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Horse menavlion needs to be removed

Do you think that menavlion should be considered as a pike and be forbidden on a horseback??


  • Total voters
    57

Users who are viewing this thread

Just a reminder that cavalry with menavlion is awful idea from EA launch that should be removed AF as its possible, no tweaks allowed.
Here are the reasons:

1) Its underpowered and almost unused in Skirmish mode and competive skirmish at all
2) Its overpowered and overused in TDM and siege mode
(for both 1 and 2, reason is simple - if you can see a menavcav rushing into you in small-scaled fights its easily gets spotted and countered, but if you cant see it in overcrowded mass fight it becomes insta death for you from ALL angles near that cavalry-player, even if he is running on lowest speed possible
3) Its very unrealistic - at this point horse bersekers and horse pikemen, horse voulgers etc. can enter game aswell...
4) Empire needs horse archers - its one of a main gimmicks for both real life Empire and singleplayer Bannerlord, and lack of any bow perk for both of Empire cavalrymen
is ridicolous, so obvious solution - replace Menavlion perk with Bow perk

discuss
 

flashn00b

Sergeant
How about reduce its reach to 167? I think the main purpose of horse glaive/menav cav is to reduce the skill requirement of cavalry at the expense of being more vulnerable to pikemen and spear cav.

If we remove swingable polearms on horseback, we'll probably get an increase in archer spammers, which I don't think is ideal for Mount&Blade multiplayer.
 
How about reduce its reach to 167? I think the main purpose of horse glaive/menav cav is to reduce the skill requirement of cavalry at the expense of being more vulnerable to pikemen and spear cav.

If we remove swingable polearms on horseback, we'll probably get an increase in archer spammers, which I don't think is ideal for Mount&Blade multiplayer.
If you cant kill archers with your side 1h weapon on horse, or even a spear, and you need swingable polearm for that purpose (sick!), i dont think then that mount and blade is good game for you, no offense. Side can already 1-2 shot any clueless archer with ease, its just not Sooo easy as with polearm
 

Terco_Viejo

Spanish Gifquisition
Grandmaster Knight
Once again another side effect of the holistic implementation of the class system; but let's get down to business.

I'm guilty, I admit it... among others, I'm one of the biggest detractors of the use of menavlion on horseback. Agreeing with a growing majority of player opinions, I will say that equipping menavlions to cavalry is stupid... I won't go for political corrections this time.

Mounted swing polearms are a swampy field that the devs have waded into all by themselves. In SP one of the favourite weapons of most newbies-casual players are the menavlion, long glaive and other super-overpowered mounted polearms.. whoever want to use them to harvest bots in an unrealistic way...ok, legit. However in MP this should be much more controlled, imho.

I repeat, menavlion for cavalry must go and moreover, I would block its use if equipped on foot and intended to be used on horseback after skavenging (this or a heavy nerf in handling speeds). The glaives, personally I would reduce the size of the Khan's guard as well as the Lancer. With the latter I want to mention again that swing arcs with polearms should be trimmed, imho (Check this thread for more info).

To the point. Although we have commented this issue before, I would like to propose a set of " interlocking " changes (for skirmish-TDM-Siege) that indirectly affect the use of menavlions and glaives.

A picture is worth a thousand words, but in a nutshell:

-XzJF.jpg

Courser
Cataphract
Palatine guard
Khan's guard and Lancer
I would unequip that ignominious menavlion by replacing it in an act of recovery with a throwing spear to get a loadout line similar to Sturgia's Raider.That bastard axe has no place in a cavalry unit, instead bringing back the bow perk would be interesting in my eyes for this unit.Let's not kid ourselves, that polearm is a menavlion in disguise. I don't understand why such a weapon was equipped for that unit. In my opinion, I would unequip that polearm and replace it with the bastard axe from the cataphract in a shorter variant.Basically a facelifting/beautification for the glaive variants with a handle length reduction. Horseback variant with a restriction on swings/turn on horseback.

In short,
A fair use of the menavlion as an anti-cavalry/support weapon. Glaives and other swinging polearms with a restriction on swings/turn on horseback.

More info here
More info here


I repeat again in case anyone is not clear about my position :lol: ; NO menavlion on horseback.


