Enemy Armies Raise WAY too fast

[Midnitewolf]

I was about the post this exact same post. The Lord and Army spam is real. In my campaign right now, I have personally destroyed at least 3 armies of 500-700 enemy each and in one of them took out about 1200+ since I caught them army with half of them wounded. I have also took out like 5 individual lords armies with 80-120 in them each and just before I logged last night, they were approaching with yet another army. At some point they should run out of troops and money right?

I do admit that I play the catch and release game but in Warband, it took some time for the lords to gather an army. Also I don't see the garrison numbers going down, in fact they have a few castles with 500+ garrisons.

Also I think there is another thing going on, the original lords children are coming of age and guess what, they turn into Lords themselves. How do I know? Well I married a lords daughter, who I find out was actually a lord with over 100 troops herself and when I married her, she came to me with her entire army and had amazing stats. Further, if I use her to create a party, she still keeps her lords bonus to troops having like a 130 cap vs my companions having a 95 cap. Further if she get captures, when she escapes she immediately goes out and recruits an army again just like a lord without being told. I love it....but I digress...the point any clan that has children of age, has not just one Lord and army, but several lords and armies attached to it so next thing you know, you got 20+ lords coming at you during a war.

Capturing and imprisoning delays things a little bit but since they escape so easily, even from dungeons, it barely slows down the tide. I could execute them but that is not how I want to roleplay my character so I a left with endless lord spam during a war, so much so that I personally, get "War Weary" and worn out just wishing for peace so I could do something, anything besides fight the unending hordes.

Also, I really wish they would tone down the number of wars. I mean your at war with someone 98% of the time and if one war is good, two or three at the same time is better....blah. Speaking of that, I really wish rulers would take into account that fact they are already at war before declaring another war. I should be rare for a Ruler to declare even a second front, let alone a third. I am not talking about other Rulers declaring war on you, I am talking about a Ruler declaring war on another faction when it is already at war. The AI should strive to avoid participating in more than one war at a time, simple as that and their should be longer periods of peace to allow you to do things like explore, look for cool new equipment for you or your companions, to build up your garrisons, to replenish your main army, to go all over the map to find those now super rare Warhorses you need to upgrade into high tiered Cavalry, fight in tournaments, etc, but nope, it is just WAR, WAR, WAR, WAR, WAR, WAR........!!!!

 

[Midnitewolf]

100% this. I started sieging Rhotae with a 700 men army when empire's armies started to show up, all 800+ men strong. Defeated 5 of them whithin the first couple of days of siege and i was waiting for my army to heal up since i had only 200 battle-ready units. Then the 6th army showed up with 800+ men led by the lords i already defeated not even 2 days earlier. Obviously i had to break the siege, i had no way to win that battle even if they were 60% made out of peasants, because a swarm of shieldless peasants wearing shirts can destroy your heavily armored and better trained troops in a matter of seconds in this game when they outnumber you 4 to 1

Yeah that was something I noticed, high tiered troops just don't feel all that high tiered and a fully armored Imperial Elite Cataphract can go down easy to a few looters with pitchforks. If they don't change this at some point, I might have to resort to mods to fix the issue of armorsmiths using styrofoam instead of metal and passing it off as Imperial Lamallar Armor.

 

[Kniggit]

Yea this definitely is a problem. I'm forced to execute lords to slow them down. I think I'm about to lose my only fief again, if that happens I'm just going to raid every village to see if that does anything.

 

[SkiFreeYeti]

AI isn't cheating, they are using the same mechanics as a player.

When the AI is defeated and are ransomed, I assume they spawn near their own town, and then they take troops out of garrison and go to a couple of cities and villages and recruit low tier troops, then they go back to fight. So sure, they maybe show up with 100 more units, but its mostly garbage tier troops which are easy to beat.

The game is -coded- to give lords/mercs who respawn a part of around 50 that includes a marginal sprinkling of T5 units. Please, pay attention next time.

Really hope this is just a stopgap thing they're doing. I wouldn't say it's early in development to be honest but considering they've had so much enthusiasm for the active recruitment system, yes, even if it results in lords getting hosed I'd rather they get screwed after losing everything than magically conjure high tier troops a la warband.

 

[DocShotgun]

I feel like defeated lords should be out of commission for a longer period of time, since right now it does feel like playing whack-a-mole if you don't execute everyone you capture. However, I could definitely see a change like that causing more snowballing in the game's current state, as the side that wins a decisive early battle will just keep winning as the losing side struggles to recover. There need to be some additional challenges for large factions with lots of lords and land to face (which in itself will probably also make it feel less like facing limitless hordes of enemies when fighting against them).

