Flaming, fanboys, and moderators, oh my!

[jrawlings]

First off, I'd like to thank all the moderators on the forums for putting in the time to try and keep things in good order around here. It's a thankless job for sure.

However, I've noticed in the M&B forums, especially the suggestion one that threads keep coming back... again and again.

Each of these threads is greated by a fanboy who totally flames the poor soul for doing something so henious as to start a thread on an old topic. People, calm down, the apocolypse is not coming!

The next thing that happens is that the moderators post a response, one that are always nice, pointing the offender to the stickies at the top and to the all powerful search button.

Now, I'm going to come right out and say it. The search button, IMHO is now utterly useless. Do a search for any common topic and you'll probably get 200+ posts returned. No one should be expected to read or even scan that many threads.

So, first to everyone in the forums who is not a moderator: Don't tell people to use the search button, and certainly don't do it in a mean fashion. Yeah, you might be frustrated, but calm down, breathe, count to ten and move on.

Moderators: Instead of posting the "use the search, scan the stickies" response... take a more active role... remove the thread... do it in such a way like when threads are moved... so that the thread is seen in the thread list, but in the subject, the following is added " - this thread is covered in the stickies"

Now, this solution will also require that a moderator be assigned to maintain the sticky threads. Maybe once a month, go through the current threads and add them to the sticky.

Just my humble opinion...

 

[Phoboshobo]

Why not take the top 20 faqs and right out an answer for each one. Save the answer in a .txt document, then copy and paste the required text into the post so you dont have to rewrite it, then lock the thread with an explanation of why as a footer.

 

[jrawlings]

That would work... but then the search button would still be useless because that thread would be there. I was hoping to restore some value to that powerful tool.

 

[Yoshiboy]

why dont people learn how to use forums politely and effectively. If they arnt told now (the easy way or the hard way) when are they ever learn. it is certainly not anyones place to hand feed them endless amount of information when it is there right in front of them. Sure, i have flamed a few noobs but sometime it just gets over the top.

When you get a good 5 threads on pointless stuff being spammed to hell by noobs it pushes all the good threads down the page and out of sight.

They just have to learn how to use the forums. If everyone went around all the forums expecting mods or vets to feed them with all the data they needed just be starting their own personal thread THE WORLD WOULD COME TO AN END.

Trust me, i dont flame noobs in malice, i only do it to keep myself sane.

 

[The Pope]

Quite frankly, I don't care about being polite to people who post the same idiotic threads over and over again. The newbies who are worth having on the forum for any length of time don't do that.

 

[Sir Prince]

Waht we also need is one suggestinos thread consoliadation stickie. Regualraly updated. Or something like that.

 

[Sir Prince]

And even narrowing the search to titles doesn't work.

 

[Sir Prince]

You have fun with that. Looking manualy through 50 pages that is.

I suggest gonig through Yoshi's past posts, as he psoted in there I think.

 

[The Pope]

I don't think anyone complains if you explain that you have used search but couldn't find anything.

 

[Corto]

Why not take the top 20 faqs and right out an answer for each one. Save the answer in a .txt document, then copy and paste the required text into the post so you dont have to rewrite it, then lock the thread with an explanation of why as a footer.

This might be effective, IMO. Although someone would still have to scan through most popular suggestions and invent "official" answers to them. In other words: yet more puzzling work for the moderators. Well... on the other hand, why not?

 

[jrawlings]

I like the idea of having a FSI (frequently suggested idea) thread/sticky for this forum. But again, a moderator would have to step up and keep it current.

However, one problem still remains. When the noobs post their suggestion about sieges, it pushes all of the other current, more relevant threads down. Only way to eliminate that is for a moderator to remove the thread.

Too bad we can't implement an algorithm that scans the subject line of each post for key words. If a keyword such as "siege" or "suggestion" or "multiplayer" comes up, the post is automatically deleted. Keywords would be updated as the FSI grows.