---
Edit: @drontrixsepta To see the general interest, I would enable a poll :shifty: .
 

Mabons

Sergeant Knight
M&BWBWF&SNWVC
By all means have a menavlion on horseback but it should have an upswing and stab only, same as the foot weapon. I've been using them a lot this past week, you do not need a side swing to be effective with them.
 
Once again another side effect of the holistic implementation of the class system; but let's get down to business.

I'm guilty, I admit it... among others, I'm one of the biggest detractors of the use of menavlion on horseback. Agreeing with a growing majority of player opinions, I will say that equipping menavlions to cavalry is stupid... I won't go for political corrections this time.

Mounted swing polearms are a swampy field that the devs have waded into all by themselves. In SP one of the favourite weapons of most newbies-casual players are the menavlion, long glaive and other super-overpowered mounted polearms.. whoever want to use them to harvest bots in an unrealistic way...ok, legit. However in MP this should be much more controlled, imho.

I repeat, menavlion for cavalry must go and moreover, I would block its use if equipped on foot and intended to be used on horseback after skavenging (this or a heavy nerf in handling speeds). The glaives, personally I would reduce the size of the Khan's guard as well as the Lancer. With the latter I want to mention again that swing arcs with polearms should be trimmed, imho (Check this thread for more info).

To the point. Although we have commented this issue before, I would like to propose a set of " interlocking " changes (for skirmish-TDM-Siege) that indirectly affect the use of menavlions and glaives.

A picture is worth a thousand words, but in a nutshell:

-XzJF.jpg

Courser
Cataphract
Palatine guard
Khan's guard and Lancer
I would unequip that ignominious menavlion by replacing it in an act of recovery with a throwing spear to get a loadout line similar to Sturgia's Raider.That bastard axe has no place in a cavalry unit, instead bringing back the bow perk would be interesting in my eyes for this unit.Let's not kid ourselves, that polearm is a menavlion in disguise. I don't understand why such a weapon was equipped for that unit. In my opinion, I would unequip that polearm and replace it with the bastard axe from the cataphract in a shorter variant.Basically a facelifting/beautification for the glaive variants with a handle length reduction. Horseback variant with a restriction on swings/turn on horseback.

In short,
A fair use of the menavlion as an anti-cavalry/support weapon. Glaives and other swinging polearms with a restriction on swings/turn on horseback.

More info here
More info here


I repeat again in case anyone is not clear about my position :lol: ; NO menavlion on horseback.


---
Edit: @drontrixsepta To see the general interest, I would enable a poll :shifty: .
As always, thats a lot of dedication ,Terco, thanks you :grin: Also added a poll

also nice new glaives that actually looking like an eastern glaives, i wish we would see that ingame
About palatine - in beta times, first polearm added to him as a perk was actually a menavlion, so no wonder :grin: They just changed it into smaller Imp polearm after a time
 
By all means have a menavlion on horseback but it should have an upswing and stab only, same as the foot weapon. I've been using them a lot this past week, you do not need a side swing to be effective with them.
Yeah , even without upswing menavlion thrust is longer then a default spear and almost 2 times more powerfull then a lance stab on same speed (not couched one), so with side slashes added, menavlion becomes one of most preffered choices most of times. While lancer glaive stab sucks compared to his lances, at least
 

FearSpear

Squire
Who cares about menavlion, only like 5 kiddies in TDM/Siege run around with it and farm kills, useless kills at least for siege since they don't really contribute much to the tide of the battle... Skirmish it is fairly useless since there are actually skilled players who punish lack of a shield. Let the kiddies have their fun. Sad!
 

flashn00b

Sergeant
Saw the poll and IMO, i think the most problematic of Menavlions is the Long Menavlion. I think that's the only swingable polearm that shouldn't be allowed on horseback due to essentially being a swingable pike in terms of reach. I think it outreaches some lances, too.
 

Sigaretovic

Squire
Who cares about menavlion, only like 5 kiddies in TDM/Siege run around with it and farm kills, useless kills at least for siege since they don't really contribute much to the tide of the battle... Skirmish it is fairly useless since there are actually skilled players who punish lack of a shield. Let the kiddies have their fun. Sad!

Have you tried castle of fen altai? usually at g flag in The last phase it will be swarming with pole arm cav...
 
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