 30 days.
4-Reducing effects of OP 2 perks giving too much passive xp and being a side effect in povetry. Also needed xp for tier-3, tier-4 and tier-5 are a bit increased. So it will be a bit hard to reach high tiers with only passive xp.
5-30% longer preliminary phase at sieges.
6-Heart values of Khuzait villages will be a bit reduced.
7-Khuzait default policy grazing rights policy will be +0.5 loyality -0.25 hearth instead of +1 loyality +1 militia.
8-Weak kingdoms will try to face with less enemies and pay more tributes if needed. Agressiveness of kingdoms which lost lots of territory will be reduced. This is partly 1.5.1 feature but its effect will be a bit increased.
Amazing work, Mexxico. I am sure there are others at TW putting in a lot of effort, but your candor has almost single-handedly made me believe in Bannerlord again.
Hey MexicoThis 40% (1.5.7) - 60% (1.5.6) cavalry ratio speed bonus make Khuzaits also richer (because they could not be plundered / looted easily) and Khuzait parties to save themselves catch and loot weak enemies. While Khuzaits sieging enemy town if enemy come defence with stronger army they can give up and run away while others cannot do. So Khuzaits can save their parties while others cannot do. Because Khuzaits be richer their garrisons are bigger in their fortifications. So chain is like this : higher speed->richer lords->bigger garrisons->getting more tribute->being more richer
Even this number is reduced to 40% this problem will continue but things will be much better. Now at least X men Khuzait party speed will be nearly same with X - Y men other faction party (Y will be about 10-20 if bonus is 40% it is 20-30 at 60%, higher bonus is worse). Its a minor change but will have positive effects.
Hey Mexico
Can you make that Cavalry bonus only grant bonus map speed on plains /deserts and penalty in forests or maybe even in snow?
Same for Khuzait national perk that grant extra speed for global map parties. I am pretty sure that would affect global map balance.
Also just reminding that Sturgia speed on Snow bonus still not work.
Well, technically speaking, 2 guys with 1 horse will travel faster than 2 guys without. Because you can switch and rest a bit while riding, therefore maintaining higher overall speed.
Thanks for suggestion. I will pass this to design team. At least cavalry bonus can be removed at forests maybe (giving negative can be too harsh imo), speed of a party with high cavalry reduces too much when they enter a forest from plain / desert if we give negative. This big decrease will not be good for gameplay. However removing cavalry bonus at forests can be evaluated. Also AI do not find its path according to terrain types. So this can create small problems also.
Will check Sturgia bonus. I think this is not applied because we have no snow data at code for now. Will check it if we have that data on code, if it is ready and implemented (if I can learn a position is snow or not at c# parts of code) I can easily add it. Otherwise we need to wait that data to transfered c# parts.
Sounds like some amazing choices for fixing the Khuzaits steamrolling. We hope that the team will agree with your decision as much as we doHere all test results we have since 1.5.4 :
According to these results we have 117 snowball score at 1.5.4, 104 at 1.5.5, 61 at 1.5.6 and I think 1.5.7 will be around 45 with new developments mentioned in last posts :
1-Reducing cavalry speed bonus to 40% from 60%. I did not get approve for this yet because I fear it to be rejected but I will apply it. Because it seems this is a must. I do not want to risk this.
2-There will be a bit higher horseman troop ratio in 7 non-Khuzait factions. Parties will tend to upgrade their troops not 50% - 50% randomly if they have 2 options they will upgrade according to troop tree to reach horseman troops more if their cavalry ratio is low.
3-Rebel clans will join weaker factions & same culture ones more instead of joining powerfull kingdoms if they succeed surviving first 30 days.
4-Reducing effects of OP 2 perks giving too much passive xp and being a side effect in povetry. Also needed xp for tier-3, tier-4 and tier-5 are a bit increased. So it will be a bit hard to reach high tiers with only passive xp.
5-30% longer preliminary phase at sieges.
6-Heart values of Khuzait villages will be a bit reduced.
7-Khuzait default policy grazing rights policy will be +0.5 loyality -0.25 hearth instead of +1 loyality +1 militia.
8-Weak kingdoms will try to face with less enemies and pay more tributes if needed. Agressiveness of kingdoms which lost lots of territory will be reduced. This is partly 1.5.1 feature but its effect will be a bit increased.
