Dragoons are getting ridiculous.

[Talii]

Remove horsebackfiring, I've always said. And remove all the problems of the words, says I.

This would generate severe balance issues and ruin the dragoons as a class.

With few more buffs it could turn dragoons into mounted inf, get rid of hit-and-run delaying and make the game more pleasant.
Mounted ranged units were always ridiculously OP in Warband MP, although with this slow fire rate they're not dangerous but annoying.

In the Napoleonic Wars, Dragoons where full out Cavalry, not Mounted Infantry.

Also, If it does not require so by balance, do not change it. Because it is annoying is not an argument to tweak dragoons.

For an example, I feel that infantry is annoying when i play as a Hussar, because they have firearms and I dont. This is not a reason to remove the muskets from infantry or add Carbines to Hussars ( Which, By the way, Would have been historicly accurate.)

 

[Oposum]

In the Napoleonic Wars, Dragoons where full out Cavalry, not Mounted Infantry.

Also, If it does not require so by balance, do not change it. Because it is annoying is not an argument to tweak dragoons.

Dunno why people complain about dragoons, currently they're the weakest class in game. They're some strange hybrid between melee cav and ranged inf which sucks at shooting and melee (both dismounted and mounted).
Reason why we get so many hit-and-run dragoons is mostly because if they try anything else they will get slaughtered. Once in a blue moon dragoon will get a hit in driveby if he's lucky enough not to get raped by hussars. Dragoons are only somewhat dangerous when in large groups (as is anything else) or when they pull hit-and-run stuff in 1 vs 1.
All in all, dragoons would need some kind of rebalancing to make them actually useful instead of being markers for free kills in public server.

 

[TORN9000]

I have no problems with dragoons what so ever.
When they run away to reload. suprise suprise! I reload.
They come back I shoot them.
The only time I rage at dragoons is when I'm cavalry myself. But even then they're easy to take out.
You just need to know how to dodge

 

[Age of Empires ¶ Densetsu]

Hitler agrees.

 

[Captured Joe]

But I didn't even read it!

 

[T&B]

dragoons in game do what there meant to do,,dragoons were orignally mounted infantry who would dismount once on the battlefield.

 

[Captured Joe]

Originally, yes. But at the time the Napoleonic Wars begun, they were just Heavy Cavalry, who could also be used for Light Cavalry duties (like skirmishing, scouting, fouraging, etc.), and could do some dismounted service (although there weren't many Dragoon units properly trained for that).
At the charge, they seldom used their firearms I believe. Just charge in with their long straight swords to cut the enemy to pieces, in honest Heavy Cavalry fashion.

 

[T&B]

i know,the dragoons muskets were hardly ever used except on sentry duty etc,,,anyway i have shot the british padget carbine and beleive me ,,its alot worse than the brown bess   i can hit a target at 100 yards with a bess ,, and it was like 30 yards with the carbine,,and i was steady and not even on a horse

 

[Thokan]

In the Napoleonic Wars, Dragoons where full out Cavalry, not Mounted Infantry.

Also, If it does not require so by balance, do not change it. Because it is annoying is not an argument to tweak dragoons.

Dunno why people complain about dragoons, currently they're the weakest class in game. They're some strange hybrid between melee cav and ranged inf which sucks at shooting and melee (both dismounted and mounted).
Reason why we get so many hit-and-run dragoons is mostly because if they try anything else they will get slaughtered. Once in a blue moon dragoon will get a hit in driveby if he's lucky enough not to get raped by hussars. Dragoons are only somewhat dangerous when in large groups (as is anything else) or when they pull hit-and-run stuff in 1 vs 1.
All in all, dragoons would need some kind of rebalancing to make them actually useful instead of being markers for free kills in public server.

Firing from horseback wasn't used in any kind of scale at all and can easily be numbered down to 'incidents'. I for one see absolutely no reason why one should be able to shoot from the horseback in the first place. Either give us mounted infantry, which I would prefer outmost, or give us full out cavalry with a fancy name and whithout these firearm shenanigans.

Mounted infantry tactics are in fact viable, even if you play as lonewolf, I might add, and I quite like it. Your outmost moveability gives you the ability to plan and strike where and when you want.

And as Oposum is trying to say, the dragoon as a class statwise is major crap, which have lead me to start play the Austrian green-jacketed Chevaulger Light Cavalry which happends to be a better dragoon unit than any of the dragoons.

