I personally would like an option to go back to the old order menu

[black_bulldog]

Since this is a relevant topic, I'll post some more ideas here.
For connection to the character and scene a UI like you see in Detroit become human or the division 2 (where it looks like it's part of the scene and not just an overlay)

You could have some UI art personalization according to the culture (this could apply to all UI, not just this)
Some more:

And MORE:

I can't say I know all of the game ui's you're presenting. But I do know several of them and the game pauses when accessing it. The biggest issue I have with the new radial menu is that it's in your face and blocks the screen and even a few seconds interference at the wrong time can get you killed.

 

[Lusitani 5th Empire]

I can't say I know all of the game ui's you're presenting. But I do know several of them and the game pauses when accessing it. The biggest issue I have with the new radial menu is that it's in your face and blocks the screen and even a few seconds interference at the wrong time can get you killed.

True.

For this you could have a "commander" camera (like what I said before - half rts, half third person) by pressing a certain key, at the same time a menu (radial or not) would pop up with the commands and maybe other vital information.
But this is a problem because if you are in the heat of the battle and want to make a quick command the change in the camera might get you killed.

So another solution is necessary, the "commander" camera is rather an optional addition because it doesn't apply to all cases, although it would be cool.
As I said before the radial menu should only cover "useless" space like the character's back. A new camera view adjustment might be necessary to maximize the size of the UI while maintaining the view of the battlefield, so it's like third-person with some adjustments.

Another idea is to have this UI only appear when you are a certain distance away from an enemy so that it doesn't get you killed. If you are engaged in combat then no UI would appear you just make the commands.

Another idea is having a key that would pop up the commands so you can see them and by standard no menu would pop up you just make the command. This could be enabled and disabled in the options. But imagine you are in combat and you can't remember the commands, well, you could do a "tactical pause" where you could deliver the commands with the UI an return to the game.

Another idea is to have a slow motion effect when delivering commands or even a pause, again this could be enabled or disabled in the options.

 

[black_bulldog]

True.

For this you could have a "commander" camera (like what I said before - half rts, half third person) by pressing a certain key, at the same time a menu (radial or not) would pop up with the commands and maybe other vital information.
But this is a problem because if you are in the heat of the battle and want to make a quick command the change in the camera might get you killed.

So another solution is necessary, the "commander" camera is rather an optional addition because it doesn't apply to all cases, although it would be cool.
As I said before the radial menu should only cover "useless" space like the character's back. A new camera view adjustment might be necessary to maximize the size of the UI while maintaining the view of the battlefield, so it's like third-person with some adjustments.

Another idea is to have this UI only appear when you are a certain distance away from an enemy so that it doesn't get you killed. If you are engaged in combat then no UI would appear you just make the commands.

Another idea is having a key that would pop up the commands so you can see them and by standard no menu would pop up you just make the command. This could be enabled and disabled in the options. But imagine you are in combat and you can't remember the commands, well, you could do a "tactical pause" where you could deliver the commands with the UI an return to the game.

Another idea is to have a slow motion effect when delivering commands or even a pause, again this could be enabled or disabled in the options.

There is a mod out there that slows down time when issuing commands, sadly it's not up to date.

 

[Darkath]

I can't say I know all of the game ui's you're presenting. But I do know several of them and the game pauses when accessing it. The biggest issue I have with the new radial menu is that it's in your face and blocks the screen and even a few seconds interference at the wrong time can get you killed.

There's no need for all those other games. When you give orders in bannerlord you can't pause and you need to "aim" your order, so you shouldn't obscure the view in the screen.
So rather than have a perfect circle in the middle of the screen they can just spread out the icons to the side. You get the same functionality (usable with a console pad) but you don't needlessly obscure the view.


Here i give 10 locations for order but you don't need that many, 6 or 8 locations would be enough (freeing the lower part of the screen which is already busy with the log and health bar). The point is we have wide screen, and the top of the screen is already used by the troop cards, a perfect circle will always be to small and end up obscuring the view because the available screen real estate is to small in height. Making the radial menu more like an ellipse solve the issue and take advantage of our wide screens.

Forgive the low quality, i was too lazy to run the game to take a screenshot myself.

 

[FBohler]

Not my ss, I took it from a user (don't rmb her/his name). Still with 1.5.4... ?

You naughty SS thief! ?

 

[dijiTurk]

Making the radial menu more like an ellipse solve the issue and take advantage of our wide screens.

That elliptic menu just need 3 main catagory buttons below as in orginal. It doesnt close screen, suitable for elliptic, and needed imo.

