Hand to Hand fighting?

[coconono]

Obviously against armored oppenents it would be useless (it could be made so that you took damage) but, it would be nice to sock some of the river pirates in the face in lieu of clubbing them. Especially when I run out of javelins.

However, the mechanics of unarmed fighting are as varied and complicated as weapons fighting....

 

[Balor]

Well, one should say the are even more complicated... Well, a few punches and, perhaps, kicks could be added... but I doubt that it should be anything but a last resort 'weapon'. *emagines myself doing ride-by kicks*

 

[Lord Blade]

Actually, that's not a bad idea.

Kicking.

While on a horse, there could be a "kick" button. It wouldn't really do much in the way of damage. But you could use it to push back anyone standing beside you. And possibly try to dismount another rider.

After all, in real life, it was quite a common practice to push away people while mounted. And often one mounted fighter would try to unhorse his opponent by any means available.

 

[Whitmire]

Careful!

Kicking in full body armour is very dangerous - to the kicker! Because your weight is divided in a different way than without armour, kicks must be kept low or there is a real danger of losing your balance, and it's rarely worth the risk kicking, let alone kicking up. So, when you are kicking, you should compromise as little of your stability for as much effect. There's little that overreaching for the chest/head can do that a solid kick in the side of the knee can't accomplish.

So, while I don't think unarmed combat is that important, kicking from horseback or a low kick on foot would be nice additions. Also, if you want to add basic hand to hand techniques, try using medieval treatises (like I.99, or Vadi's and Fiore's longsword treatises) for inspiration and not Westerns/Kung-Fu movies.

 

[Ferox]

Knights were trained to grapple and use their body and weapon as one. If you look at some of the fighting texts of the day you see warriors being trained to grab parts of the body and do all kinds of moves with a free hand etc.


It would be neat when using the two handed great sword to be able to reach out a hand and use it to grab an opponents elbow or something like that, but that may be way too advanced for video games hah.

The best book is a book from a 15th century german fight master. It is called " medieval combat: a 15th century illustrated manual of sword fighting and close quarters combat" this is by the fight master Hans Talhoffer.


The book covers everything from sword and shield, to great sword, to pole arm, to my favorite weapon the POLEAXE!

 

[Arathiel]

picking up a grown man in what looks like full plate armor is no minor feat. crazy germans.

 

[Mr 47]

Boxing in Zendar!
Perhaps being able to disarm opponents?
Maybe add Karate if we get a new Asian-style faction

 

[NorphTehDwarf]

How bout savate (French kickboxing)?

 

[Me]

I think I saw part of that book in a documentary. A bloke had learned some of it and did some fight scenes. The'd sometimes grab the blad itself and wack each other over the head with the hilt. Was very flowing method of sword fighting with big 2 handed swords.

 

[Balor]

Well, since full plate is about 30 kgs, it's not THAT big a feat. After all, he didn't lift him over his head or something... what heavylifters do rather easily with heavier weights.

 

[Kevar]

The only use I could see for hand-to-hand fighting is perhaps a tavern brawl minigame, which could actually be fun. Using it in actual combat would probably be useless due to the sword, shield and armor nature of the game. Your character in this game (with the right stats) is a skilled and powerful warrior but he's not a movie star. Adding "grabs" or similar feats to the fighting system would just require more balancing to an already good system.

 

[Me]

Its true, i've never seen a situation in game when I was left without any weapons.

 

[DarkAngel]

I like the tavern brawl idea

 

[Ancientwanker]

Kicking someone in the face from horseback would be kinda....cool. Hate it when those filthy mongrels get near my purty horse. Sometimes I play with them and parry for awhile but kicking them in the face would be nice.

 

[Lhorkan]

Hi everyone, my first post in these forums.

As posted before, I doubt that hand to hand combat would be very useful, but disarming with your sword could be, I think. You know, you place your sword below the weapon of your opponent, and you turn your weapon around the arm of your opponent (with his sword under control of yours) (of course, all happens very quick), causing him to drop his weaopn. Would only be possible with one handed weapons, no daggers of course. And yes, no pole-arms as well.

When you are disarmed, hand to hand might become intresting. A quick kick in the opponent's chest so he loses balance, and giving you time to pick your weapon back up. If you're lucky, he might even have dropped to the floor, allowing you to make the finishing move.

 

[Rorthic]

id like to see a quick attack added, less dmg but faster swing, like a smack with the hilt of the sword, maybe smack them with your sheild...could solve some of the problems with multiple apponents kicking oyur ass.

 

[Kynes]

It's almost the wrong sort of game for it however. The only other game I can think of with an emphasis on swordplay and melee is Jedi Knight and M&B's simplicity is its virtue. Personaly (and this is probably a bit of a drain on the system) it would be cool to have weapons dropped from enemies in the same fashion as shields, spears from downed horsemen especially. Also that last idea was stupid and I'd like everyone to ignore it.

Hit detection in crowds and one-on-one is incredibly good especially the sytem of feinting and blocking. I can block an enemy mid-swing in the middle of a crowd and have an ally run him through. I've never felt the need to kick or disarm my enemy (unless you refer to removing his arms. . .).

A better idea would be a shield whack. I'm not basing this on anything but I'd imagine if I was in a crowded battle and had a 10 kilogram lump of wood on one arm I'd probably take a swing at someone.- take that master Hans Talhoffer!

 

[Rorthic]

i didnt say there was anything wrong with hit detection, i also have no problem blocking them. The problem with crowds is that you have no chance to attack back if there not all hitting at the same time. Hence the reason a quick attack would be useful. if you manage to hit the guy it would alter his attack timing.

 

[Whitmire]

While I think that a complete system for Unarmed combat is a bit too much for this game - after all, the swordplay isn't realistic either - I do agree that a quick attack button would be useful. This would also help in the Knockback dilemma. If you are attacked by a multitude of people, you could still place a few quick jabs here and there and perhaps get a moment's relief from their attacks.

These quick attacks could be attacks with the shaft of the weapon, the pommel or even the crossguard of a sword, or secondary attacks such as an attack with a shield, fist, elbow, knee (even headbutt)... A common factor to all of these would be the fact that they are all short-ranged, quick attacks that do little damage but can buy you some time. Attacks could be randomized similarly to existing melee attacks.

I do not fancy implementing karate or other martial arts, or kicking people in the chest. Like I said before, kicking high in armour is very dangerous - to yourself!

 

[Kynes]

For a historical perspective read up on:
http://www.thearma.org/essays/kicks.htm

Again tho, realism shouldn't be the deciding factor in implementing anything to game. If it could be put in without unbalancing the gameplay I'd be all for some sort of grapple/kick/shield whack.

Edit:
^^^^ all good suggestions. My contribution is thus- the 'quick-attack' would do maybe 1-5 dammage and produce the 'reeling back' animation (the one used when an NPC's shield is destroyed). What do people think?