SP - Economy Fewer, better tournaments.

[Revenant342]

With the recent changes, participating in tournaments had simply become a waste of time. The money rewards were never that great, so the item rewards were the only part that was worthwhile. Now, the money rewards are even less and the item rewards laughable.

I disagree with the reasoning behind these changes entirely, that tournaments were unbalanced and too profitable, but if that's what we're sticking with then at least hear me out on this: Instead of making individual tournaments worthless, just make there be less of them.

As it is, there's a tournament running more than half the time in any city I visit. That seems like too much, and is much more than in Warband. Because of this, I've never actively sought out a tournament through rumors just because I was basically guaranteed to come across a bunch of them without trying. If they were rarer and you had to actively seek them out and travel to them, that would be more balanced while allowing the tournaments to be actually rewarding.

As it is, I don't think I'll ever do another tournament after the recent changes because there's simply no point. They're not very fun after the first few, and you could make much more from doing almost anything else from the time you spend in them.

 

[CascadeHush]

I agree they generally aren't worth it economically, although I was able to get some good armor at a time when I was not really able to afford it did accelerate my game a lot.

I also agree that there are way too many of them. I think 1/2 is under counting it. It seems like I hit a tournament more often than not.

I do the tournaments because they are fun and give you rep and level up your weapon skills, riding, and athletics.

 

[JA55]

Tournaments are pretty fun for me. No matter the reward I ofter participate.

They should introduce better prizes and more types of tournaments. It needs a lot more diversity.

 

[BattanianDruid]

Rather than replacing the current tournaments it'd be nice if we had what we have now, common tournaments for hedge knights and lowborn warriors that are run by merchants and landed lowborn folk, and "grand tournaments" that are hosted much more rarely by the nobility in which the lords of the realm gather to compete.

Grand tournaments would offer much better rewards, an actual monetary prize, and have a higher ceiling for bets. But you'd also be competing against a dozen or so lords in top quality armor with really high skills, making the tournaments a lot harder as a result.

 

[CascadeHush]

Rather than replacing the current tournaments it'd be nice if we had what we have now, common tournaments for hedge knights and lowborn warriors that are run by merchants and landed lowborn folk, and "grand tournaments" that are hosted much more rarely by the nobility in which the lords of the realm gather to compete.

Yes, I really like this.

In the original game you would have feasts that would often coincide with tournaments and a few nobles gathered together in the town and it was a good time to speak to the nobles, as well as more interesting and fun to participate in the tournament against NPCs. Maybe they are planning to bring something like that. In combination with your idea it would be even better.

 

[Maximuuus]

I totally agree...

Tournaments became totally useless since their last update.
They was usefull before only when you start the game because you could earn a little bit money (something like 2-3 days of units wages) and sometimes better items.

Now they are totally useless, particularly mid-game where the 150 gold you can win means nothing and when you don't need those cheap items.

More bet, better items, less tournaments, relations with lords, banquet,...
Take a look at warband..........

 

[andycott]

Rather than replacing the current tournaments it'd be nice if we had what we have now, common tournaments for hedge knights and lowborn warriors that are run by merchants and landed lowborn folk, and "grand tournaments" that are hosted much more rarely by the nobility in which the lords of the realm gather to compete.

Grand tournaments would offer much better rewards, an actual monetary prize, and have a higher ceiling for bets. But you'd also be competing against a dozen or so lords in top quality armor with really high skills, making the tournaments a lot harder as a result.

+
Also it would have been nice to be able to sneak in such grand tournaments with a little chance of success of course.

Any way tournaments became boring most of a time after AI combat for lower tier troops was nerfed. But I understand why devs did that.
Participants should mostly be high tier troops or tournaments should be entirely changed.
Different types of tournaments would have been nice.

 

[Wolfsblut]

I disagree somewhat, fewer is not always better.

