I hereby launch the forum! :P Combat system suggestions

[Lightzy]

1) The Couched Lance:

currently you can win any fight by just sitting on your horse and jabbing with the lance. something that in reality is more or less impossible given the weight of the thing and that you're couching it under your arm.

I propose that the 'readying' time for a lance attack be at least 3 full seconds. You could of course ready an attack beforehand, like with all other attacks.
This makes more sense and makes it impossible to use a lance like a 3 kilogram spear.
Damage from lance attacks also needs a boost (or more likely, damage from swing-by attacks from horseback need to be nerfed).


2) Polearms:

Attack speed should be reduced somewhat. It should be harder (though doable) to win a fight against a competent swordsman with a shield while armed with a polearm


3) Weapon Capacity:

I propose a 3 weapon arrangement rather than 2.
A slot for ranged weapon, a slot for melee weapon, and a slot for side-arm (any small weapon with a 40 reach.. dagger/knife/etc).
This would enable you to hold your own in case you get thrown off a horse while using a lance or a polearm.

4) Arrow Capacity/Ride-By Attacks

Needs to be taken back up a bit 24 barely enough to kill 3-4 pirates even with 3rd level horse archery --- unless you sit still and take careful aim or are very lucky.. Although I do agree to 24 being a very realistic limitation.. perhaps the correct way to rebalance horse archery with regular mounted combat is to nerf the swing-by attacks a bit.
I don't know, my average of 45 damage points with a broadsword seems a bit much, considering my average damage with a nomad bow is about 14, and that I have a serious arrow limitation.


5) Lay of the Land:

Perhaps add a couple of variations? even regular flat plains would be great -- they would make sense given the shape of the map, and are a natural fit for mounted combat.


6) Arena Combat:

Archers would definitely benefit from carrying a sidearm, but more importantly:
How about 1 on 1 jousting matches? you know, like the good old days, with two knights riding on each side of a dividing fence, trying to knock each other off the horse with the lance?
My, it would work so beautifully here
I can hear the background music for a match like that in my head

 

[Balor]

24 barely enough to kill 3-4 pirates even with 3rd level horse archery --- unless you sit still and take careful aim or are very lucky..

You can put more arrows into free weapon slots. That'll deprive you of other weapons and shields... but will give you up to 72 arrows.
My current choice is a maul, bow and 2 quivers.

 

[Whitmire]

Good points, all of them.

1) Definitely. This is how I used the lance at first, before I realized that it could be used to jab a dozen times in a few seconds. The Lance should be the ultimate weapon when it comes to killing power - but difficult and slow to use especially in close quarters.

2) I agree. Not much more to say.

3) A sidearm would be nice. Although without breaking weapons, you would hardly need a dagger - unless polearms were nerfed. In that case it would be very nice to have a spare short sword around!

4) If you have time to fire 24 arrows, you have time to go to your baggage and pick up another set of 24 arrows. And, like somebody already said, you can carry up to 3*24 arrows with the bow.

Arrows could do more damage. At the moment, you need half a dozen hits to kill a naked bandit.

5) I like the lay of the land, but there is a dearth of forests. Who has hacked away all the trees?

6) As it is, mounted enemies with lances and shields are very dangerous, so 1 on 1 fights would definitely not be boring! I've noticed that if you don't want to be hit you have to be very careful with your timing when you're "playing chicken" with another mounted knight with a lance. In a jousting tournament, there should be a chance to knock your opponent from his horse if you struck hard enough (or aimed in the right location). Currently the only way to dismount a foe is to kill/club him or his horse.

I can hear the background music for a match like that in my head

Crowds cheering, knights rushing at each other, lances splintering on impact, armoured bodies tumbling to the dusty ground... Oh yeah. If it was done well, with a ranking system and everything, it would be enough content to make a full game of just the tournament, grand melee, archery contest, and other fighting events (anybody remember Knight Games for C-64?).

 

[Balor]

No-no-no, bows are NOT underpowered. You just need a few points in "Power draw", a few STR points for extra damage, a bow better then weak hunting one... and aim for the head! Right now, at 16 level and not THAT good bow (28 damage) I can score 40 damage hits and my headshots killl pretty much anything. You might as well whine that weapons are underpowered, while drawing that conclusion with not having power strike, but low str and a cudgel .

 

[HailandKill]

I think the sword fighting seems rather slow... I'm not sure if it would be too hard sped up though, I'd like to try though. Having said that sword fighting is slow... everything seems slow, even horses seem slow. And a sweeping sword PLUS the momentum of a horse would knock a man done dead first time.

Also, I'd quite like to be able to dodge rather than just block, maybe a duck feature.

Why can't I climb on a fallen comrades horse in Arena Battle? The point of a sidearm for an archer has already been mentioned.