 

[Khalid ibn Walid]

Quite frankly, I don't care about being polite to people who post the same idiotic threads over and over again. The newbies who are worth having on the forum for any length of time don't do that.

And quite frankly, I've had it up to here with people making up excuses for rudeness. There is no excuse. It is important to try to be polite at all times. It is just plain good manners. As the Pope, you should try leading by example.

Also, this is not a little clubhouse where icky-poo people are to be kept out. As far as I know, this forum is owned by TaleWorlds, not the users. It is for them to determine who is or is not "worth having".

Finally, keep in mind this isn't a public square either. It is a corporate lobby. Taleworlds have provided this forum for their customers and potential customers to discuss their product, not as a clubhouse for bums who hang around the lobby long enough. And what goes on in the lobby inevitably affects corporate image and sales. If our rudeness deters or dissuades other customers, I believe it is high time to crack the whip.

 

[Archonsod]

Also, this is not a little clubhouse where icky-poo people are to be kept out. As far as I know, this forum is owned by TaleWorlds, not the users. It is for them to determine who is or is not "worth having".

Finally, keep in mind this isn't a public square either. It is a corporate lobby. Taleworlds have provided this forum for their customers and potential customers to discuss their product, not as a clubhouse for bums who hang around the lobby long enough. And what goes on in the lobby inevitably affects corporate image and sales. If our rudeness deters or dissuades other customers, I believe it is high time to crack the whip.

Well said.

To be honest what is the problem with re-posting something that has already being suggested before? New players are joining us all the time, is it not possible that one of them could bring a new angle or take on a previously discussed subject? Could features brought in with a new release not make a difference to an idea?
As long as there isn't a similar post in the first couple of pages what is the problem? if you have nothing constructive or more to say on a subject, then don't post . The irony is you often see a suggestion at the top of the page, where every response is "we've already had this". If you really think the subject has no merit, then let it sink to the bottom where it belongs.

/end rant

 

[jrawlings]

"Amen brother" to both Khalid ibn Walid and Archonsod.

However, I think that the search function is a key element to navigating a forum. With numerous threads on the same topic, the search becomes useless. Like I said before, maybe moderators need to funnel duplicate posts into a single thread with an index maintained at the top of the forum. To make things even better, those threads could be edited to remove replys that say nothing more than "great idea" or "you suck because that's the worst suggestion I've ever heard" Someone above mentioned making a compilation of sorts for each major frequent suggestion/thread. Perhaps the moderators could work to make such a compilation, but then content would potentially be biased on their view as to what is important or not.

 

[Archonsod]

Part of the reason search doesn't work very well is because there's about 1000 topics with similar titles : "A suggestion" "My suggestions" etc.

It may be more feasible for the mods to simply enforce a sensible thread title policy. Even for multiple suggestions ("My combat suggestions" "My ideas for improving the map").

However, even if the search function was 100% accurate and useful, there is still no reason to be insulting when pointing this out.

 

[Narcissus]

I've said it before and I will say it again.

This forum is a business. It directly represents TaleWorlds.com. Being rude to new people regardless of reasons is uncalled for. If you care about M&B or Armagan and Ipek in any way ... you will not be rude to new members. Those new members are the paycheck that keeps this forum and game working.

Here is a fun fact for everyone to digest: I wasn't overly excited (read: didn't want) to take this job. I wanted to help Armagan and the forum as the game means a lot to me, but the site was complete chaos and suffering from 'elite old-schoolers' syndrome. Old members did whatever they wanted and new members were treated like complete crap. Notice I don't have any buddies on this forum? Thats why. A high post count or an early join date shouldn't mean a thing.

Quite a bit has changed since then and there is still a whole lot more that needs changing.

I just started catching back up on the forums since yesterday and I have deleted numerous posts about previous threads already. Note PrinceScamps (sorry to point you out like that) post count drops every time that I log in and stay a while? If anyone says anything about previous threads ... it needs to be polite and helpful. Otherwise ... it has no business being there.