 

[heu3becteh]

Even on this mode, the rate at which the enemy regenerates their armies and can raise another massive army is staggering. It's like to matter how many times I take out an army of 360 strong, and eliminate the stragglers trying to join up (80-110 armies)... they just come right back. It's like they have no influence limit and can just form armies at whatever whim. This might be due to the fact that they built up a lot when I was amassing gold via trading.

Has anyone had successful efforts expanding your kingdom? I can't even maintain one fortress because they're constantly whittling away at my garrison so I have to stay in the area to defend it.

I have conquered the map from the Western Empire after it had snowballed all other kingdoms.

First I did conquer some fief and made peace right away, before they take it back. And bought all the clans at any possibility.

But after that I did conquer one town, put all the prisoners in the dungeon. And as soon as I look the other way, that settlement is already under siege. And I encounter the same faces I had put in a cell.
They are right back and with half-decent armies.
The prisoners must not escape that fast! They can sometimes escape from your army, but not from a dungeon. They should wait for ransom or rot in their cell around year or something before escaping. Or wait until the war is over.
That would be even better if they had to gather troops again instead of having the new army always ready. The snowball effect is another issue that could be related though.

So now I just execute everyone I can. After the first couple of lords I am already at -100 relation with almost everyone, so I can not care less anymore.
And it really helps!

I'm forced to execute lords to slow them down.

I hope that inprisonment would be a better way to stop these guys from attacking you right away. Now you really are forced to execute, or it will be VERY annoying.

 

[Vespa]

No, I don't believe that the AI plays by the same rules. I've defeated many clan in battle only to see the same person a few minutes later with a large group of soldiers - Not an army - Their party. Outside of my spouse's father who became my friend when I got married (which I had hoped would've had a cinematic or at least warranted a dialog box and picture), all of my many friends (barring one companion) are enemies that I let go after battle.

Executing your enemies isn't a good idea. It lowers your reputation, negatively impacts relationships, makes new enemies... and serves no purpose (other than perhaps a personal feeling of relief for having eliminated a pain in your noble arse). As soon as you kill someone, a magic relative will pop into existence, taking their place. On a related note, as far as I can tell, it's impossible to eliminate a clan (and all clans are set - they don't merge or otherwise change - nada).

 

[shadyroluo]

No, I don't believe that the AI plays by the same rules. I've defeated many clan in battle only to see the same person a few minutes later with a large group of soldiers - Not an army - Their party. Outside of my spouse's father who became my friend when I got married (which I had hoped would've had a cinematic or at least warranted a dialog box and picture), all of my many friends (barring one companion) are enemies that I let go after battle.

Executing your enemies isn't a good idea. It lowers your reputation, negatively impacts relationships, makes new enemies... and serves no purpose (other than perhaps a personal feeling of relief for having eliminated a pain in your noble arse). As soon as you kill someone, a magic relative will pop into existence, taking their place. On a related note, as far as I can tell, it's impossible to eliminate a clan (and all clans are set - they don't merge or otherwise change - nada).

You can definitely eliminate a clan, when everyone in the clan dies, the clan is notified by the game as destroyed. And as much as I agree with you on the whole execution doesn't really have any benefit vs a whole lot of downsides, it really is the only way to curb the massive AI whack a mole issue at the moment. Since imprisoning them does not keep them away for more than a few days before they escape and raises a huge army right away.

Taleworlds need to fix the pacing of these enemy lords raising army, being super aggressive right away after defeat, and the whole imprisonment serving as a way to prevent continous non-stop aggressions, especially by a big faction.

 

[Vespa]

You can definitely eliminate a clan, when everyone in the clan dies, the clan is notified by the game as destroyed. And as much as I agree with you on the whole execution doesn't really have any benefit vs a whole lot of downsides, it really is the only way to curb the massive AI whack a mole issue at the moment. Since imprisoning them does not keep them away for more than a few days before they escape and raises a huge army right away.

Taleworlds need to fix the pacing of these enemy lords raising army, being super aggressive right away after defeat, and the whole imprisonment serving as a way to prevent continous non-stop aggressions, especially by a big faction.

I haven't had this experience and, although I tried (including, I admit, a save-scummed execution spree), I was unable to eliminate a clan due to the fact that every time I killed someone, a new NPC was created to take their place. Other people have reported this, too. Maybe there's a common bug that does this (as opposed to it being deliberate)?

