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Infantry versus cavalry damage

How do you like the balance between infantry versus cavalry?


  • Total voters
    51

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Sigaretovic

Squire
In my opinion spear damage dealt by infantry on cavalry is (too) low. What i find frustrating is the realization that for some reason a incoming cavalry can deal a single hit kill with a certain amount of speed and that a inverse single hit rarely or less often does enough damage on a similarly armoured cavalry. Theoretically i would expect the same amount of damage to be dealt.
Also the spear often glances or hits the horse, which makes it harder to kill cavalry.

How happy are you with infantry versus cavalry damage?
 

Dextrus

Sergeant
Oh boy, don’t get me started!

Spears are useless vs Cav, and even more useless when the cav is close to you. Cav is just broken and has been since day one.
 

Golodir

Banned
WBM&BWF&SNWVC
After I played as a spearman in the last set of finals, I don't think spear is weak against cav, if you know how to use it properly. To me it looks like due to the lower amount of players in Skirmish, compared to Warband battle, it's easier to be punished while playing with a spear by enemy team, so people don't even try to play with one, even though it's still very doable and if your team has inf advantage which means you get space to stop cav, I'd say it's very effective vs cav lol.
 

Hans 77

Knight
WBWF&SVC
Yeah it comes down more to the systemic design of Skirmish Mode rather than the vacuum claim that spear inf is weak against cav.

It's a 6v6 mode -which is relatively small for player numbers, and one in which cav classes can spawn with really nice kit right from the beginning (especially true for heavy cav). Plus the fact it's a multi-life game mode has to be considered. Multiple cav spawns and the ability for a team to rotate heavy cav means it's pretty easy to get overwhelmed by cavalry.

While there is something to be said about the janky hitboxes, reach, and cav acceleration, this topic probably wouldn't be brought up as much if Bannerlord was played on a single-life game mode, or one that used the Warband gold system rather than premade classes.
 

Mabons

Sergeant Knight
M&BWBWF&SNWVC
Said it in a few places but cavalry can easily hit your head, the same is not true for inf(at least what I've observed it will hit another body part). This means cav gets the headshot bonus(I forget the exact numbers) and so combined with the speed it's usually just enough to get the kill. You on the other hand, hit their chest for 60 or so damage.

Simply put, head hitting bonus needs to just go if your on horseback, there isn't a need when speed is on your side to boost your damage already.
 

Mushbeast

Knight at Arms
Certain horses need to be weaker towards spears, or the rider themselves needs to have a sort of multiplier or calculation re-work for the damage they take. It's almost never worth aiming for the rider rather than rearing the horse, and even then that can be quite useless against some of the stronger horses. I believe one of the upcoming patches is supposed to (try) combat this.

What annoys me too is that the cavalry spear hit-box seems to be wonky as ****, where they can hit you at point blank and many times where their spear has clearly missed or gone straight over your head, yet still counts as a hit. Whether that's lag or not, I'm not sure, but it happens very often.
 
in singleplayer you have a chance to dismount a rider if you deal 25% or more damage to the rider,

i think this needs to be in multiplayer
 

Diabełek

Sergeant at Arms
WBNW
After I played as a spearman in the last set of finals, I don't think spear is weak against cav, if you know how to use it properly. To me it looks like due to the lower amount of players in Skirmish, compared to Warband battle, it's easier to be punished while playing with a spear by enemy team, so people don't even try to play with one, even though it's still very doable and if your team has inf advantage which means you get space to stop cav, I'd say it's very effective vs cav lol.
Agree #SpearmanGang
 

Zdzichu

Sergeant at Arms
After I played as a spearman in the last set of finals, I don't think spear is weak against cav, if you know how to use it properly. To me it looks like due to the lower amount of players in Skirmish, compared to Warband battle, it's easier to be punished while playing with a spear by enemy team, so people don't even try to play with one, even though it's still very doable and if your team has inf advantage which means you get space to stop cav, I'd say it's very effective vs cav lol.
you played with throwing spear not spear there is a difference in damage and speed.
 

