Fighting and armor

[Beowulf]

Well i've been playing a little, and now im a level 17 warrior, and im owning everybody. The problem with this is that I really am owning to much. The NPC's have become a little easy after fighting some battles, and once you make it to heladric armor and a Bastard sword, you can take too many hits, and I've one hit some higher level swadians (in horse to horse) with my bastard sword. Also the NPC's have a pattern of pulling their shields down after a hit, so when a pull some guys to the side, i can beserk on them and interrupt all their attacks. There's a few other things as well but I cant remember them right now. I do have some suggestions though

1. Other NPC's should be able to take the same number of hits as me when wearing the same armor as me (Knights are like level 25, while im only 17, yet i still two hit them, and i've taken like 5 or more hits before)

2. Armor should play a little more of a role than just armor stats. For example, leather type armors could should be alright at defending cuts, but poor at stabs, Scail mail, I dunno, whatever it was good for, Chain mail would be alright at both, and Plate armor would be very difficult for both (except for high speed piercings).

3. For number 2, there could be a fatigue system implemented so level differences are notice more, as well as armor types. For example, two guys in full plate go at each other with swords, well I doubt theyll chop through the armor, so they would hit each other till one guys starting losing it (tired, banged up), so to finish the fight, you knock the guy over and stab through the armor slits (a normal stab in the game would do)

4. Weapons should have a greater effect on armor, so the situation in number 3 might be won a little faster if one guy had an armor penetrating war hammer or a mace (ring the guys bell one too many times). These last three would make battles longer, tougher and more interesting.

5. there should be some pros and cons for armor. There was the one battle when the english longbow was used (i forgot the name), it was between the british and the french, and the french greatly outnumbered them. The british were mostly longbowmen and the french were mostly heavily armor nights. But the brits won, not from the longbow, but the unarmored longbowmen with wooden mauls (hammers) and clubs and daggers. They were quicker then the nights and were able to knock them down and stab them in the slits of the armor, partly because the ground was muddy but still.

6. To remedy the berseking thing, their should be a type of tackle, or shield bash to knock me off of them, possibly to the ground, so bersking would become a bad idea.

7. Higher level units and elite units should fight like named opponents, that or all AI should be upped a little. There could be an AI option (they have AI options in the option menu) for hard AI or extemely hard AI.

8. The fighting system should become more complex (I find the directional bloacking and attacking easy to handle) so that it is MUCH harder to take on multiple oppenents at one time, especially high level and elite

9. If number 2 is implemented, leverage should be taken into account, longer weapon with more force but slower, shorter weapon with less force but more speed, this could help with damage and armor penetration.

10. If a more complex fighting system is implemented, a vital organ system might could possibly be set up, kinda like head shots with ranged weapons

11. As well as shield bashes, other types of blunt hits could be implemented, like hitting with bottom of the handle (pommel i think) if blocking someone else and another guy is too close for an effective swing.
Elbows might be used when using certain weapons.

12. Possibly with the fatigue system, if you take an unlucky hit or like a hit in the legs or knees or arms, it could effect fighting. For example, you fighting someone when THUMP, you take an arrow to the side of the knee, so; you keel over but fight your way back to standing against that one knight. This could also increase the effectiveness ranged weapon users

13. I think ranged weapon users are a little weak once everyone starts using shields, so now, when blocking arrows your sheild should only block your upper body, so legs are vulnerable. To fight this, crouching could be implemented, with some disadvantges (for one, take a hit with a melee weapon, and your defeninantly getting knocked over). Some new attacks could be implemented with this (coucheing, or whaterever of horses with spears and lances) and new armor could be introduced for specialized units (tower shields, this could be a bad idea if matching time periods, im not very good with time periods). This would be very effective if used with number 12

Well thats all i can think of for now, but i will edit and add more later on.

Give suggestions, ideas, additions and changes (I take all forms of contructive criticism, except flaming), some I might add to this list for ease of finding and reading (but it might have some tweaks, artistic license).

 

[Garth]

Heya Beowulf!

Nice suggestions here, it was rather tedious reading through them though. You might want to check out the frequent suggestions sticky in this forum or use the search option for individual suggestions, you'll find that almost all of what you've brought up is already being discussed and has a thread for it.

Also, remember that people in general have the attention span of an ant and a hefty post with 13 different suggestions won't draw too much support and attention. In the future, I would recommend finding one suggestion that hasn't been made yet and making a thread for that one topic, and if a thread's already been made, go ahead and revive it.

