General suggestions thread.

[DrTomas]

That would be great Astolphus!

We would need a faction list, settlement list and a lord list(lords should be the ones that actually were alive in 1257 - but this can come later, as I'm not sure about the number of them for the factions) and some little background on the political situation if possible. I have no-to little knowledge on how the things worked there in Italy at the mods time. But if there are a n number of small factions we might need to unite them in some form or another - so if you have suggestion on this, it would be very welcome.

 

[Lazyman]

By the way, Prince of Judah raises a very good point, why are there armoured horses going around for everyone? Should they not be restricted to the Anatolian Turks, Romans and Mongols? Who I know used lamellar barding, do not know a bout anyone else, and all their horses are statistically the same as the caparisoned desteriers... and yes the Mamluks should not have armored horses, they should be covered with decorative cloth .

 

[Astolphus]

That would be great Astolphus!

We would need a faction list, settlement list and a lord list(lords should be the ones that actually were alive in 1257 - but this can come later, as I'm not sure about the number of them for the factions) and some little background on the political situation if possible. I have no-to little knowledge on how the things worked there in Italy at the mods time. But if there are a n number of small factions we might need to unite them in some form or another - so if you have suggestion on this, it would be very welcome.

Ok I'll open a thread tomorrow when the mists of alchool will leave me ... obiouvsly when gf will left me a moment of quietness

 

[PrinceCantemir]

Here's a general suggestion: ADD MORE SETTLEMENTS. As you may know Europe 1200 has a lot of settlements, so can you please do the same if you can?

 

[Lazyman]

By the way mate the manuscript you pmed me about was bloody awesome! Thanks!

 

[F.F.C._fritz]

It's just silly to worry about the historical accuracy of the disc shield or whatever when we have glaring historical inaccuracies all over the campaign map. Jerusalem belonging to the KoJ is just one example. I frankly think that the Italian city-states were far more relevant in medieval history and far more worthy of faction slots than three random pagan tribes in the Baltics. Did those pagan tribes actually do anything other than get conquered in rapid succession by the Teutonic Order? Whereas the Italian states were involved in a long series of protracted, bloody wars. Don't even make them individual city states - make them a broader "league" state (call it the Holy League, even though it's totally out of place in this century, at least it's better than making them vassals of the HRE which they decidedly were not and should never have been in the first place), if you have to, though I really think the performance issues in the mod aren't stemming from the number of factions or the number of settlements because I've seen mods that perform better than this one - and have more factions!

To emphasize: it's stupid for there to be three separate Baltic tribes and then not a single Italian city state but Venice (a city far more defined by its machinations in the Med. than any sort of control it exerted over Northern Italy).

Thanks for bringing this to our attention. Sadly, Italy is quite under-researched, A few months ago it was even more empty then it's currently is. If you're willing to provide an abstraction of the-political situation of Italy in 1257 with factions, settlements and similar things that we can use in the game we will likely include it in the mod.

I can help too about Italy. Even if I think there would be too many factions. For examples, Pisa and Genova battling each other, Florence with its iternal fights between guelphs and ghibellines, Siena, Pistoia and so on and that's just (mainly) Tuscany...I think that due to the complexity of the subject a sub-mod would be the best solution for an accurate medieval Italy, while the mod itself should use a simplified solution.  Adding Genova and Pisa, the latter with its sardinian possessions and Milan and Verona, for example and then leave other not yet expanded city-states to be part of two bigger factions, guelphs and ghibellines.
I know it would sound very simplified, the idea wasn't liked last time I suggested and brings many problems (who's the factions' leader, i.e.) and it would be not 100% accurate, but what would be the sense of (i.e.) a Florence and a Siena faction in such a big map? This while Florence (again) was divided between guelphs and ghibellines, btw.
They would be not much more useful than the little baltic factions. 

 

[Jage0910]

Hey guys I really love your mod and I think it's amazing what your team has made.

As much as I love your mod the one problem I've had is making money. Especially since everything is so expensive now (Which is well and fine imo).

As much as I love your mod Brytenwalda (Another mod I love) had a way that let players gain money through loot alone. The Supply Wagon.

For people who have not played Brytenwalda the Supply Wagon was something that the player could create using tools and 2 horses. It's function was that you put items into it's inventory and send them into the city (with a sizable escort so bandits and enemy lords don't horribly destroy it) with one of your companions who will be it's leader. When it returns it would have sold everything in the cart and gave an amount of money that's relative to the items stored (for example if you filled it with top tier equipment you'd get a fairly large haul).

I think that it would be great if you guys could make your own version in this mod simply because equipment and armies are much more expensive that before along with the feature of the fortified manor which is also a money-sink (albeit a very useful one).

Thanks for reading this. I'm looking forward to what you bring in the future.

 

[sifis172]

I saw something like what you describe but i'm not sure
what it was.I have a question, i saw in barcelona
in the recruit mercenaries something like "a local party of
mercenaries which volunteer to carry things", it was something
like that.I can't remember, they weren't cheap so i couldn't trie them.
Anybody knows what was that?
THX in advance

 

[Cuthalion]

I just got the two volumes of David Nicolle's "Arms and Armour of the Crusading Era" and he points out early on that Byzantine-influenced illustrations are awkward to interpret because of their historicising styles and stuff. That being said, some of his assumptions aren't completely waterproof either I guess, jazerants on the Bayeux Tapestry...?!

But he presents a list of the troops employed in different parts of Europe, down to the infantry and javelin thrower details. I know Tomas is far from changing the troop trees, but we'd probably have this information up our sleeve.

 

[Lazyman]

I think he refers to this

Spoiler

At least it looks like some cloth to me .