Also, I'd like to see more control over my merry band of men... Being able to get cavalry to charge from a different direction to my sword-men and archers. For example

 

[Me]

You can get on any horse anywhere as long as it dosent run off after you kill the rider.

I've done it several times in the arena myself

 

[Plant]

You can get on any horse anywhere as long as it dosent run off after you kill the rider.

I've done it several times in the arena myself

As far as I can tell, you have to be the one to kill the rider.

 

[Lightzy]

No-no-no, bows are NOT underpowered. You just need a few points in "Power draw", a few STR points for extra damage, a bow better then weak hunting one... and aim for the head! Right now, at 16 level and not THAT good bow (28 damage) I can score 40 damage hits and my headshots killl pretty much anything. You might as well whine that weapons are underpowered, while drawing that conclusion with not having power strike, but low str and a cudgel .

Well, I'm using a nomad bow, like I said, and I have 4 in power draw..

 

[Balor]

Then there is NO way how you can have 14 average damage with a bow, since pirates are usually nearly naked.
Or you mean some other pirates, not river ones? Those that are clad in full plates?

 

[Me]

My draw power is about and with a bent nomad bow I get between 15 and 25 per arrow. Easy to finish off 12 pirates with 48 arrows, and planty of them can be left over.

 

[armagan]

Our very first suggestions thread and it has lots of good suggestions and discussion! Yay!

I'm reducing speed of lances by approx 10%. Hope that'll fix the balancing issue.

1 on 1 fights between knights would be very nice. I'll try to add that.

I believe bow damage on foot is well balanced. On horseback, there is a penalty to archery damage, which is currently 20% minus 2.5% * horse_archery level. I guess that is realistic, but I could also reduce it a bit.

 

[Balor]

Not to mention that 'bent' is not a technical trait but a flaw , thefore it does less damage.

 

[Me]

Could you make charging with the lances a bit easier? I'm never quiet sure where to aim my horses charge for.

 

[Kolya]

Could you make charging with the lances a bit easier? I'm never quiet sure where to aim my horses charge for.

Easier? Hmm, not sure about that - I like it as it is really.

 

[Me]

I dont hit as often as I would like, guess I'm not to sure on where the hit zone is for the couched lance.

 

[Kolya]

I dont hit as often as I would like

Tough luck

 

[Whitmire]

With the lance, aim at the man, just like you do on foot. Expect footmen to block, archers to go for a headshot, and mounted men to try to get a swing at you. It's not easy to score a hit, and that's why it should do more damage.

Like somebody in the tavern says, the power of the whole mounted charge is concentrated on the tip of the lance. However, at the moment it seems that double handed weapons (like 2-h swords) do more damage on horseback than lances in full charge.

I can score 40 damage hits and my headshots killl pretty much anything.

I stand corrected. Bows are not underpowered. It seems my characters are just lousy in using them (good skills but bad bows and no power draw). I had no idea that damage would be so drastically reduced in mounted archery: I thought it mainly affected accuracy. Now that I know better, I don't think it's a bad idea, and to justify the Mounted Archery skill, the damage reduction should remain as it is (at 20%, was it?). The mounted archer is very effective as it is - all he needs is an enormous bunch of arrows and a good horse.

I'm not sure what the case is now, but I think only the shortest of bows should be used on horseback. Longbows and such are strictly footman's weapons.

 

[Balor]

Well, you CAN use long bows on horseback... but in RL, you just will able to put them away and get an other weapon when you'd like to melee. Here we don't have such restrictions, tho... and I guess it's ok. Realism is nice, but too much realism can be bad too - when it adversely impacts gameplay (like making game more boring to play).

 

[Balor]

A few other ideas from Alex and me:
Location damage for bows. Right now only headshots are possible... my guess that shooting enemy in the arm should reduce it's weapon speed, and in the legs - running speed.
It would be fun to have dismemberment too... but I fear that's too much to ask.
Shooting legs twice should make enemy immobile and fall unconscious...
By the way, I recall that one enemy DID fall unconscious after I launched a few arrows into him... but it happened only one time, and I do not understand how it happened.
By the way, hitting head with melee weapons should cause extra damage too... that's why helmets are, in fact, one of heaviest and most protecting gear. It's not uncommon to have helmets 3 mm thick... while most plate armors are 1.5 mm thick.

 

[Waldschrat]

In my opinion, the beginning of the game could be easier That's why I thought it would be cool to be able to enlist as a soldier, so you're not the leader of an army (because at the beginning you don't have the money to afford some men and if, they die easily). So the system would work a bit like a fight together with allies.

This way you could earn money, experience and fight harder enemies. Missions could be something like the caravan guarding missions, but you don't control the army, it goes to the city on the shortest way.

Of course you wouldn't earn as much as you would be the leader, but it would make the beginning easier.