How will TW balance class system in battle mode?

Would you rather have more than 3 perks to choose from in battle mode?


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_COS_

Recruit
Will TW really try to balance class system in battle mode like they do in other modes? That'd be a waste of everyone's time, we're 2 years into ea and TW is still releasing balance patches.

Battle mode is really unbalanced currently. You have to get kills to be able to spawn the unit you want, otherwise you're a peasant every single time. You don't always have to get kills to have impact on the game. For example; let's say you're playing 6v6 or 8v8 battle and you're a cav player, you sit on the enemy archer the whole round and not let him shoot and helping your team win. Or you're an archer dismounting enemy cav, or an inf helping the archer not get killed by enemy cav. You can have impact in all these situations and not get any kills.

My suggestion for battle mode is to add more than 3 perks and you should carry your equipment over to next round if you survive. Having more than 3 perks would balance the class system in battle. Let's say everyone has a base starting gold of 200. There should be perks of weapons and passive perks for you to choose from. If you're playing cav for example; you should have different weapons/horses and perks to choose from. You could get an agile horse for 50 gold or a barding horse with more armor for 70 gold hypothetically. Then get a spear for 50 or a lance for 100 gold. And add some passive perks for 25 gold. Having more than 3 perks would make the class system more like warband equipment selection and TW won't need to spend another 2 years trying to balance the class system.

@Callum @Dejan @NIN3 I hope we see a different version of the current class system, because this class system will be impossible to balance in battle mode. It will be a waste of everyone's time if TW decides to move on with the current class system in battle mode.
 

_COS_

Recruit
Can you add an option for "I didn't ask for any perks at all, why is this a feature?"
An equipment selection system would be the best but I don't think TW has any intentions of removing the class system and maybe it's too late for that. The best think they can do is add more than 3 perks to choose from. No one is probably going to play in TW's official servers with the current class system when servers become moddable.
 

FearSpear

Squire
An equipment selection system would be the best but I don't think TW has any intentions of removing the class system and maybe it's too late for that. The best think they can do is add more than 3 perks to choose from. No one is probably going to play in TW's official servers with the current class system when servers become moddable.
You are probably right and that may be the case, but can I please have that polling option because I feel like that would represent my opinion and the opinion of others.
 

NIN3

Level Design, Combat Design
Developer
NW
we're 2 years into ea and TW is still releasing balance patches.
Every multiplayer game in active development receives balance updates. Metas shift no matter what. The fact that the game still receives balance updates in early access, does not prove that the class system doesn't work.


Also the notion that an equipment based system would suddenly solve all balance problems is kinda ridiculous imo. I am not saying that the class system is superior in every way with that btw, before that argument starts again. There are definitely benefits to it and I love warbands equipment based system.

Anyway, classes will stick around for Battle mode, but class costs will be different from skirmish and casual (tdm/siege). Same goes for some perks that will be different in Battle mode.

Also the economy (gold gain parameters) of battle mode will change with 1.7.2 (in addition to the troop cost changes).
 
Last edited:

_COS_

Recruit
Every multiplayer game in active development receives balance updates. Metas shift no matter what. The fact that the game still receives balance updates in early access, does not prove that the class system doesn't work.
I don't think that's the case for Bannerlord. It was almost like the classes were unbalanced on purpose until avrc left. Light inf having dozen javelins, heavy inf having 2 throwing spears/pilas, heavy cav being able to shoot a bow, months of crushthrough on 2h weapons and many more imbalances. Maybe avrc or whoever was in charge of decision making for multiplayer put these imbalances on purpose so that they could trick people into thinking they're working on something for multiplayer, who knows. This class system was clearly made for skirmish not for battle mode. I think the class system is balanced for the most part for skirmish and other modes but not for battle mode and I don't see a way TW can balance it without having more than 3 perks.

In battle, you actually need to stay alive and get kills or do damage to get gold. The strongest faction in skirmish(aserai) can be the worst faction in battle because of no armor, no heavy inf or vice versa. TW could try to change the perks for all classes for battle but we all know how much time TW spends on doing that. It will be another 2 years of trying to balance the class system in battle mode.

Sure, I'm not saying that equipment selection system would suddenly balance it out but it would be way easier to balance it around battle mode instead of the current class system. There's nothing holding TW back from using equipment selection system just for battle mode.
I understand that they refuse to use it for some reason, that's why I proposed having more than 3 perk slots, it would take less time to implement than equipment selection system and would be easier to balance than the current class system.

It will be interesting to see how TW balances the current class system in battle mode, we'll see how many people actually play in TW official servers vs modded servers. :grin:
 

Sundeki

Sergeant Knight at Arms
M&BWB
b7d.jpg
 

[UNC]V

Recruit
Every multiplayer game in active development receives balance updates. Metas shift no matter what. The fact that the game still receives balance updates in early access, does not prove that the class system doesn't work.
Also the notion that an equipment based system would suddenly solve all balance problems is kinda ridiculous imo. I am not saying that the class system is superior in every way with that btw, before that argument starts again. There are definitely benefits to it and I love warbands equipment based system.
Anyway, classes will stick around for Battle mode, but class costs will be different from skirmish and casual (tdm/siege). Same goes for some perks that will be different in Battle mode.
Also the economy (gold gain parameters) of battle mode will change with 1.7.2 (in addition to the troop cost changes)
 

[UNC]V

Recruit
balance patches should be focused on the modes that have rank system,like captain and skirmish.causal modes like siege, tdm and battle,just leave them to mod developers and server owners,players will get the best way to balance instead of let vlandia be very op for months in tdm
 

[UNC]V

Recruit
Every multiplayer game in active development receives balance updates. Metas shift no matter what. The fact that the game still receives balance updates in early access, does not prove that the class system doesn't work.


