Fun duels and serious duels?

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Vissy

Baron
WBNW
I've had this idea for a while, and it has developed while playing on the Nditions_Duel and Swadian_Duel servers. It is an idea of what is a "fun" duel and which duel isn't fun.


First off, let me clarify: this is not a ragequitter's testimony or anything of the sorts. I'm a fairly good duelist myself, and this is purely just an idea.


See, most people do anything to win a duel. They chamber a lot, use awkward strategies(for example floorspamming), and try to make it really hard for the opponent to play against. Now, I'm not saying that it is necessarily bad, or not fun to fight against. I'm just saying that most peopel don't find it very fun trying to figure out where the attack is coming from, say when dueling against a guy who uses the floorspam method. Or trying to figure out when your opponent tries to chamber and when he doesn't,(which probably makes you hold your attack before a swing). Obviously some very good duelists find this very comfortable to fight against, since they know their stuff and are dueling experts, but most aren't. So where to draw the line?


My idea of a fun duel is that both duelists try to achieve superiority over the opponent without using a complicated strategy, say floorspamming or chambering a lot. It just makes dueling a tad too easy(if you know what you're doing, of course) and is focused on winning, not having fun. Fun duels, on the other hand, should be focused on having fun, rather than winning the duel. In native most people find it rather hard to perform a rechamber(unless you're using polearms or you're just a damn good with timing), and because chambers are, for the most time, one-hitters they have a laming effect to duels. I'm not saying it is the case always, though, because I've had very good duels with some extremely good(and much better than me) players with usage of chamber, but I must say that I've never had an enjoyable duel against a floorspammer, I rather just find myself guessing the direction of their attack and trying to react in time. Which is even less fun, IMO, that floorspam is just what it is: spam, since sometimes you even have a hard time saying was it a swing or just another extreme feint.

So maybe there could be different servers for serious and fun duels? Yes? No? Why?

Tell me your opinions, I hope we can have a good chat on this. :smile:
 

apsod

Master Knight
M&BWBNW
I find it fun to try and counter any trick my opponent might throw at me. Try out different weapons and fighting styles against players that use some tactic that you can`t beat.
 

Vissy

Baron
WBNW
As I said, it's not a rant about unbeatable opponents. I do fairly well on any duel server, but  I'd like you to input your opinions.
 

Scully

Baron
WBWF&SNW
First comment is always a misunderstanding! True story. Anyway, sometimes I pretend to be worse at duelling then I really am, to see if they might change their tactics to something more fun. But they rarely do xD
 

Habbla

Sergeant Knight
You can't really define what's fun and not for other players, since that's completely individual for each person.

edit: typos!
 

Corsair831

Sergeant
WF&S
as far as i'm concerned, greatsword floorspammers and macro abusers should be banned from all duel servers, it ruins duelling for all serious duellers.
 

Goker

Archduke
WBWF&SNW
Yup. I like it when players face me and not my feet. People should stop being foot fetishists.
 

Frosty

Grandmaster Knight
M&BWF&SWBNW
Das Knecht said:
So maybe there could be different servers for serious and fun duels? Yes? No? Why?

There's no need for different servers, it all depends on what you prefer, you don't have to duel everyone.
 
Habbla said:
You can't really define what's fun and not for other players, since that's completely individual for each person.

edit: typos!
This but also...
Corsair831 said:
as far as i'm concerned, greatsword floorspammers and macro abusers should be banned from all duel servers, it ruins duelling for all serious duellers.
This.

Kind of a lose lose situation. That's why I don't duel much... WFaS duels ftw!
 

Habbla

Sergeant Knight
Haven't we been over this a lot of times?

It looks dumb and **** and turns (some) new players off dueling. The system could have been made better.
It does not ruin duelling for "serious" duellers. I, for one, think it makes it more interesting.  Are you guys just trollin'?
 

Vissy

Baron
WBNW
Habbla said:
You can't really define what's fun and not for other players, since that's completely individual for each person.

edit: typos!

That's exactly what I said :smile:

I wouldn't go as far as banning people for floorspamming, but I'd be very glad to see it introduced as a new rule or recommendation to NOT floorspam on some of the most active dueling servers.

But as I said numerous times in the OP, some people might find it interesting to fight against floorspam/macro. Maybe they are so good that they look for very hard challenges, but that's just a very small percentage of all the players of warband who like dueling.

Then again, most people I've met consider floorspamming a glitch and abuse, and when looking from the moral point of view it is not a right approach to dueling, since most people just aren't that good to counter it effectively. Sure, the 1% elite of the elite of warband's players say that it's interesting to play against. But they're just that, a minority.