 

[Vicccard]

i know,the dragoons muskets were hardly ever used except on sentry duty etc,,,anyway i have shot the british padget carbine and beleive me ,,its alot worse than the brown bess   i can hit a target at 100 yards with a bess ,, and it was like 30 yards with the carbine,,and i was steady and not even on a horse

The dragoon musket was just a bit smaller then the regular musket. Carbines were a LOT smaller. The reason they are a bit smaller is that the horse doesn't trip over the barrel.

Dragoons musket were simply too big to handle on a horse, let alone reload, and so only used on foot.

 

[Captured Joe]

Hmm, Dragoon Muskets are the same as Musketoons?

 

[Vicccard]

absolutely not!

Musketoons were basicly pistols with a shoulder piece. Its accuracy was terrible, but it was very easy to reload and handle on horse.

No idea why it's a shotgun on NW.

 

[Azrooh]

absolutely not!

Musketoons were basicly pistols with a shoulder piece. Its accuracy was terrible, but it was very easy to reload and handle on horse.

No idea why it's a shotgun on NW.

Anything could be a shotgun on NW. You just need to shove a bunch of stuff into the barrel instead of one large ball, it's a smoothbore, not a rifle. Musketoons just got chosen to be loaded with multiple projectiles for variety I guess.

 

[Vicccard]

loading a musket with just multiple bullets (or even items) would eventually destroy it.

French did invent something like a buck shot, which was basicly a piece of wood with three smaller bullets in, which they loaded in a musket. Damn handy in a siege (which were the only places they were used).

 

[Azrooh]

loading a musket with just multiple bullets (or even items) would eventually destroy it.

French did invent something like a buck shot, which was basicly a piece of wood with three smaller bullets in, which they loaded in a musket. Damn handy in a siege (which were the only places they were used).

This is more of an American thing, I'm not sure how often it was used in Europe, but it was pretty common to load up your smoothbore musket with 3 pieces of buckshot and a .69 ball.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Buck_and_ball

 

[Captured Joe]

absolutely not!

Musketoons were basicly pistols with a shoulder piece. Its accuracy was terrible, but it was very easy to reload and handle on horse.

No idea why it's a shotgun on NW.

Are you sure? Both in Europe 1805 and in 1866 it's a shortened musket. Not a pistol with a shoulder stock, which is another weapon in aforementioned mod.

 

[Treble]

Its like this, if you are facing off a dragoon and you miss with your shot, you have about an 80% chance of death, 90% if its a muskatoon, most of the time you can doge and weave but they are standing still so they can just wait.. its just the face that they ride up to you, miss, run away and if you try and get close they back off and reload. If they would miss then fight with their swords like men..

Maybe make it so you cant shoot of horseback

Treble, don't be a *****. If they're able to sit and wait while you dodge and weave, you're obviously dodging and weaving in the wrong direction.

Or, you could just, like, not miss your shot when you shoot at them. You've had your go and missed, now it's their turn.

You have never come across some dragoon sitting there aiming at you whilst your running around in circles trying to put off his aim, im guessing not?

Also, its a musket, not a sniper rifles, 8/10 you miss.

 

[Azrooh]

absolutely not!

Musketoons were basicly pistols with a shoulder piece. Its accuracy was terrible, but it was very easy to reload and handle on horse.

No idea why it's a shotgun on NW.

Are you sure? Both in Europe 1805 and in 1866 it's a shortened musket. Not a pistol with a shoulder stock, which is another weapon in aforementioned mod.

He's exaggerating I think, musketoons are basically sawn-off muskets. Pistols with shoulder stocks are pistols with shoulder stocks. Musketoons are handy for maneuvering around on a horse and they're nice light firearms for artillerymen to carry around.

 

[Mateus416]

I have no problems with dragoons what so ever.
When they run away to reload. suprise suprise! I reload.
They come back I shoot them.
The only time I rage at dragoons is when I'm cavalry myself. But even then they're easy to take out.
You just need to know how to dodge

What about the situations when you aren't loaded? Or when the dragoon has a musketoon?

 

[TheBoberton]

What about the situations when you aren't loaded?

You die.

Or when the dragoon has a musketoon?

If you're not loaded; you die.
If you're loaded, shoot the bastard.