I like to fight in them, and i like to always have one around when i want one.
They could be twice as long though, so you got more chances to lose and have more flesh on the rips.
Relations to lords and ladies, feasts, etc.

Or been split in smaller events and major tournaments; that ideas

Rather than replacing the current tournaments it'd be nice if we had what we have now, common tournaments for hedge knights and lowborn warriors that are run by merchants and landed lowborn folk, and "grand tournaments" that are hosted much more rarely by the nobility in which the lords of the realm gather to compete.

Grand tournaments would offer much better rewards, an actual monetary prize, and have a higher ceiling for bets. But you'd also be competing against a dozen or so lords in top quality armor with really high skills, making the tournaments a lot harder as a result.

are great.
(What else to expect from a Battanian.)

I have almost the feeling that they pop up close to the players when they asks for one, what wouldn't be the worst way to handle it.
They stop be a relevant part of the game in mid-end game when you have too few, because you can't reach them in time or they are in hostile towns.
At the other hand, in the endgame you have most likely anyway other things to do.
But yea, somehow i like to always have one when i want one.

 

[Earth Dragon]

There were too many YouTubers doing nothing but tournament chasing to build a fortune and get to Clan rank one. It was widely showcased how much of a low risk high reward strategy it was.

That does not make good sandbox play. Good sandbox play is wide variety of choices with balanced risk vs reward options. It’s risky to raid Bandit layers, yet there is a lot of reward. It’s not risky at all to spam arena bouts, therefore less reward.

You can disagree with the changes all you want, but the initial build did not have balanced tournaments when compared to looter hunting, trading, mission taking, bandit raiding, and other early game options to try to build money and renown. Cruising around from city to city with 20 recruits chased off all early game threats and created a little to no risk scenario that offered extremely high rewards and payouts from the tournaments. Again, that’s not good game design. Your options need to be more balanced and intriguing and less no brainer and “noob if you don’t do it this way”.

 

[Earth Dragon]

Tournaments are pretty fun for me. No matter the reward I ofter participate.

They should introduce better prizes and more types of tournaments. It needs a lot more diversity.

I agree with this. If you are going to get a 5k piece of equipment, then the tournament should be larger, hence more difficult. I’m pretty sound in tournaments, but in big melees where there is chaos, I can get picked off. The riskiest are always when we’ll all have shields and one handed weapons and my horse riding butt can’t keep up with my high athletics partner........

But not only is it more difficult, it’s a higher time investment. And as I was stating above with risk versus reward (and should have included time, while that should be a more minor factor) that would compile to a better payout.

For those that didn’t play Warband, the tournaments in that game also made it super easy to propel yourself quickly, so I understand the adjustment to betting I feel they are getting that side of it figured out, since the other day I did a tournament on a new file that allowed for 4-1 payout on the first 2 rounds

 

[Greak]

I agree with this. If you are going to get a 5k piece of equipment, then the tournament should be larger, hence more difficult. I’m pretty sound in tournaments, but in big melees where there is chaos, I can get picked off. The riskiest are always when we’ll all have shields and one handed weapons and my horse riding butt can’t keep up with my high athletics partner........

But not only is it more difficult, it’s a higher time investment. And as I was stating above with risk versus reward (and should have included time, while that should be a more minor factor) that would compile to a better payout.

For those that didn’t play Warband, the tournaments in that game also made it super easy to propel yourself quickly, so I understand the adjustment to betting I feel they are getting that side of it figured out, since the other day I did a tournament on a new file that allowed for 4-1 payout on the first 2 rounds

Playing on realistic damage tournaments was not a walk in the park at first. Not before I got some decent equipment to start with and some 10 - 20 hours of experience, so I dont really think they are unbalanced challenge/reward ration. But then again that is one of the factors your can actually put to easy and reduce 2/3 of the damage you take, in that case I would agree with you.

Would be awesome to see some larger tournaments coming up once in a while. For example when you spoke to the arena master guy he could gossip the Stugian championship will come up in 10 days in Varcheng. Would be kind of cool and not too hard to implement I would think.

