Horses climb almost vertically

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triato

Knight
Iis really amazing how good climbers horses are, and they rarelly fall if you go slow even in almost vertical terrain.
Changing this would make the game more imersive, however current AI would make your knights to suicide, also you probably would apear in a part of the terrain you can not exit with your horse and you would think how did I get here?. Anyway, once AI improves, Id like this to change, what do you think?
 
Everybody who has watched me play has been amazed by "that horse climbing up the wall". Yeah, they definitely shouldn't be able to get to some of these places, and in fact nobody should probably start out at some of these edge of zone starting points on a near 90 degree incline. Maybe 'hard blocking' off portions of the terrain would do some good for the AI pathing as well.
 
Hopefully armagan will fix those spawn points soon, but horses cannot go stright up some of those, especialy walls that are like 90*....
 
Approx 40-45degrees without a rider, and approx 35-40with. (roughly +/-)
HOWEVER this refers to the smooth slope at which the horse will get his footing I believe. Hills in forests etc. would have a more of a 'ladder' pattern, so even though the hill may look steep it would be relatively easy for a horse to get up onto it. There would be roots sticking out (which help, although not much) and it also varies with horses. I've read in one of the books that there was an incident where a horse knew how to climb out of the stable over the wall, however I haven't seen this in my lifetime yet.

To make it more simple, generally a horse can climb up the same hill a human can climb (without the use of hands). Currently, if I am not mistaken, this is not really the case in the game. Also, NPC's seem to climb a lot better without any speed reducion - or get stuck and continue trying for the next half hour. I would tend to agree with the idea of blocking off certain points of terrain, especially the spawn point which seems to be on top of a very steep slope. (Also I would very much prefer if you don't compare horses with 'hor' ::razz:) Hopefully this answers the question ::smile:

Prince, I wouldn't go so far as saying I'm an expert. This is general knowledge most horsepeople would know - providing horses are more than 'the object under the saddle' to them. The thread doesn't state much either - by official qualifications I'm actually a military grade K9 trainer.. I prefer working with horses though ::smile: Going for a year's course in 2006 tho, so hopefully I would be 'officially qualified' though ::razz:)
 
While we're on this topic, I was thinking earlier that "surefootedness" could be a stat for horses that lowers speed penalties on steeper terrain. I'm sure some horses are better than others when it comes to navigating difficult terrain, especially steppe horses and other smaller horses. That means your big charger is going to be at a disadvantage when you're facing mountain bandits with nimbler horses. Just a thought.
 
Well, by horse expert I mean you answer a lot of horse questions, and I don't know if anyone else here deals or dealt with horses as much as you.
 
Ok, so in game terms it would be

Horses cant climb more than 45 degrees in some hils, they can in others that would have a rocky (or other non flat) texture or on forests, they can't climb ore than 75 degrees on any surfece. Would that be realistic?
 
Thing is, in game so far I never encountered what you said.. Infact, I find that my horse in game would slow down and get stuck on a hill it would normally be able to go up on in real life, especially as infantry have no problem walking up it. I do however see horses slide up vertical hills after they die a lot AND NPC's tend to get less physics restrictions. Even a 75degree may be too much in my oppinion, but its just that I haven't seen such in game.

Another thing I would like to mention, is that horses would not really slow down when travelling up-hill, and infact sometimes would speed up (I'm talking about the current speeds of canter and such in game - not flat out gallop) since it is easier to go faster up hill. Its easier, (same as humans - try walking up a long hill, then try running up the same hill) although in the horse would get tired a lot faster. Infact, some hills would be impossible to walk up, since the horse would have to jump / leap upwards (I know its hard to explain what it looks like lol)

To make it simple I would take into consideration:

- horses can go up hills as steep as footmen can (without the use of hands)
- VERY steep hills, would be tackable only by footmen, but they would not be able to use their weapons or shields (since they are climbing with the use of their hands)
- realistic landscape, is normally more spread out (in terms of mountains / hills). I know it has to do with game engine, but it would help if angles which are larger than 60degrees can become 'cliffs (90degrees) and angles which are less than 60degrees can be 'smoother'.
- spawn points are not on top of a mountain, where you can't get up and where some enemies (and allies) get stuck
- AI slightly tweaked so they don't attempt to exit water at the most impossible place.
- Horses are still able to trot / slow canter up hills, and the movement speed is 'locked' on steeper hills (eg35+ degrees) at a specific speed, which is similar to trot (the horse can stop, or go forward at that speed. Its like a separate gait if you want to put it that way)
- PC's and NPC's speeds on hills are the same.

Thing is, I didn't yet experience this glitch.. So far if the hill is very steep the horse won't be able to go up ::\

Bigwig, regarding the horse's agility etc. I completely support it, but it brings us to the topic of 'horses having their own statistics, trainable horses etc'. To be honest, big does not mean agility, although a smaller horse would definately be able to squeeze between trees / caves etc easier and would be more difficult to spot amongst mountains. Mountain horses are smaller because it makes them evade mountain predators, develop balance and be able to climb mountains at an earlier age (too long to explain too much in detail). However, ultimately, size doesn't exactly mean agility. I have seen (and rode) thoroughbreds who could do a 180 turn on the spot at fast canter (and suddenly the rider realises that they no longer have a horse under them lol) so like I said, it actually brings us back to the 'stats/training for horses' topic which in my oppinion should be looked into ::smile:
 
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