Zarthas

Knight
Its kinda nuts to me that historically, there are sooo damn many reports of a warrior with a big weapon killing a "horse and rider in one blow", but its physically impossible in this video game. Saxon huscarls and two-handed samurai weapons come to mind as warriors who were renowned for their equine annihilation in close quarters.
 

KSHMR

Sergeant at Arms
Its kinda nuts to me that historically, there are sooo damn many reports of a warrior with a big weapon killing a "horse and rider in one blow", but its physically impossible in this video game. Saxon huscarls and two-handed samurai weapons come to mind as warriors who were renowned for their equine annihilation in close quarters.
If an enemy soldier was hit in full gallop by a knight's lance couched under the armpit, he was thrown backwards with such a momentum that he knocked over several of his compatriots, and was more often than not, killed; in some cases, the lance would even skewer the man and kill or wound the soldier behind him. The heavy lances were dropped after the attack and the battle was continued with secondary weapons (swords, battle-axes, war-hammers, or maces). The same would happen if the knight was hit by a spear at such speeds. More often than not, the spear would skewer the horse and sometimes the rider along with it.
 
If an enemy soldier was hit in full gallop by a knight's lance couched under the armpit, he was thrown backwards with such a momentum that he knocked over several of his compatriots, and was more often than not, killed; in some cases, the lance would even skewer the man and kill or wound the soldier behind him. The heavy lances were dropped after the attack and the battle was continued with secondary weapons (swords, battle-axes, war-hammers, or maces). The same would happen if the knight was hit by a spear at such speeds. More often than not, the spear would skewer the horse and sometimes the rider along with it.
Man it would be so cool to see couched lances like this in BL, i already made such suggestion on other thread
and yea, 1h spear damage vs cav is quite ridicoulus right now, you dont even fight a cav, you just stop it for a matter of seconds and take a 1/3 or 2/3 of its health just to see a horse run away or even run forward like it doest cares, im actually fine with that but then ALL 1h spears in game must be a default weapons, like to spear infantry on khuzaits
Pikes are fine tho IMO, one of biggest game-changers right now
 

Corsair831

Sergeant
WF&S
I think the main problem is how weak the spear is vs infantry, meaning that if there's an inf and a cav near you you simply have to put it away as it's so unreliable against infantry, so the cav can do whatever he wants.

Also if you rear a horse it does no damage to the rider (unlike in Warband), so it doesn't feel quite as useful rearing cav as it did in Warband
 

Sigaretovic

Squire
@Dejan do you know if this issue is aknowledged and if there are any steps taken to do something about it? Ive read some things here and there, for example about making making cav more expensive and tweaking something about horse HP, but none of the actions seem like they're adressing the issues.
 

Grank

Sergeant Knight at Arms
WBNWVC
Its kinda nuts to me that historically, there are sooo damn many reports of a warrior with a big weapon killing a "horse and rider in one blow", but its physically impossible in this video game. Saxon huscarls and two-handed samurai weapons come to mind as warriors who were renowned for their equine annihilation in close quarters.
If you're talking about the ones about cutting through horses, I think they are just dramatized for the hype. It's hard to imagine a blade as thin as a nodachi or nagamaki cutting through a horse's hide, muscles and bones.
 

Zarthas

Knight
If you're talking about the ones about cutting through horses, I think they are just dramatized for the hype. It's hard to imagine a blade as thin as a nodachi or nagamaki cutting through a horse's hide, muscles and bones.
I was more referencing the overhead dane-axe spin thing the saxon huscarls were famous for using to decapitate horses, but there's comparable techniques pretty much anywhere that horses were being dicks on battlefields.
I'll see if I can find that reference to the huscarl horse-murder at Hastings, it was a pretty cool passage.
 
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