I don't see anything wrong with mentioning previous posts ... and it is especially helpful if you provide a link. I often do that. If the discussion keeps going, fine. There isn't a problem with it in my eyes. I've been known to even provide a link and still mention things about the topic of the new thread ... in case that person wanted to start a new thread.

Reviving old posts is best ... but with the search function on this site being what it is ... that can be quite a tough job to do. The search function is as basic as it can get.

A frequently suggested thread that is stickied would be great, but truthfully ... I don't have the time to create a good one. The same goes for a M&B faq. I can help keep one updated, but I don't have the time to create one. For that, I apologize. I asked for help for the game faq, but noone would. If noone will help me do a game faq ... I knew the chances of getting help to do a common suggestion thread was pretty much zero.

I apologize for not being the 'greatest moderator of all time' ... I do what I think is right and I have been trying to make changes slowly so as not to alienate old members. Between childish forum politics, cleaning up complete crap that was posted by older members, trying to actually enjoy the site on occasion, and having a real life ... I don't have the time to get everything done.

I do want to say one thing though ... Archonsod has helped me more than any ten other members combined. Anyone that looks at Customer Support will know what I'm referring to. I'm not sure how many times I've sent him a message asking for help there and when I logged in next ... problem was solved. Thanks for that ... you have no idea how much it is appreciated.

Sorry if it seems I took this thread personal, but it is frustrating that there are things that desperately need to be done ... some of them I can do but have to do slowly, some of them I don't have the time to do, and some of them I'm not allowed to do. Very frustrating.

Narcissus

 

[Sir Prince]

My PC drops? Meh, I don't care. I am working on posting smarter. Slowly, but surely. I am getting tired of having this Not A Mod tag, but I guess it's a good reminder. Hopefully someday I can contribute something great and get it changed, or removed.

 

[Sir Saladin]

Keep fighting the good fight Narcissus, I'm trying to limit my complete crap posts to save you some work hehe.

 

[Volkier]

Whoever says Narcissus is a bad admin, deserves to get strangled with their own vocal cords

Its not an easy job administrating a forum and deeming which posts are and are not suitable for the community, since the community is an everlasting change of mortal humans. An action is judged by each individual respectively, whether its too harsh or too slack, and at the end of the day, its always the admins who get the flak from one or the other. Respect their decision - if they do something or don't do something, there is a reason behind it.

I admit that I disagree with not being annoyed with somebody who comes into the forums, creates the first 5 posts are 5 new threads, in bold capital letters and bad english, of dumb (or rather should I used the word 'minor') ideas such as changing the color of plate armor (used only as an example) or similar ideas which were discussed 50 times before in different threads, have links in stickies, or actually ARE the sticky. It is my personal oppinion, but this is not my personal forum, hence apologies to all the new members I might have insulted, and to narcisuss for having to remove my posts (if there were any - i don't recall since I normally ignore the rest of the posts in such threads.. I know I got a scolding from him a few times so he is doing his job : )

Point I am trying to make, is that if we believe of ourselves as a community, we should trust the decisions and the work of the admins. They have their reason for doing / not doing something. If we don't trust them, or start to think they ought to do more, it makes us no better than those people who rudely post the first thing that comes to their mind just for the sake of making a new thread, since by doing that, they also show their mistrust and disrespect for the admins and their work.

Narcissus, you really shouldn't have to defend yourself. I dunno why, I kinda feel guilty as well. :

 

[sheek]

Personally if I see a newbie asking a stupid question, and I'm in a good mood maybe I'll help him. If I'm in a bad mood or don't care I'll click "view next topic".

I don't think we should be expected to be nice to people asking stupid question or go out of our way to help. It's also stupid to be rude (you're just raising your blood pressure) so like I said before the best is to ignore annoying people. If they're ignored long enough they'll go away - even if they don't you don't read their posts, it's not your problem.