Otherwise, all great ideas.

 

[nachoboy]

whats wrong with what he posted ,that would be cool to stab through the armor cus im a archer and i always get stuck with no arrows left and a weak dagger :-\

plus this game is supposed to be realistic

Smilies removed. Please don't spam emoticons/smilies. Normally, no big deal, but you used every single one possible. - Narcissus

 

[The Pope]

The problem with posts like that is that they don't leave too much for other people to say so the threads tend to go down quickly. I like most of the suggestions, but there are a few I disagree wtih. The shield suggestion is quite good, but I'd say the shield should also be changed to always deflect. If you haven't got the button pressed, it should still stop attacks that hit it. Defeating large groups solo can be remedied by fixing the backwards sprinting. Sure, people will sidestep instead. That isn't really a problem, because it is both more realistic and less powerful. It is possible to go at full speed with your torso turned sideways, but not backwards. As for armor, I'd say it should be very powerful without too much slowdown most of the time. The disadvantage should be a significantly longer animation for getting up, which would be important if you could knock people down with well timed shield bashes and the like. With most weapons it seems the idea was to batter a knight to the ground then finish him off with a dagger through a weak point in the armor rather than try to cut through solid steel.

 

[Skanky Burns]

...cus im a archer and i always get stuck with no arrows left and a weak dagger :-\

That is why you can access your inventory on the battlefield. Store a few spare sets of arrows in your inventory and then when you run out, access your inventory (there is a chest on the battlefield where you start) and swap the arrows around.

Also, I think you broke several smilie laws with that post. :shame:

 

[Beowulf]

Those are some pretty good ideas pope, like the shield always deflecting. Sometimes in the arena, ill be using a lance and when I'm thrusting at someone, I've taken some arrow hits that a swear would of hit my shield.
Backpedeling is a problem, because quite a lot, i get caught by a group of guys and I just backpedal and swing, but i should have been overwhelmed and surrounded. With the armor, thats what i was talking about, I've three hit dark knights in black plate armor with a bastard sword, that just shouldn't be possible. It should either take way more hits, or i should have to knock him to the ground and stab him OR use a blunt weapon and knock him out. Maybe with the longer knockdown times, a dagger could have critical hits on plated enemies (and yourself) to simulate stabbing through armor slits (nachoboy )


Remember, tell me the likes and dislikes of what i've said, why and changes or additions

 

[Ryuta]

I do like the idea to vary armour's efficiency against each damage types. It hasn't been done so often but it surely add more depth in game.
Also, it makes players to customise the characters rather than go to Black armour. For example, padded clothe, or padded leather would be a reasonable choice for some for it defend well against blunt damage. Chain mail would be excellent against cut but rubbish against piercing and blunt damage...

And of course, you'll have wider, and reasonable choice of weaponry than now...

 

[svart]

As far as i know piercing damage has better armor piercing than cutting damage.
An axe would do more damage against light armors whereas a lance would do more damage against platemail for example.

I'm sorry but i don't see why you think a leatherarmor would have any defensive bonuses over platemail ? the only one i know is with dodging but you haven't mentioned it.

As for customizing, i think the best answer would be having different kinds of platemails or helmets - but that's a laxury that isn't affordable until the planned features are made.

And like i already said i like how the game was made harder for lower levels than before, we just need to wait until enemy heroes and higher level troops are presented - i'm not surprised to own everyone if i got better equipment,horse and skills than them - doesn't matter they are a little higher level than me.

 

[Damien]

There was the one battle when the english longbow was used (i forgot the name), it was between the british and the french, and the french greatly outnumbered them. The british were mostly longbowmen and the french were mostly heavily armor nights. But the brits won, not from the longbow, but the unarmored longbowmen with wooden mauls (hammers) and clubs and daggers. They were quicker then the nights and were able to knock them down and stab them in the slits of the armor, partly because the ground was muddy but still.

Agincourt.

But don't misinterpret what you've heard. It wasn't armour that doomed the French. Far from it. As a matter of fact, I think M&B caters too much to popular opinion that plate armour slows you down. It really doesn't.

The French were doomed because English arrows were cutting horses down left and right, and the knights were getting trapped underneath them, or trodden over by surviving horses and riders, often suffering broken bones or being suffocated by the thick mud.

The 'mauls and daggers' thing was after-battle clean-up. The archers would run across the battlefield with their weapons and finish off helpless men (i.e. those trapped under horses, or suffering major broken bones), and would take the survivors captive.