 

[Cuthalion]

I'm not trying to lead this even more off topic, but on the other hand there are the arguments saying that some are gambesons or that the whole thing is just overrated and everything is supposed to show maille in varied form (that's e.g. what Gerry Embleton writes). Still, I made the experience that historical reality was much more vivid than what can be gathered from the most popular sources.

 

[Lazyman]

Its a problem, many cultures wore armour underneath their clothes, and we cannot distinguish things whne we look at their representations .

 

[Prince of Judah]

Their behavior matches that of soldiers trying to stop the landing, not raiders. Also, 6000 seems a reasonable number if it is an expeditionary force. Jean de Joinville's memoirs are one the most sober accounts left around this time. It is much more trustworthy in comparison to most accounts, which were written by Monks who didn't understand military matters well.

Generally, eye witness accounts WILL be exaggerated, and there was no plan to stop a landing, since the Crusaders easily marched on to Damietta which was abandoned , hence, it was a raid .

BTW can you give me the exact passage?

They must have been mamluks instead of simply Bedouins because they are described as clad in magnificent glittering armor.

  "On the Thursday after Pentecost the King arrived off Damietta, and there found all the forces of the Sultan on the sea shore, very fine men to look at; for the Sultan's arms are of gold, and they glittered as they caught the sun. The noise that they made with their kettledrums and their Arabian horns was dreadful to hear. "
http://etext.virginia.edu/etcbin/toccer-new2?id=WedLord.sgm&images=images/modeng&data=/texts/english/modeng/parsed&tag=public&part=6&division=div2

Whether he is referring to the Sultan himself, or weapons/armor paid for by the Sultan, I am not sure, but these were no mere raiders.

 

[Lazyman]

I do not know what the bloody hell he is talking about, the Ayyubid Sultanate was in meltdown at the time and there were VERY few mamluks going around, it took them 9 years just to get to 3 thousand Mamluks during Baibars, so it is extremely unlikely . What he thinks is gold could very well be simple lamellar vests . You are right though, bedouins do not wear armour , so I am inclined to think they were Turkomans .

and when they saw that they could come no further without being run through the belly, they faced about and fled away.

Again, to me, it sounds like a charge gone wrong .

Just to be clear, we are in agreement over horse armour , but as it is right now, a lamellar covered warhorse will have the same stats as a caparisoned desterier so it does not really make any difference

 

[Prince of Judah]

Okay I guess I was under the impression that Mamluks were the mainstay professionals of the Ayyubid/ Mamluk sultanate's troops.

I wasn't advocating any changes by the way. Just stating some observations.

 

[Lazyman]

Well I would say it is ahistorical to have lamellar barding for the Mamluks, and they were the mainstay of Ayyubid and later Mamluk Sultanate armies, the Ayyubids just did not have alot of them around .

 

[Otori Shigeru]

I experience one MAJOR problem in this game. It is the shields. They cover MUCH more than the actual visual size. I find it impossible to hit an enemy around the edges of the shield and it's not because I aim bad. Your archers make no damage against infantry with their shields up. It forces you to use the unrealistic and ugly tactic to ride around the infantry so that they turn their backs against your archers.

It is NOT FUNNY, NOT REALISTIC and well, I just can't see any reason to why it should be like this. There is one exception for the very small round shields though. I don't know much about scripting but I can imagine it can't be too hard to fix. Tell me if I'm the only one who are finding this a huge problem? I hope you have opinions.

 

[DrTomas]

I experience one MAJOR problem in this game. It is the shields. They cover MUCH more than the actual visual size. I find it impossible to hit an enemy around the edges of the shield and it's not because I aim bad. Your archers make no damage against infantry with their shields up. It forces you to use the unrealistic and ugly tactic to ride around the infantry so they turn their backs against your archers.

It is NOT FUNNY, NOT REALISTIC and well, I just can't see any reason to why it should be like this.  There is one exception for the very small round shields though. I don't know anything about scripting but I can imagine it is not too hard to fix. Tell me, am I the only one who are finding this a problem? I hope you have opinions.

Forcefield effect. Your imagination is wrong - it's not easy to fix. Removing the shield skill from the troops makes there shields inefficient big time, leaving them, while not perfect is better.

 

[Kelem]

it's not easy to fix. Removing the shield skill from the troops makes there shields inefficient big time, leaving them, while not perfect is better.

If you decrease the initial size of shields, maybe it should help, isn't it ? It would only be a modification of the item_kinds1.txt... hmm... ok, there are a lot of shields to change though .

In my game I mainly invest in Power Draw to break shields in 1/2 arrows to avoid this problem ... and I increased the number of arrows in quivers too  .

 

[diavel]

I experience one MAJOR problem in this game. It is the shields. They cover MUCH more than the actual visual size. I find it impossible to hit an enemy around the edges of the shield and it's not because I aim bad. Your archers make no damage against infantry with their shields up. It forces you to use the unrealistic and ugly tactic to ride around the infantry so that they turn their backs against your archers.

It is NOT FUNNY, NOT REALISTIC and well, I just can't see any reason to why it should be like this. There is one exception for the very small round shields though. I don't know much about scripting but I can imagine it can't be too hard to fix. Tell me if I'm the only one who are finding this a huge problem? I hope you have opinions.

Shield skill represents real world ability to adjust angle and position of your shield according to what's trying to hit you. That's why shields doesn't break that easily if the person using it angles the shield so that blows glance on it; and that's why even with small shield you're able to protect yourself in wide angle. It's not shown in animations though.
The "unrealistic and ugly tactic" is called flanking, it may be "ugly" but it's definitely not unrealistic.