I tried putting nobles into castle dungeons, as I thought that'd be the best way to keep them off the field and not be replaced by someone new, but they disappear. If they're bartered off (ransomed) in the background, I was never made aware of it. I didn't want them to be released, that's for sure.

I'd like to know how you've eliminated a clan in it's entirety. The best I could do was whittle it down to a power of, say, 7 (whatever that represents) - perhaps literally one person left in it. I then make peace with it so I'm not bothered, only to see it's power is back up to over a thousand a while later (at least with the empire clans - the poor Sturgians remained at less than 10 for the duration of the game).

 

[LordKaien]

Not the biggest issue but a part of it :
I try to recruit in one village. The game say no, the village was raided. So I leave and I see a lord go to recruit inside (+2 recruits on the map). So, I think the village just start back and I go back. The village still say it was raided and I cannot recruit.

Also, if you lead a army, the others lord can recrut before you when you arrive in a city. They also can recruit from a raided village.

 

[heu3becteh]

Executing your enemies isn't a good idea. It lowers your reputation, negatively impacts relationships, makes new enemies... and serves no purpose (other than perhaps a personal feeling of relief for having eliminated a pain in your noble arse). As soon as you kill someone, a magic relative will pop into existence, taking their place. On a related note, as far as I can tell, it's impossible to eliminate a clan (and all clans are set - they don't merge or otherwise change - nada).

Huh... I destroyed many clans and kingdom (it was "destroyed" in encyclopedia). Afterwards some lunatics joined that kingdom and were talking about their late king as he was alive though X)
And my war to conquer the world from snowballed Western Empire became so much better after I started to execute anyone.

 

[chuckus]

Also I'm not sure how their relations with settlements are but I recently got a mod to add village patrols which increases my relationship with settlements. All my settlements love me and I can very quickly replenish my armies with mid tier units now since I have such good relations with so many villages.

Also, it appears AI can recruit from raided villages. If you have an army, stop by raided villages. You can't recruit but the lords under your command can.

 

[Vespa]

Huh... I destroyed many clans and kingdom (it was "destroyed" in encyclopedia). Afterwards some lunatics joined that kingdom and were talking about their late king as he was alive though X)
And my war to conquer the world from snowballed Western Empire became so much better after I started to execute anyone.

I tried. Via additional save games, I took a very dark path... but wasn't able to eliminate other clans/kingdoms. I know others have had this issue. Maybe it's a bug? I'll try again with a new game.

 

[Vespa]

I recently got a mod to add village patrols which increases my relationship with settlements. All my settlements love me and I can very quickly replenish my armies with mid tier units now since I have such good relations with so many villages.

I saw this mod, but haven't tried it yet. I know that companions you let lead parties and clans in your kingdom will do this (although you can't control them). The companion bit also ties into another thread I responded to about the severe companion cap - especially in light of their being used for parties, governors, caravans, and as actual companions.

 

[mexxico]

They always escape within like 2 days

This time will be longer in future. There will be more heroes in clans and when you capture one, another clan hero will form its party from start.

Currently they have to run away fast like 4-8 days in average until this replace mechanism is ready otherwise after a big battle (or after 3-4 small battles) you can capture nearly half of a faction's lords then you can capture 2-3-4 of their fortifications in this time period. This also causes snowball effect in NPC faction's side. When you capture a lord 4-8 days pass while he/she is prisoned after that 2 days passes until they respawn again and 2-5 days until they collect 70-80 men again. In total this make 8-16 days to collect their old power again after a lost battle in average.

I know escape of hero you caught is so disturbing but it is needed currently. If we make their average prisoned time 30-40 days there will be more problems in current situation.

By the way about topic, npc clans also spend their influence when creating an army however they have 15 lords while you have only 2-3 when you first created your kingdom. Thats why they do not suffer from lack of influence generally.

 

[scrappy_style]

Nope, that's a new feature that was added in to prevent snowballing, instead its just exacerbated the problem that AI has no initial recruitment to make, and instantly teleports back to safety after being released (Which, also happens automatically, you can't lock someone up for years apparently).



See above, you're wrong.



Hey, look! Someone actually posted what the code shows! That total for the default party template is 51 units on top of the general (so party size of 52, for an instant respawn!).

I had a run where I defeated Garios at least once every two days and fought his army of around 61 units all the way up to Tier 6. He's one hell of a trainer. Caladog is even more annoying as those Fians guarantee losses in almost every battle even against massive forces. I just have to keep my prisoner roster full of Tier 3 and 4 troops to join me after each battle.