 

[Earth Dragon]

Playing on realistic damage tournaments was not a walk in the park at first. Not before I got some decent equipment to start with and some 10 - 20 hours of experience, so I dont really think they are unbalanced challenge/reward ration. But then again that is one of the factors your can actually put to easy and reduce 2/3 of the damage you take, in that case I would agree with you.

Would be awesome to see some larger tournaments coming up once in a while. For example when you spoke to the arena master guy he could gossip the Stugian championship will come up in 10 days in Varcheng. Would be kind of cool and not too hard to implement I would think.

The thing is, TW had dozens of streams and videos of their beta players breezing through the tournaments on realistic with light armor no problem. The playerbase gave all the evidence that was needed that this was a no risk high reward activity as originally laid out.

Now financial rewards have been reduced, but XP rewards were added. So the newer players didn’t have their time wasted, and experienced players don’t have the “obvious” activity choice

 

[MrVectorHC]

One tournament per season with great reward and additional renown requirement like in the Prophecy of Pendor? That would be great. It would make tournaments special!

 

[Revenant342]

I think the tournament difficulty has more to do with the fact that the AI is just bad at 1v1 combat than anything. If you get paired up with two militia recruits against three Caraphracts you may have a hard time even as a good player, but one-on-one I can take out an armored Noble with rags and a knife without getting hit about 90% of the time.

I will say that the Charm perk for +10 influence for tournaments actually does make them worthwhile, especially as a Mercenary and actually makes playing a tournament-based character viable. You can stack your influence really high as a Merc this way, and it's a great way to keep the cash flowing in peacetime (what there is of it), especially if you have a juicy contract rate. (Also, if they nerf this now I'll ****ing scream, let me have fun TaleWorlds)

 

[Diavolo]

How about they keep these tournaments as a kind of "peasant tournament" and then make a "grand tournament" where you have to be a noble in the faction (Or a faction that is allied) to join and the rewards are lots and lots of renown. There could be proper jousts and such

 

[heu3becteh]

There were too many YouTubers doing nothing but tournament chasing to build a fortune and get to Clan rank one. It was widely showcased how much of a low risk high reward strategy it was.
...
You can disagree with the changes all you want, but the initial build did not have balanced tournaments when compared to looter hunting, trading, mission taking, bandit raiding, and other early game options to try to build money and renown. Cruising around from city to city with 20 recruits chased off all early game threats and created a little to no risk scenario that offered extremely high rewards and payouts from the tournaments. Again, that’s not good game design. Your options need to be more balanced and intriguing and less no brainer and “noob if you don’t do it this way”.

The rewards (gold rewards from bets, there was some good equipment, which made it worth trying) for tournaments were laughable for me from the beginning of the game. I start winning most of them when I got good armour - that is when I was already filthy rich from trade. Before you have half-decent equipment - you will hit a guy ten times and after that he oneshot you. There are many cases with your silly team quickly diying on you, leaving you alone against a group of enemies. And you bet your money for that? I did fight without bets for equipment and used money for no-risk rising in geometric progression profits of trade.
I got my clan to the first rank with renown from tournaments though, it is relatively easy (and fun, which is more omportant) way to gain it.

But I do not get why the bet amount was reduced... I think instead of that some tournament total bet amount should be introduced - the total amount of bets. So how much will you gain from your bet will depend on the other bets. So if you will bet even 1 000 000, you will not get more that 1 000 000 + 5 000 (for example, the amount of bets besides yours).
And maybe even bets for non-participants (audience) should be possible, so someone can bet on you when you will be well-equipped famous knight, getting income from your effort (:

I do completly agree that there should be more diversity for tournaments. And I think it is planned. At least now it is always "melee group" tournaments. I guess there could be some differences in tournament prestige as well...
And maybe an option to host a tournament yourself...