How about replacing Smithing skill tree with a new Shield skill tree?

[110951667]

I think we should have the professional blacksmith npcs to do the smithing, this doesn't mean that the weapon crafting feature need to be removed. In fact, the current weapon crafting system could be turned into a weapon ordering system, that player pays denars to npc blacksmith in town and in return player come back in few days and receive whatever he ordered.

I figure that this would get rid of the denar cheese and repetitive smithing skill grinding so that the playthrough could be more focused on player defeating enemy hordes and conquering lands rather than waiting in town again and again then smelt/refine and repeat. Also, the balancing work on economy-wise of the game would be much more smoother to do. Letting 2h-sword smith-farming-cheese no longer out-match your investment on caravan or workshop.

Meanwhile, a dedicated shield skill tree can also make the weapon skill trees more focused on themselves, and let shield to be more engaged in battle. For example, let pavise shield carried on back completely negate the incoming missile from behind, or let polearm fighters to have a shield attached on their left arm

 

[Spinozart1]

Not the first post suggesting this.
There are people enjoying weapon craft (even requesting to be able to craft armors).
Instead of restricting the player choice, what could be done is to separate the smithing skill tree and make is part of the craft menu.
Then, as you suggested, it can be replaced by something else (shield seems good, to become some kind of tank).

 

[9yearsago]

Developers will not do any major changes to the game from this point onwards

 

[EmptyPepsiCans]

I'd be fine with a shield skill tree, but I wouldn't want to see smithing removed. It needs some streamlining, but I generally like it.

 

[archaicwarrior]

Shields ? Is there enough there for a tech tree ???

What about "Formations" ? Start with a basic Block , end up with complex Spear Phalanx, Pike Phalanx, Manipular Legion etc etc ??

.

 

[Oltopeteeh]

Let me remind you that the game already had shield skills. As a result of testing, they were removed. More precisely, they made it part of a one-handed weapon, as an alternative branch of pumping.
And it worked for the game.

You don't like blacksmithing because it's a money printer? TW showed how to solve this problem in e1.7.
I completed the editing in my mod, added crafting armor, bows through the menu (posted on the nexus), the nerf in the prices of things closed the gap, it became comfortable to play with and without a blacksmith. I don't have this problem anymore

 

[AxiosXiphos]

Developers will not do any major changes to the game from this point onwards

Pretty much every patch has done something major to change the game. Not always what the community wanted; but that's a pretty silly statement regardless.

Even after release - TW will want to sell DLC; so will be patching the game in line with that. Hell they are currently jumping through hoops to make non-human characters possible (mostly to help modders).

 

[Moton]

How about creating a new skill tree for shields instead of replacing?

 

[anoddhermit]

One handed already covers enough shield stuff.

Smithing is fixable. They already did most of the work they just need to make passive stamina regain better(any activity involving waiting, like waiting for poachers, deserters, etc.), tone down some outliers that hit too hard or sell for too much, and they could perhaps split town denars into merchant denars so that it caps how many weapons you can sell to specific merchants rather than just taking the whole town's money.

 

[110951667]

How about creating a new skill tree for shields instead of replacing?

That would cause a redesign of UI. The Smithing skills could be attached on a blacksmith workshop, rather than the player character.

 

[110951667]

One handed already covers enough shield stuff.

Smithing is fixable. They already did most of the work they just need to make passive stamina regain better(any activity involving waiting, like waiting for poachers, deserters, etc.), tone down some outliers that hit too hard or sell for too much, and they could perhaps split town denars into merchant denars so that it caps how many weapons you can sell to specific merchants rather than just taking the whole town's money.

Smithing is fixable indeed. Just throw this system to town's notable npc and it will be fine. Giving merchant denar cap will only force player hording the crafted 2hswords and then travel from town to town to sell these swords.

 

[anoddhermit]

Smithing is fixable indeed. Just throw this system to town's notable npc and it will be fine. Giving merchant denar cap will only force player hording the crafted 2hswords and then travel from town to town to sell these swords.

I don't see the problem with needing to travel around to sell weapons. We already travel town to town with trade goods and battle loot you can't sell all at one place.

 

[110951667]

I don't see the problem with needing to travel around to sell weapons. We already travel town to town with trade goods and battle loot you can't sell all at one place.

