How does Armor works? Are there different types of damage depending the weapon? And does Armor has defense types?

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Hi all, sorry for the long title.

As the tittle says: How does Armor works?
Does it blocks a % of damage received? Or how exactly this maths work.

Are there different types of damage? Pierce/Crush/Slash? And if there are, does Armor block specific damage type?
 
There's cut, pierce and blunt. Blunt almost ignores armor, pierce ignores more then cut to armor, cut is absorbed by armor the most. They're supposed to be balanced by their raw damage being more and less.... but lol okay. You can absolutely get 500 cut damage on the heaviest armored lord in the world with a Glaive from horse back.

I don't remember the formulas, but they were very miserly and correspond to most people experience of "no matter how much armor you getten ****ed up". Only the heaviest body armor against low tier units, when not moving towards them is a noticeable reduction on damage, imo.
 
There's cut, pierce and blunt. Blunt almost ignores armor, pierce ignores more then cut to armor, cut is absorbed by armor the most. They're supposed to be balanced by their raw damage being more and less.... but lol okay. You can absolutely get 500 cut damage on the heaviest armored lord in the world with a Glaive from horse back.

I don't remember the formulas, but they were very miserly and correspond to most people experience of "no matter how much armor you getten ****ed up". Only the heaviest body armor against low tier units, when not moving towards them is a noticeable reduction on damage, imo.
yeah, the balance is truly lacking. I literally don't see the point of blunt weapons when their damage is lower than other weapons, and other weapons (big swords etc) have such a big damage that armor doesn't matter anyway because they can still one-shot people no matter their armor. Multiplayer is an easy place to spot that, with menavs, glaives, that 2handed battanian sword with a weird name etc. What is the point of having a damage type that is supposed to be weak against armor if you're gonna adjust damage in a way that they still deal significant amounts of damage no matter the armor anyway. Top damage for cut weapons should be reduced. Devs nerfed throwing weapons so badly that nobody uses them anymore because people were complaining, because people want to be 2handed maniacs that one-shot everyone else and they couldn't because throwing weapons were effective against them. Nobody is complaining about 2handed weapons 1-shotting ppl as much so they're still letting them 1-shot people with no nerfs. I don't understand, it's like they don't even want to balance the game, but cater to what style of gameplay the most vocal players want to play, like the "warband pros" that are used to playing naked with a 2handed sword and spazzing out. They throw realism out the window for some, but for other aspects of the game they say "oh, well it must take you 10 years to level-up and also we will reduce your possibility of leveling up the other skills as you gain level (leveling system still not improved atm)"... Also now I can walk with a javelin sticking in my head without being dead, that makes sense...
 
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Gortar

Sergeant
Stones are the most lethal weapon in the game in my opinion. It cancels your attack even if you get hit in the leg during swing (even if you have plate boots). Can be thrown with pin point accuracy, even at moving target, and from quite far. Ignores armor, dont matter how good it is. its Very cheap too.

This post was sponsored by looters.
 

Greedalicious

Grandmaster Knight
WB
Cut negates 25% of armor
Pierce negates 50% of armor
Blunt negates 100% of armor

Unless thats been changed lately. Stones do a consistant 10-20 damage because its blunt, it literally ignores all of your armor.
Blunt is completely broken.
 

Gortar

Sergeant
Blunt is completely broken.

When they changed tournament weapons to blunt its no fun and hard anymore. Now tournaments are no challenge at all.
Now it looks like: lets knock out this guy with one swing, then the next guy (probably it was recruit/peasant too, i dont know how tf he was able to join), oh its over already? what? it was only 50 seconds for entire tournament?
And im not even suprised that tournament prizes are so mediocre most of the time.

Edit: Forgot to mention that when you hit someone with blunt weapons, hes flying like he got hit by a a train.
 
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Maown

Recruit
there is must be a "cap" of armor points, since after that number arrows can no longer penetrate it and do almost no damage at all. this will be REALISM. proofs u can check on utube
 

Maown

Recruit
Stones are the most lethal weapon in the game in my opinion. It cancels your attack even if you get hit in the leg during swing (even if you have plate boots). Can be thrown with pin point accuracy, even at moving target, and from quite far. Ignores armor, dont matter how good it is. its Very cheap too.

This post was sponsored by looters.
yes. even chain mail armor must absorb all damage from rocks. maybe tw should implement armor condition? like, if y get som damage in battle, u should repair it to keep its stats high
 

Greedalicious

Grandmaster Knight
WB
When they changed tournament weapons to blunt its no fun and hard anymore. Now tournaments are no challenge at all.
Now it looks like: lets knock out this guy with one swing, then the next guy (probably it was recruit/peasant too, i dont know how tf he was able to join), oh its over already? what? it was only 50 seconds for entire tournament?
And im not even suprised that tournament prizes are so mediocre most of the time.

Edit: Forgot to mention that when you hit someone with blunt weapons, hes flying like he got hit by a a train.
I played single player again yesterday and yeah I noticed that too, 50+ damage per attack and almost knocked a guy through the wall.
Day 5 I had a Fine menavlion, mail boots and a mail helmet. 🤷‍♂️
 

vonbalt

Sergeant Knight
WBNWVCM&B
Everyone has been complaining about that.
Indeed, since the closed MP beta i've seen people complaining that armor does nothing and on EA release one of the first mods that were made was "armor does something", there is also Realistic Battles mod now that's one of the most popular on nexus and it completely overhauls the armor formulas to be much more realistic (reminds me of how armor worked in 1257ad for warband)

Warband armor formula was awesome, a good balance between realism and gameplay, don't know why they tried to reinvent the wheel here.
 