Bonus - Average war times will be 30-40% longer. This is something bad for snowball by the way because factions react slower to new wars. But 1.5.6 war durations were so short and this was effecting gameplay badly. So even it is bad for snowball this increase is need to be done. We will have 8 positive and 1 negative effect for snowball at 1.5.7
After we have 45 average snowball score this problem will be not a major issue anymore then I will start examining "Party AI Overhaul and Commands" mod first to see how they cope with party micromanagement problem (with making most players happy) then we will implement some solutions for this.
Still here we will post our results in new patches of course and discuss how things are going. However after 1.5.7 if we can reach 45 average snowball score it will be good enough to focus other problems more because I think snowball will not a major problem anymore (if some new feature do not trigger it again in future) Even this happens we will catch it because we will continue calculating snowball score after each patch.
Additional info for newcommers, how to calculate snowball score :
1-We fastforward game to year 1104 (20 years from start).
2-We count castles and towns for each faction. Rebels are not counted. Each town is counted as 2 and castles are counted 1. So we find a fief value for each faction.
3-For each faction if their fief score is out of 20-35 range we add its difference from this range. Total value is snowball score. Less is good of course.
Thanks for all participants to these tests, this helped finding out problems and see what is our current situation in each patch.
you have to control your horse and at the same time avoid things, a horse is not a car. = ForestWhile I'm a stern enemy of the whole cavalry marching bonus for mixed parties, I would not appreciate such changes. Why should cavalry march slower in woods or in snow? If the forests wood be so dense, also infantry might not be able to pass at all. And in deeper snow being on a horse might even be (much) better than having to plow through the snow by foot.
While I'm a stern enemy of the whole cavalry marching bonus for mixed parties, I would not appreciate such changes. Why should cavalry march slower in woods or in snow? If the forests wood be so dense, also infantry might not be able to pass at all. And in deeper snow being on a horse might even be (much) better than having to plow through the snow by foot.
I've noticed one thing with Aserai though, they are insane fast to capture cities, but they leave very few defenders, so they are recaptured fast.
We're talking 30-50 troops at most.
The Aserai is doing like a Blitz-krieg so they capture things in very fast pace, and if they are able to get peace, then they have those lands.
This does not work in the real world for bigger units however. Because horses are no machines but animals, like humans, who can get exhausted too. There is one school of thought among military historians even which has the opinion that big groups on horses cannot move faster than pure infantry for longer periods of times. Namely because horses get exhausted more than humans through constant marches and have to rest longer to regain power.
I'm not really convinced of this. When reading 19th/20th c. AD military cavalry manuals, they calculate with a higher marching capacity of pure cavalry groups for an extended period of times. And I'm positive that they knew a bit about what they wrote in the official manuals.
But I never noticed that a mix of cavalry and infantry could march faster than with infantry speed anywhere in history. It's a kind of magic in BL, so.
While I'm a stern enemy of the whole cavalry marching bonus for mixed parties, I would not appreciate such changes. Why should cavalry march slower in woods or in snow? If the forests wood be so dense, also infantry might not be able to pass at all. And in deeper snow being on a horse might even be (much) better than having to plow through the snow by foot.
you have to control your horse and at the same time avoid things, a horse is not a car. = Forest
Snow is basically pressure and weight. The formula for pressure is Force / Area. IIRC, average horse hoof is smaller than average human feet, and the weight is much bigger when you are on a horse. in this situation force in the formula is total weight (horse + rider) and area is horse hooves. i didn't calculate it with numbers but it's probably at least double the pressure. the reason why people wear tennis racket like things while walking in snow is to increase area, if you increase area without increasing the force (the weight) the pressure will reduce
you can't give a real historical example here because it has LOTS of different factors. and guess what? this is a game!as for snow, steppe nomads would graze their horses in summer for them to get fat and campaign in winter. the campaign to subdue the rus lands was in winter, and guess who had the disadvantage.
you can't give a real historical example here because it has LOTS of different factors. and guess what? this is a game!
no... this is a game and it doesn't have as many factors as real life does right? So you can't just say "nomadic tribes took those lands in winter"snow and winter are fantasy and do not exist in real life...?