Help me make a BoP combat system! (For BoP 270 B.C.)

[Dodes]

You heard right! A combat system for a BoP? Too complex you say? BoPs are too simple? Well time to blow those assumptions away and prepare for the most fun you've ever had with a BoP!

Here's the breakdown on how it currently works, we've got a solid upkeep and cost system based on unit stats but we need help making the actual combat even for both sides, as currently if one side does better in all aspects then they can exit the battle totally unscathed.

隐藏: Here is what the data looks like

So you see, the stats of a unit are broken down into these statistics:

LR = Long Range
S = Skirmish
F = Flank
MBL = Main Battle Line
P = Pursuit

each unit has a number which corresponds to its effectiveness at each of these tasks.

The formula for upkeep is derived from this: (LR + S + F + MBL + P) * 5 = Upkeep with LR, S, F, MBL, and P having its numbers have associated points to it, so like this:
1=1
2=2
3=3
4=5
5=8
6=12
7=17
8=23
Then upkeep equals the total points multiplied by a factor of five.

Cost = Upkeep for factional infantry
          Upkeep * 1.5 for factional cavalry and regional(mercenary) infantry
          Upkeep * 2 for regional cavalry

So how battle works is you have an army, then you combine all Long-Range points of all units into a number + a dice roll to get your army's long-range score. You compare each army's long range score and whoever has the highest, wins that phase. Then you take the victor's score in how much percentage he won over the loser's score and that is how many causalities are inflicted to units with long-range scores. If it exceeds 100% then causalities are applied to non long-range units you didn't participate in that phase. So if there are 5 units that got annihilated by the winner by a margin of 200%, then the loser takes a loss of 5 to non long-range units. If the loser has 0 long-range units, then 1 is substituted for a total of 0.

Unfortunately due to this system, if you win each consecutive time, you take no losses, so Pimple_of_Pixel and I are looking for a more fair and balanced approach. Any Ideas?

 

[Eктωρ]

Numbers

 

[RoboSenshi]

Its an intriguing system, system but might i suggest something, you should add another stat for morale and experience. Cause chances are if your a new recruit and 75% of ur unit is dead you'll probably run but if your a battle harden roman vet or a spartan warrior you'd probably stand and fight. You could implement a system where if over 50% of your unit is dead you have to make a dice roll against their morale score. If it fails they run, if not they stay and fight. but every round where their unit is below 50% they have to make a morale roll. Several factors can affect morale including experience. As for utilizing experience, you should add the units experience score to their battle score so it effects the outcome because despite everything, Training, equipment, even morale, you can't beat experience; in a battle its decisive. also that system could affect the players strategy as well. For example, have your more experienced troops at the flanks to make sure they hold or bring you more battle hardened army to the very forefront tip the tide of a losing war. I just think it would make the battles more dynamic. well theres my 2 cents.

As for the casualties on both sides you could take the total casualties inflected on the loser and have 15% of it be the casualties for the winner. or any percentage, its up to you to find a good balance. e.g. a unit inflicts 500 casualties on another unit, then using this system the winning unit lost 75 men in the process.

 

[Dodes]

I don't know about incorporating a XP system, but I do have on the national level a morale and discipline percentages which I haven't factored in yet

 

[Leifr Eiríksson]

Have you taken a look at CKII's combat system? It might help you out.

 

[Dodes]

I don't think CKII would help, but pixel and I are talking right now and we may have cracked the code, will post formula in a second

but it's something like this: the number of causalities inflicted back at your force is equal to the median of enemy discipline and morale divided in half.

So if I had 50% morale and 100% discipline, my median would be 75% and then I divide that in half to get 37.5% and that is how many causalities that are inflicted back at my force for attacking the enemy. To clarify, 37.5% of causalities inflicted are inflicted upon those inflicting.

so Rome with median discipline and morale of 75% engages Carthage's forces

in the battle, Rome loses 10 archers in the long-range phase, so Carthage loses 3.75 long-range units for engaging the Romans. (that would be rounded up to 4 btw)

 

[Leifr Eiríksson]

Everything you just said though sounds exactly like the CKII engine for calculating morale and losses for battles. 

 

[Dodes]

damn you paradox for thinking of this first!

 

[Dodes]

Example Battle to see if Skirmish/Long-Range is OP: Seleucids vs Carthaginians

Carthage - 100% Median Morale and Discipline
9 Libyan Spearmen
3 Numidian Cavalry
3 Sacred Band
5 Baelraic Slingers
10 Carthaginian Archers

Seleucids - 100% Median Morale and Discipline
30 Seleucid Slingers

LONG RANGE PHASE
S:64
C:61
    4% - Seleucids win phase
C: 1 long-range unit lost
S: 1 long-range unit lost

SKIRMISH PHASE
S:122
C:62
    197% - Seleucids win phase
C: 17 Skirmishing units lost, 16 non-skirmishing units lost
C: 17 Skirmishing units lost

Seleucids win via annhilation with 12 Slingers surviving

 

[Pixel]

Yeah, LR and S are really OP, we can't even get to fighting with swords yet because the skirmish phase always wipes out the other army if you win it (out of the three battles we've done so far)

 

[Leifr Eiríksson]

I had to dig this link out for you. It may just help with some inspiration and design processes. Good luck!

 

[Dodes]

Example Battle #2: What Happens when we divide casualties by 3?

Carthage - 100% Median Morale and Discipline
9 Libyan Spearmen
3 Numidian Cavalry
3 Sacred Band
5 Baelraic Slingers
10 Carthaginian Archers

Seleucids - 100% Median Morale and Discipline
30 Seleucid Slingers

LONG RANGE PHASE
S:60 + D30 = 66
C:50 + D15 = 56
                      18% - Seleucid Phase Victory
                      1 Carthaginian Long-Range units die
                      1 Seleucid Long-Range units die
       
SKIRMISH PHASE
S:116 + D30 =121
C:68 + D20 =  70
                      72% - Seleucid Phase Victory
                      5 Carthaginian Skirmish units die
                      2 Seleucid Skirmish units die

MAIN BATTLE LINE PHASE
S:27 + D27 = 42
C:69 + D15 = 82
                      95% - Carthaginian Phase Victory
                      9 Seleucid Main Battle Line units die
                      4 Carthaginian Main Battle Line units die

FLANK PHASE
S:18 + D18 = 26
C:30 + D8 =  35
                      35% - Carthaginian Phase Victory
                      2 Seleucid Flank units die
                      1 Carthaginian Flank units die

PURSUIT PHASE
S:16 + D16 = 19
C:29 + D20 = 37
                      95% - Carthaginian Phase Victory
                      5 Seleucid Pursuit units die
                      3 Carthaginian Pursuit units die

CLEAR CARTHAGINIAN VICTORY
-11 SELEUCID UNITS REMAIN
-17 CARTHAGINIAN UNITS REMAIN

 

[Dodes]

Using Example Battle #2 as example of success, this thread is now locked