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Akka

Sergeant
Cut negates 25% of armor
Pierce negates 50% of armor
Blunt negates 100% of armor

Unless thats been changed lately. Stones do a consistant 10-20 damage because its blunt, it literally ignores all of your armor.
Blunt is completely broken.
I struggle to understand the logic behind all this. Why make ALL form of damage reduce armor ? Why not just have lower armor values instead ? Why would blunt negate armor ? This is nonsensical.
 

vonbalt

Sergeant Knight
WBNWVCM&B
I struggle to understand the logic behind all this. Why make ALL form of damage reduce armor ? Why not just have lower armor values instead ? Why would blunt negate armor ? This is nonsensical.
yeah, it really should be reworked, right now armor is too weak and there is no reason to use anything other than blunt aswell, it's as if armor was painted on the body or something lol

maybe adding more values to armor to create a paper/scissor/rock system? just like damage is divided they could separate armor rating into things like deflection, absorption and hardness (just examples from the top of my mind) and add them accordingly to each armor based on their tier and visual representation.

a Gambeson would have bad deflection, good absorption and medium hardness for example making it weak against cut, good against blunt and medium against pierce.
 

Gortar

Sergeant
yeah, it really should be reworked, right now armor is too weak and there is no reason to use anything other than blunt aswell, it's as if armor was painted on the body or something lol

maybe adding more values to armor to create a paper/scissor/rock system? just like damage is divided they could separate armor rating into things like deflection, absorption and hardness (just examples from the top of my mind) and add them accordingly to each armor based on their tier and visual representation.

a Gambeson would have bad deflection, good absorption and medium hardness for example making it weak against cut, good against blunt and medium against pierce.
Such a good suggestion, and its so obvious to take this route. But im almost certain that its gonna be labeled as "too complex" back to console port.
 

Zarthas

Knight
I struggle to understand the logic behind all this. Why make ALL form of damage reduce armor ? Why not just have lower armor values instead ? Why would blunt negate armor ? This is nonsensical.
Have to agree lol.

In addition to the percent reduction, there's also some "soak" formulas that I have not seen fully explained, I think the system is a bit different from Warband.

Cutting 0% bypass, pierce 40% bypass, blunt 80% bypass would make sense, in my mind.
Heavy armor should still provide some protection from hammers etc, since it does disperse the hit.
 

vonbalt

Sergeant Knight
WBNWVCM&B
Such a good suggestion, and its so obvious to take this route. But im almost certain that its gonna be labeled as "too complex" back to console port.
Maybe the modding gods will hear our pleas if we cry enough in the forums :lol:
 

Tajl

Squire
Have to agree lol.

In addition to the percent reduction, there's also some "soak" formulas that I have not seen fully explained, I think the system is a bit different from Warband.

Cutting 0% bypass, pierce 40% bypass, blunt 80% bypass would make sense, in my mind.
Heavy armor should still provide some protection from hammers etc, since it does disperse the hit.

I think 80% bypass would be WAY too high especially for hard armors and most armors were quite good against piercing too. Sure Warbow with bodkin arrows could penetrate chainmail, but if any bow could have done that there would have been no need for extremely heavy draw weight warbows or bodkin arrows.

Heavy armor would provide excellent protection against hammers too. Even very light hit from small hammer to the head would make a really bad damage, skull fracture etc. Good helmet would make huge difference. Of course full force hit to the head with sledge-hammer would still be deadly, but good helmet and good angle and it would be possible to survive that. Without helmet....
 

ratschbumm

Sergeant at Arms
M&BWBWF&SNWVC
Cutting 0% bypass, pierce 40% bypass, blunt 80% bypass would make sense, in my mind.
Heavy armor should still provide some protection from hammers etc, since it does disperse the hit.
do you think that ax cannot penetrate mail? Ax is cutting in the game.
 

Tajl

Squire
do you think that ax cannot penetrate mail? Ax is cutting in the game.
Actually it is not that easy to cut mail with axe:

If it is mail and gambeson below there is good chance that even heavy blow with axe doesn't do wound. It will hurt because axe is heavy and there is lot of force. With very heavy blow it may even break bones. But compared to damage what that same blow would do without armor, difference is huge. Without armor even glancing blows with axe would be very dangerous.
 

ratschbumm

Sergeant at Arms
M&BWBWF&SNWVC
If it is mail and gambeson below there is good chance that even heavy blow with axe doesn't do wound. It will hurt because axe is heavy and there is lot of force. With very heavy blow it may even break bones. But compared to damage what that same blow would do without armor, difference is huge. Without armor even glancing blows with axe would be very dangerous.
It is not a typical ax and the conditions are weird too. what's the point to chop over hard flat plain surface with strait (at the moment of hit) blade? Typical war ax was designed to hit with its toe, this is why the toe of an ax's bit mostly was extended. It was designed this way to help to bio-mechanics of human body, which does this naturally. So ax in terminal phase looks like >| or >/ maybe, where "pipe" and "slash" represent a hit surface. More like spear point of strange shape. Comparing to the sword, ax's center of mass is almost in the end, so most of kinetic energy is applied.
 
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