 

[Akka]

Do you want me to suck the **** of a dev because they've a adressed a problem they themselves originated, while the other team purposefully avoids important issues while stealing money out of their players lmao, I don't have to be nice if they avoid consumers, it's their job to answer, I would be nice if they started addressing all the problems instead of the most obvious and easy ones to fix

"not sucking d*ck" doesn't mean "acting like one".
If I were a dev and saw your posts, you'd just end in my ignore list, not get an answer.
It's totally possible to be critical and yet polite.

 

[redmark]

@redmark I read your feedback about the new system. Looks like your gripes are mostly about the formation selection. While I was implementing this feature I tested it multiple times but with a merge from the development branch looks like the input system broke. But that's no excuse, these bugs will be addressed with a hotfix. I look forward to your feedback after these fixes.

Seems worse after hotfix, not better.

- Character still performs actions while attempting to give orders (e.g. X/X ('troops move here'), character dismounts and crouches).
- Character still changes weapon while cycling through formation groups - and drops weapon when selecting formation group
- After hotfix (assume this is the 'fixed selection circle' in patch notes), the right stick now controls the selection circle* within radial menu. Which means you can't change character viewpoint to order your troops where to go, or to 'watch' what the enemy is doing while having the menu open.

* Selection circle moving within the radial menu is a) sluggish and b) moves round an invisible circle within the radial menu, which is not the same size as the radial menu and is offset, i.e. flush to the top, but not the bottom. Which all feels really weird, really slow and adds yet another counter-intuitive delay to issuing commands.

RT to issue an order from the selection circle other than the shortcuts assigned to A/B/X feels clunky; might get used to it - but character actions clashing with orders still needs fixing, and right stick to change viewpoint is a bit of a must.

 

[MRay]

- Character still performs actions while attempting to give orders (e.g. X/X ('troops move here'), character dismounts and crouches).
- Character still changes weapon while cycling through formation groups - and drops weapon when selecting formation group

The hotfix should have included the fix for equipment changing while the order radial is open. It didn't have it for some reason and I'll get to the bottom of it. I'll do my best to publish a hotfix tomorrow and will include this.

- After hotfix (assume this is the 'fixed selection circle' in patch notes), the right stick now controls the selection circle* within radial menu. Which means you can't change character viewpoint to order your troops where to go, or to 'watch' what the enemy is doing while having the menu open.

* Selection circle moving within the radial menu is a) sluggish and b) moves round an invisible circle within the radial menu, which is not the same size as the radial menu and is offset, i.e. flush to the top, but not the bottom. Which all feels really weird, really slow and adds yet another counter-intuitive delay to issuing commands.

I don't get what you mean by this. The selection speed or angles etc. didn't change, at all. We don't delay the gamepad input or lerp analog stick direction. The circle was there before but not visible. That's the only difference. The offset was also fixed and will be fixed on beta with the next hotfix.

Also, the locking of the camera didn't change. With gamepad, we locked the camera while a sub category is open, since the initial beta release. We have to do that to capture the analog stick direction.

and right stick to change viewpoint is a bit of a must.

We tried this. While selecting an order with the right analog stick, the camera moved with the stick so when player tried to give, let's say circle formation, the player started to look downwards and to the right. If he wanted to give the shield wall order, now he's looking to the skies. It made for a real weird user experience.

 

[Ling*]

The radial menu really should be optional, it's a change that most Captain Mode players do not like as it tends to get in the way of the action and blocks vision. Us captain mode players have to use the order menu probably more often than singleplayer campaign players do and it is really negatively impacting the overall UI for us. It is good to have the radial menu option for people with controllers, however the old menu should be brought back as the default order menu and the radial menu should be an optional setting. Please consider bringing back the old menu as a setting we can toggle on. Thank you.

 

[redmark]

I don't get what you mean by this. The selection speed or angles etc. didn't change, at all. We don't delay the gamepad input or lerp analog stick direction. The circle was there before but not visible. That's the only difference. The offset was also fixed and will be fixed on beta with the next hotfix.

It's sluggish. Might feel a bit better with the offset fixed, but... Not necessarily sluggish compared to pre-hotfix; maybe it was only less noticeable because there wasn't a visible selection circle.

Also, the locking of the camera didn't change. With gamepad, we locked the camera while a sub category is open, since the initial beta release. We have to do that to capture the analog stick direction.

Well, I can't revert version to demonstrate, but I'm sure I was able to select X, then change viewpoint, then X again to order move - otherwise, it wouldn't have immediately jumped out at me today that I couldn't.

We tried this. While selecting an order with the right analog stick, the camera moved the stick so when player tried to give, let's say circle, the player started to look downwards and to the right. If he wanted to give the shield wall order, now he's looking to the skies. It made for a real weird user experience.

It's still a weird user experience.

Keyboard/mouse actions to move formation group:
Number key, move flag indicator with mouse, click LMB.