Not sure which version you are playing, but in my playthrough with 1.7.1, when my clan was at tier 3~4, the loot I sell after each battle usually were less than 10k, while a tier4 2h cleaver I made can be sold with 11k. A town's traders usually has around 70k I think. So as long as I don't sell my crafted 2h weapons, every single town would have enough denars to take all my loots.

 

[anoddhermit]

Not sure which version you are playing, but in my playthrough with 1.7.1, when my clan was at tier 3~4, the loot I sell after each battle usually were less than 10k, while a tier4 2h cleaver I made can be sold with 11k. A town's traders usually has around 70k I think. So as long as I don't sell my crafted 2h weapons, every single town would have enough denars to take all my loots.

I'm on 1.7.1 beta.

Loot from a single battle can sell for much more than 10k but it depends a lot on what kind of troops you're against, size of the battle, and I guess roguery skill factors in a bit.

However, if you're proactive about hunting down parties/armies, and manage your troops well enough to avoid taking more casualties than you can replenish, you can end up with big buildups of loot before town visits, not just single battle -> town.

I can sometimes chain 5+ battles before being back in a friendly territory and have 100k+ worth of loots.

 

[110951667]

I'm on 1.7.1 beta.

Loot from a single battle can sell for much more than 10k but it depends a lot on what kind of troops you're against, size of the battle, and I guess roguery skill factors in a bit.

However, if you're proactive about hunting down parties/armies, and manage your troops well enough to avoid taking more casualties than you can replenish, you can end up with big buildups of loot before town visits, not just single battle -> town.

I can sometimes chain 5+ battles before being back in a friendly territory and have 100k+ worth of loots.

So true. I didn't invest into Roguery at all. Only have the passive gain from selling captives.

But still, I wish the player char's income can be more relevant to the fights, the trades, the workshop investments, the tax from fiefs, the tribute from winning a war.

For example, I side with southern empire, the tribute gain from winning a war against northern empire was only about 1.5k per day. Meanwhile, If I went crafting 2h swords using only my main char, I can easily make 2h swords that worth 60k per day, and if I let my companions go craft 2h swords, then they can make 2h swords that worth 40k per day per companion.

 

[anoddhermit]

So true. I didn't invest into Roguery at all. Only have the passive gain from selling captives.

But still, I wish the player char's income can be more relevant to the fights, the trades, the workshop investments, the tax from fiefs, the tribute from winning a war.

For example, I side with southern empire, the tribute gain from winning a war against northern empire was only about 1.5k per day. Meanwhile, If I went crafting 2h swords using only my main char, I can easily make 2h swords that worth 60k per day, and if I let my companions go craft 2h swords, then they can make 2h swords that worth 40k per day per companion.

In my experience, 2h swinging polearms(voulge/glaive/swordstaff and so on) are the best money and XP and take fewer materials. I don't get why everyone is always doing 2h swords unless it's habit from when they were better. Or I'm missing something.

Anyway, the point I'm making is that smithing isn't a bad skill mechanically - it functions fine as an activity in the game, but the quantifiable aspects need tweaks and that is presumably easy to fix just by tweaking some numbers - the stamina regain, skill gains, sell prices, damage output of specific OP weapons, etc. - until it feels right.

It's the numbers that make it feel cheesy and make it a balance issue, being able to craft custom weapons and also the orders system are otherwise a nice addition to the game. It's just that currently it warps the economy due to the numbers, and due to the stamina system incentivizes a tedious grind to level it instead being something you level more organically(what would occur with passive regen).

 

[Askey]

Honestly, I can see modders completely reworking the skill system. I prefer the Warband one.

 

[Bjorn The Broken]

Smithing, i dont like it, i dont want it. It should be removed from the game entirely. All of my gameplays, smithing skill tree is just there to be ignored by me. Of course, this is just my opinion.

 

[EmptyPepsiCans]

I love the idea of smithing.

I like being able to make weapons for my character and party, and at high levels I can make stuff that's better than I can buy and that's perfectly tailored for my needs. That's cool.

I also appreciate that I can trade 8-10 swords for top end armor, since the armor is inexplicably worth more than an entire town. Granted, there are ways other than smithing to rectify that issue.

All that said, smithing could be a while lot better. For example, if armor was more reasonably priced I'd just buy it, and if I could go to a town with a master smith and pay for a bespoke weapon or armor piece that perfectly fits my needs I'd do that instead.