Does anyone know what is supposed to affect Notable power?

Apocal

Knight
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I just realized that purchasing a caravan from a town artisan or merchant gave them a modest (+4?) to their power. I thought it was restricted to quests but apparently not...

Anyone know what makes their power go up? Or down, that helps too.Because I definitely want to do everything possible to boosh my landowners' power to the stratosphere.
 

mylittletantan

Sergeant at Arms
M&BWBWF&SNWVC
Best answers
1
4 non quest related functions change notable power. SpawnCaravans() reduces by 50 if the notable is supposed to have caravans but don't, DailyTick() does a bunch of calculations, OnHeroCreated sets initial power, and finally another DailyTick is likely what you noticed.
In the class UrbanCharactersCampaignBehavior in the function DailyTick()
if (hero.Gold > 30000)
{
GiveGoldAction.ApplyBetweenCharacters(hero, null, 5000, true); (throws away 5000 of the notables gold)
hero.AddPower(1);
}
else if (hero.Gold < 5000)
{
GiveGoldAction.ApplyBetweenCharacters(null, hero, 2500, true); (gives the notable 2500 gold)
hero.AddPower(-1);
}
So if the hero had nearly 30000 and you then bought a caravan it could get 2-3 power from it.
 

Apocal

Knight
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0
4 non quest related functions change notable power. SpawnCaravans() reduces by 50 if the notable is supposed to have caravans but don't, DailyTick() does a bunch of calculations, OnHeroCreated sets initial power, and finally another DailyTick is likely what you noticed.
In the class UrbanCharactersCampaignBehavior in the function DailyTick()
if (hero.Gold > 30000)
{
GiveGoldAction.ApplyBetweenCharacters(hero, null, 5000, true); (throws away 5000 of the notables gold)
hero.AddPower(1);
}
else if (hero.Gold < 5000)
{
GiveGoldAction.ApplyBetweenCharacters(null, hero, 2500, true); (gives the notable 2500 gold)
hero.AddPower(-1);
}
So if the hero had nearly 30000 and you then bought a caravan it could get 2-3 power from it.
Thanks! So those characters are banking money and whenever I purchase a caravan, it leads to them spending that money for influence. But let me get this straight: if I consistently raid a certain notable's caravans, it will tank their influence?

And there isn't an equivalent for the village notables.

What is the power of notables even supposed to do?
Make higher tier units available for recruitment more regularly.
 

mylittletantan

Sergeant at Arms
M&BWBWF&SNWVC
Best answers
1
What is the power of notables even supposed to do?
Depending on rank it gives a daily influence bonus, 0.1, 0.2 or 0.3.
Power affects likelihood of producing troops and upgrading the available troops.
If it's above 200 the notable can have noble troops.

if I consistently raid a certain notable's caravans, it will tank their influence?
if (hero != Hero.MainHero && this.ShouldHaveCaravan(hero) && hero .OwnedCaravans.Count<MobileParty>() <= 0)

Settlement spawnSettlement = hero.HomeSettlement.IsFortification ? hero.HomeSettlement : hero.HomeSettlement.GetComponent<Village>().TradeBound;
MobileParty.InitializeCaravanForHero(hero, spawnSettlement, initialSpawn, null, null, 0);

if (!initialSpawn && hero.Power >= 50)
hero.AddPower(-50);

Village notables should be able to have caravans as well, otherwise there would be no need to check isFortification. It only removes 50 power if the notable has 50 so you would reduce it to 0 at worst.
 

RWBY

Recruit
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0
Well that's very good to know, I thought the power system is just another unimplemented system. As a sidenote does anyone know exactly what prosperity in settlements, castles and hearths in villages do? And what the breakpoints for them are? I know villages can be very poor, poor and of average wealth (600+ hearths iirc), same for settlements but can they actually become rich in wealth? I also noticed that the hearth count in villages is very important, it directly translates to more prosperity in the bound town/castle, militia, trade goods, food, bigger villager parties and so on. For example the best village I once had, had 2.3k+ hearths but was still considered of average wealth. Some cool things I noticed where they also had 200+ militia in that village making it very hard to be raided and the genereted villager parties also had 70+ people inside them. Making it impossible for normal bandits to rob them significantly boosting the bound settlement's prosperity.
 