Also the notion that an equipment based system would suddenly solve all balance problems is kinda ridiculous imo. I am not saying that the class system is superior in every way with that btw, before that argument starts again. There are definitely benefits to it and I love warbands equipment based system.

Anyway, classes will stick around for Battle mode, but class costs will be different from skirmish and casual (tdm/siege). Same goes for some perks that will be different in Battle mode.

Also the economy (gold gain parameters) of battle mode will change with 1.7.2 (in addition to the troop cost changes).
Looks you are confident about the balance of 1.7.2.I just hope that it will not be another very op faction like vlandia now in tdm and siege.
 

Second[2]

Recruit
Every multiplayer game in active development receives balance updates. Metas shift no matter what. The fact that the game still receives balance updates in early access, does not prove that the class system doesn't work.


Also the notion that an equipment based system would suddenly solve all balance problems is kinda ridiculous imo. I am not saying that the class system is superior in every way with that btw, before that argument starts again. There are definitely benefits to it and I love warbands equipment based system.

Anyway, classes will stick around for Battle mode, but class costs will be different from skirmish and casual (tdm/siege). Same goes for some perks that will be different in Battle mode.

Also the economy (gold gain parameters) of battle mode will change with 1.7.2 (in addition to the troop cost changes).
again the same question, when is 1.72
 

Roy1012

Archduke
Also the notion that an equipment based system would suddenly solve all balance problems is kinda ridiculous imo. I am not saying that the class system is superior in every way with that btw, before that argument starts again. There are definitely benefits to it and I love warbands equipment based system.
My question is: in what way is the class system superior at all? I've talked to over 100 people, scoured the forums and looked myself and cannot find one answer to this question. I cannot think of one benefit to it VS the warband system. Sure, it wouldn't fix everything, the slow combat, the long swings, etc. still need to be fixed, but it would solve so many issues that have caused everyone to treat this game like the plague.
Anyway, classes will stick around for Battle mode,
Sad!
 

Aldemar

Knight at Arms
M&BWBWF&SNWVC
Remove perks and bring back the "Buy Armor Pieces and Weapons by yourself". But wait that will probably not work with a skin shop.

Priorities.

Mods will fix it, Vanilla will be dead.
 

flashn00b

Sergeant
Considering that they won't balance classes in vanilla modes, I'm sure the other guys have a better Battle Mode than Bannerlord's Battle Mode.
 
Every multiplayer game in active development receives balance updates. Metas shift no matter what. The fact that the game still receives balance updates in early access, does not prove that the class system doesn't work.
You are right. But the fact that the factions did not get any more balanced itself throughout all the "balance patches" in the last two years has proven that TW is not capable of balancing the class system they created!
The "balancing" resolved 90% around skirmish only, yet there are always factions above 60% and below 40% WR... in Skirmish!! Everything outside of 45%-55% is a big fail. I dont even have to start talking about Captain and Siege balancing :smile:
Good luck balancing all the prices and perks for Skirmish, Captain, Siege and Battle. Im 100% confident you will never succeed based on last two years :smile:
Also the notion that an equipment based system would suddenly solve all balance problems is kinda ridiculous imo. I am not saying that the class system is superior in every way with that btw, before that argument starts again. There are definitely benefits to it and I love warbands equipment based system.
I agree, the only reason why the equipment based system was so easy to balance is because the factions were so similar and had similar access to similar items. The biggest upside of the class system is that every faction actually feels very different to play.
Anyway, classes will stick around for Battle mode, but class costs will be different from skirmish and casual (tdm/siege). Same goes for some perks that will be different in Battle mode.

Also the economy (gold gain parameters) of battle mode will change with 1.7.2 (in addition to the troop cost changes).
Class system does not make any sense in battle mode, especially if the difference between the troops is day and night. One round you spawn as high equipped raidboss... next round as retarded peasant. If the strengt of troops aswell as the cost were close together maybe it could work, but you cant change that because the peasants are needed for Skirmish. Weak peasants shouldnt even exist in a single life mode. And the gold gain should not be that dependend on kills, because sending already bad players 60% of the time on a peasant must be a horriffic experience for them.
 

Namakan

Grandmaster Knight
M&BWBWF&SNWVC
You are right. But the fact that the factions did not get any more balanced itself throughout all the "balance patches" in the last two years has proven that TW is not capable of balancing the class system they created!
The "balancing" resolved 90% around skirmish only, yet there are always factions above 60% and below 40% WR... in Skirmish!! Everything outside of 45%-55% is a big fail. I dont even have to start talking about Captain and Siege balancing :smile:
Good luck balancing all the prices and perks for Skirmish, Captain, Siege and Battle. Im 100% confident you will never succeed based on last two years :smile:

I agree, the only reason why the equipment based system was so easy to balance is because the factions were so similar and had similar access to similar items. The biggest upside of the class system is that every faction actually feels very different to play.

Class system does not make any sense in battle mode, especially if the difference between the troops is day and night. One round you spawn as high equipped raidboss... next round as retarded peasant. If the strengt of troops aswell as the cost were close together maybe it could work, but you cant change that because the peasants are needed for Skirmish. Weak peasants shouldnt even exist in a single life mode. And the gold gain should not be that dependend on kills, because sending already bad players 60% of the time on a peasant must be a horriffic experience for them.
he's gone, leave him be
 

Brandis.

Subforum Moderator
again the same question, when is 1.72
If Nin3's left, and he completed the patch before leaving, then the MP side of things might be ready.

However, according to this website, Turkey is having a three day national office holiday, so the first it would be released is the 5th.

But it could be delayed by weeks if SP is not ready, or if other parts of the MP are not ready, so impossible to say.
 
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