Game breaking faction/kingdom snowballing balance problem

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Mishka

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They might have money but they have no will to use them - in my old save that is. Still starving to death, with 20k+ money and plenty villages and cities to buy from around, they just run around aimlessly with "0+63w" army size untill a group of 5 looters eats them.

So... not really fixed yet.
 

Zeskerr

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I've noticed that when kingdom gets wiped out the clans of that kingdom join the kingdom that beat them. I feel like they should be equally distributed among other kingdoms to avoid these inbalances. Plus I think other kingdoms dont ally to try to contain the more powerful expanding kingdoms.
 

Kribble118

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WBNWVCWF&SM&B
it seems they are attempting to fix the issue which is definitely good but i think armies need to be nerfed and rebellions and unrest should become an issue to an over extending kingdom. If you make an empire get major penalties for expanding too fast then you'll slow growth by at least 2 fold. This will also keep the players kingdom from doing the same thing. In warband once i got a decent sized kingdom i would just steam roll because there was no reason not to.
 

Crotiz

Regular
M&BWBWF&SNWVC
Update: day 90 of my waiting campaign and the vlandians have already taken many castles from sturgia and even 1 city. With this pace, sturgia will be gone in maybe 50 days.

Note: I really love the start of the game when there are many different factions, kinda makes it boring for me when 2-3 are eliminated :smile:

Edit: 160 days and Battania has been taken over by khuzaits lol, (not sure how that happened since factions are not supposed to push all the way to the other side of the map) Vlandia keeps pushing sturgians, Western and northern empire are fighting but it seems like northern empire is always eliminated in every campaign I do.

Edit: 200 days in and unfortunately the battanians and sturgians has fallen to the khuzaits.

Edit: Day 600:
bbf470d14fd63b13afef3d2ced461c35.jpg
 
Last edited:

Marcquez

Veteran
Update: day 90 of my waiting campaign and the vlandians have already taken many castles from sturgia and even 1 city. With this pace, sturgia will be gone in maybe 50 days.

Note: I really love the start of the game when there are many different factions, kinda makes it boring for me when 2-3 are eliminated :smile:

Edit: 160 days and Battania has been taken over by khuzaits lol, (not sure how that happened since factions are not supposed to push all the way to the other side of the map) Vlandia keeps pushing sturgians, Western and northern empire are fighting but it seems like northern empire is always eliminated in every campaign I do.

Edit: 200 days in and unfortunately the battanians and sturgians has fallen to the khuzaits.
Will require some more tweaks then :smile:
Thanks for checking!
 

Eggs Benedict

+1 What I've seen is that a lord defeated in battle has a hard time creating another army. I'm on beta e1.0.4 and the same issue happens.
 

Sgt.Laeffy

Recruit
WB
Is it fixed? I am now waiting in a town for 1000 days to see if a faction takes over or not. Will keep you guys updated.

I'm not sure. I was about to do the same. Yes, please let us know! I've been dying to play but it's just not worth it with this problem.
 

Alphα

Section Moderator
WBWF&SNW
Battania are rolling over the factions with .4 after only 200+ days.

Still not solved for me.
 

Crotiz

Regular
M&BWBWF&SNWVC
Without player interaction it took 500-600 days for khuziats to rule the world as seen in my screenshot above.
 
Please taleworlds fix this ASAP, it is really frustrating as a player for your actions to have next to 0 influence in the world. I suggest implementing more internal conflict in non empire factions and locking the empire factions in a ethernal war against each other. I belive implementing these things will make for more back and forth in the factions and will make the players actions more desicive
 

Gunmars

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Snowballing via lack of troops seems to be better, not perfect but now the big issue in my game is factions being dismantled early by dumb AI thinking 2 wars at the same time is a good idea.

Western Empire. Day 82 is down to 77 total strength because they were at war with Battania then declared on Southern Empire. Fighting two different wars, Battanias only major enemy was West Empire and South Empire peaced with Aserai leaving them only at war with West Empire so it's basically a 2v1.

AI needs to understand that fighting one war is fine with 5500 total strength vs 6000 total strength BUT letting another war open with another 5k+ total strength becomes 5550 vs 10k two front war should be avoided at all costs.
 

SA_Avenger

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It's indeed quite frustrating right now, I can do with most the other bugs but not one where there is nothing left for me to do because one faction rules everything. In my latest game the Aserai took everything without difficulty with several very strong armies.
There should be a rebellion system where holdings of different cultures revolt and return to their owner if not enough garrisoned.
 

Northcott

Knight
M&BWB
Snowballing via lack of troops seems to be better, not perfect but now the big issue in my game is factions being dismantled early by dumb AI thinking 2 wars at the same time is a good idea.

Western Empire. Day 82 is down to 77 total strength because they were at war with Battania then declared on Southern Empire. Fighting two different wars, Battanias only major enemy was West Empire and South Empire peaced with Aserai leaving them only at war with West Empire so it's basically a 2v1.

AI needs to understand that fighting one war is fine with 5500 total strength vs 6000 total strength BUT letting another war open with another 5k+ total strength becomes 5550 vs 10k two front war should be avoided at all costs.

It would help if the game made a big deal of announcing wars, too, so that you could see who was declaring, the pretext, etc. It added flavour and (perhaps most importantly) clarity. Now such things just kind of fly by in the scroll feed, and you can't even check the most recent announcements to see what you're missing. I had just left the Battanians in their horribly messy and lopsided fight with the North Empire so I could scamper off to Khuzait land to find some nice armour... only to discover that everybody had red text over there. Whooops! They're all enemies, now! :grin:

It makes sense if a second kingdom delcares mutual war on an enemy for treaty reasons, or just because they want to take 'em down. We used to see kingdoms ganging up on each other, too (X and Y have declared war because they consider Z too strong and want to check its power).

Along with the much-needed tweaks to the AI to keep NPC lords from acting like complete dunces, these macro adjustments to diplomacy issues would go a long way to preventing snowballs.
 

blazerules

Recruit
factions being dismantled early by dumb AI thinking 2 wars at the same time is a good idea
Ive had my OWN faction of literally just me declare war on Sturgia. I was based in aserai lands.

I got a suspicion that factions don't actually declare wars but theres some script that just randomly makes 2 factions at war every now and then.
 

Gunmars

Recruit
It makes sense if a second kingdom declares mutual war on an enemy for treaty reasons, or just because they want to take 'em down. We used to see kingdoms ganging up on each other, too (X and Y have declared war because they consider Z too strong and want to check its power).
I agree to a point but I still think having 1 or 2 factions being gutted within the first 80 days isn't ideal, especially if a kingdom getting destroyed is one the player wants to align with, depending on what difficulty you play on getting to even be a mercenary in 80 days is tough, let alone doing so and your faction is gone.

I got a suspicion that factions don't actually declare wars but theres some script that just randomly makes 2 factions at war every now and then.
Yep. It makes zero sense why they do what they do. It seems like they put in specific scripts to make faux AI diplomacy.
 

[Rei]

Knight at Arms
WBVC
Just adding to the story. Alot of good suggestions in this thread!
Should be the most pressing issue atm!
 

Sgt.Laeffy

Recruit
WB
e1.05 Patch Notes:
* Snowball effect developments: clans now no longer want to defect to kingdoms which captured their settlements earlier in a campaign. AI defection calculation now cares about relations much more and new ways to lose relations have been added. If a party besieges a settlement, the army leader will lose relation with the settlement owner. Also, after a successful siege, there is a secondary relation loss between both the settlement owner and the aggressor’s faction leader.

About to run a e1.05 test. I'll see if much has changed.
 
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