Gamepad actions to move formation group:
Hold left bumper, d-pad right/left some number of times to required group, d-pad down, right stick to position flag indicator, X, X. (Why not A, A? if A = LMB?)

If I have 4 formation groups I want to position - once each - that's 26 (less intuitive) gamepad actions versus 12 key/mouse actions. If it's a large, complex battle where you have to move carefully through terrain, or re-position after an initial skirmish, or with troops split into additional formation groups, that clunkiness is multiplied again and again. If it's a rapidly changing battle, I can't adjust camera position at the last second, and have to release/press left bumper and repeat.

I'm on a PC; I can use mouse and keyboard - though I'd like to use gamepad, to improve personal combat on a laptop. But I'm really not going to if that's the sequence and commanding troops is an enjoyment-killing struggle. The 'move' command is about the most basic there can be. It should already (IMO) be a top-level command assigned to A (equivalent to LMB) as per earlier suggestions.

There are also unused controls on the gamepad. After selecting a group, you have A/B/X as shortcuts (because they're the more common commands) but are not using Y. So maybe make Y the trigger for bringing up the selection circle for the other (non-shortcut) commands (or RT, as it's already then used to select from the wheel), and lock the camera at that point. Which isn't ideal, because it's *another* level of commands for something that should be quicker; but better than locking the camera at the precise moment you want to use it.

Or another suggestion - the Y button has no character action associated, as far as I can tell, but right bumper is kick. Why not assign kick to Y, then have right bumper activate shortcut tactical commands (and bring up formation unit cards) - A to move, X to charge, B to toggle fire at will, Y to toggle formations? Left bumper to bring up the radial menu as is, for the detail and less common commands.

The d-pad to select formation group still isn't ideal, but I appreciate there are fewer alternative solutions for that - but would point to earlier suggestions again, to at least make the selection visually clearer, and perhaps remove the need for d-pad down and auto-select wherever you 'stop' the selection.

 

[redmark]

It is good to have the radial menu option for people with controllers

We wish

 

[MRay]

@redmark You can give the move order with the right trigger. AND we don't lock the camera in that stage so holding LB and tap on the right trigger gives the move order to the selected formation. Holding right trigger and moving the camera, gives custom positioning(like mouse left button hold).

The 'move' command is about the most basic there can be. It should already (IMO) be a top-level command assigned to A (equivalent to LMB) as per earlier suggestions.

It is on the right trigger for this exact reason.

 

[redmark]

@redmark You can give the move order with the right trigger. AND we don't lock the camera in that stage so holding LB and tap on the right trigger gives the move order to the selected formation. Holding right trigger and moving the camera, gives custom positioning(like mouse left button hold).
It is on the right trigger for this exact reason.

Ah ok, thanks. That is much better. Apologies for slight rant (it's been a crappy day ).
That will help with basic commands and then being able to get used to the more detailed stuff (once the other fixes are in).

Still don't like the formation group selection process . At the very least, when pressing LB could the purple selection box be made to default to the currently selected group, not return to the first group? My brain still knows I last selected 'group 2', so automatically presses d-pad right once to move to 'group 3', but selection was on 'group 1' and is now back on 'group 2'...

 

[MRay]

Still don't like the formation group selection process . At the very least, when pressing LB could the purple selection box be made to default to the currently selected group, not return to the first group? My brain still knows I last selected 'group 2', so automatically presses d-pad right once to move to 'group 3', but selection was on 'group 1' and is now back on 'group 2'...

I can certainly look into that

 

[Lusitani 5th Empire]

@emrozdemir Any plans to change design in future updates?

 

[Dejan]

Thank you, everyone, for your feedback on the new radial system, it's been very valuable. As you can see, @emrozdemir soaks up all the feedback you throw at him so keep it coming!

We've also decided to make the radial system optional with a future update, which means that anyone who prefers the "TAB" classical M&B system will be able to enjoy it in the future too.

 

[Andrei[beast]]

Thank you, everyone, for your feedback on the new radial system, it's been very valuable. As you can see, @emrozdemir soaks up all the feedback you throw at him so keep it coming!

We've also decided to make the radial system optional with a future update, which means that anyone who prefers the "TAB" classical M&B system will be able to enjoy it in the future too.

Eyyy, that's great, will kinda miss the radial stuff now that i'm used to it
Thank you Dejan

 

[Dejan]

will kinda miss the radial stuff now that i'm used to it

The radial system will still be there, to not confuse anyone. You'll just be able to pick between the two on PC.

 

[Andrei[beast]]

The radial system will still be there, to not confuse anyone. You'll just be able to pick between the two on PC.

Yeah, got it, atleast now i'll know where my commands are again.
Thanks anyways