Also, you can't really know beforehand who is a floorspammer and who is not, and most people don't stalk people to see if they do so. Most people join a duel server, expecting a regular opponent who isn't hugging your boots/macroing etc. but yes,  if you see someone doing it you usually won't duel him except by accident :smile:

As a whole, perhaps servers are not a good way of approaching the problem, but it's just one idea. There'll be more, i'm sure with so many people as we have.

 

b00227783

Sergeant Knight at Arms
WBNW
Fun duels to me are when both players can block decently and know how to feint, chamber, and use footwork to get a double hit in. Oh and hold attacks.

Serious, in other words, the stupid duels, are when people just completely ruin the immersion by jerking out on the floor while doing 720s into the air. And while I'd like to say I could beat them, I can't because out of all this whizzing around like a spaz, they can somehow get the correct block in. But if they feel like making a virtual fool of themselves, they can go ahead and continue to do their twitchy duels. I'm interested in actual timing, not just using glitchy and deceptive moves to beat my opponent.
 

🐝 M

Marquis
If I said what I thought of most of the posts ITT I'd be instantly banned with no prior warnings
 

LordHasek

Knight
WB
I kinda know what the OP is talking about. To me "Fun duels" aren't so much about tricking your opponent and more about being displays of skill, whether that skill is blocking, chambering, footwork, etc... I try to not to use any particularly vicious moves if its just about having some fun. Serious duels are fine too and are fun in their own right, though not everyone is looking to have serious duels all the time. A rough gauge for how serious a style would be the "battle test" - ask yourself, "Would I be able to use these moves on a battle server?" if no, then you're probably being a tryhard srs business doolist.

EDIT:
[M] said:
If I said what I thought of most of the posts ITT I'd be instantly banned with no prior warnings

:grin:
 

🐝 M

Marquis
Two tournament organizers disparaging tryhard (read: competitive) players. Incredulity and misanthopy readings are off the ****ing chart guys pleeeaaaaaaseeee
 

Vissy

Baron
WBNW
Don't post here if you don't have anything constructive to say, then. You said that you think bad of our posts here(or implied, whatever, but still.) in your first post. Don't please get too personal.
 

LordHasek

Knight
WB
[M] said:
Two tournament organizers disparaging tryhard (read: competitive) players. Incredulity and misanthopy readings are off the ******** chart guys pleeeaaaaaaseeee

I'm a competitive player and if someone isn't trying their best against me, I call them out on it, because testing my skill and improving is what is fun for me. That said, there is nothing wrong with admitting that their is large segment of the warband population who do not share these values.  :neutral:
 

🐝 M

Marquis
LordHasek said:
[M] said:
Two tournament organizers disparaging tryhard (read: competitive) players. Incredulity and misanthopy readings are off the ******** chart guys pleeeaaaaaaseeee

I'm a competitive player and if someone isn't trying their best against me, I call them out on it, because testing my skill and improving is what is fun for me. That said, there is nothing wrong with admitting that their is large segment of the warband population who do not share these values.  :neutral:
Their values are irrelevant if they're outside of the game's implied ruleset (what is possible) and the server/tournament ruleset (what is allowed). If they want to play a subset of the game that they find appealing then that's their bag, and may they have the most spiffing time imaginable with other people who enjoy that immersive subset. They have no right to talk down, and even less right to win against, anyone who enjoys and competes in the full game.

Das Knecht said:
Don't post here if you don't have anything constructive to say, then. You said that you think bad of our posts here(or implied, whatever, but still.) in your first post. Don't please get too personal.
It's already personal if tournaments that I compete in (me, personally -- not you as far as I can recall) have organizers that would likely ban large portions of either intended or emergent gameplay based on their own opinions about it. Thankfully I know that hasek and lust are sensible enough to not go down that road and I'm just being reactionary, but at least my opinion is meaningful. Your post telling me not to post added literally nothing, you masterful hypocrite you.
 

LordHasek

Knight
WB
It's already personal if tournaments that I compete in (me, personally -- not you as far as I can recall) have organizers that would likely ban large portions of either intended or emergent gameplay based on their own opinions about it.

You hurt me M. ;_;

I'd hoped I'd made myself clear that I was referring to myself and how I might occasionally toy with people far below my skill level - because raping them over coals every fight might not necessarily motivate them the same way it would for me. That's the direct way of saying it. My first post was more casually voiced as I was trying to empathize with how other people choose to play the game.
 
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