Bannerman Man

Squire
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0
Village notables should be able to have caravans as well, otherwise there would be no need to check isFortification.
Nah, only merchant notables can spawn caravans. In the ShouldHaveCaravan(hero) function it checks if the notable is a merchant. Merchants are the notables in towns that are not gang leaders or the head artisan.
As a sidenote does anyone know exactly what prosperity in settlements, castles and hearths in villages do? And what the breakpoints for them are?
Prosperity and hearths are used in a lot of different places in the code that control all kinds of things. The most tangible thing that prosperity does is control tax income. The tax income of a town/castle is 25% of the total prosperity (towns also get trade tariffs). For villages, the biggest thing hearths controls is the production rate of their goods. If hearths are < 200 then production is 50% of the base rate. If hearths are > 200 and < 600 then production is 100% of the base rate. If hearths are > 600 then production is 150% of the base rate.

For towns there are prosperity breakpoints at: < 2000 is low, >= 2000 is mid, and >= 5000 is high, but these breakpoints don't do anything significant like hearth breakpoints do. Prosperity is mostly used as a straight number.
 

RWBY

Recruit
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0
Nah, only merchant notables can spawn caravans. In the ShouldHaveCaravan(hero) function it checks if the notable is a merchant. Merchants are the notables in towns that are not gang leaders or the head artisan.

Prosperity and hearths are used in a lot of different places in the code that control all kinds of things. The most tangible thing that prosperity does is control tax income. The tax income of a town/castle is 25% of the total prosperity (towns also get trade tariffs). For villages, the biggest thing hearths controls is the production rate of their goods. If hearths are < 200 then production is 50% of the base rate. If hearths are > 200 and < 600 then production is 100% of the base rate. If hearths are > 600 then production is 150% of the base rate.

For towns there are prosperity breakpoints at: < 2000 is low, >= 2000 is mid, and >= 5000 is high, but these breakpoints don't do anything significant like hearth breakpoints do. Prosperity is mostly used as a straight number.
I also read somewhere that prosperity in towns influence the quality of items being sold. Like T6 armor, T5 bows, horses and so on. Is there any specific prosperity breakpoints for those goods to show up in the market, if it's true that prosperity influences that?
 

Bannerman Man

Squire
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0
Is there any specific prosperity breakpoints for those goods to show up in the market, if it's true that prosperity influences that?
As far as I can tell, items such as armor and weapons are exclusively produced by workshops, and prosperity doesn't impact workshops directly.

However, there is a line in the workshop production code that's indirectly affected by prosperity, and it will control the maximum price an item can be that is produced from a workshop. When a workshop has done enough work to produce an item it randomly chooses an item from the particular category of the workshop type. The random item is chosen in such a way that more expensive items are less likely to be selected. So for instance, if heavy armor has been produced by a smithy it will choose a random heavy armor of the correct culture. This part is fine.

It then checks to see if the item's price is greater than the amount of gold a town has on hand, and will not produce the item if its price is higher than the total gold in the town. A town roughly carries an amount of gold equal to (7 x Prosperity). So as a rule of thumb, a town will not produce an item that is more expensive than 7 times its prosperity value. That's why most of the top gear never appears in a town, because even if a town has 10000 prosperity it can only produce items < 70k in value (roughly).

This is the part in the DoProduction function of the WorkshopsCampaignBehavior class that causes this:

The jury is out on whether or not this is intentional.
 
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Gerta

Regular
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0
As far as I can tell, items such as armor and weapons are exclusively produced by workshops, and prosperity doesn't impact workshops directly.

However, there is a line in the workshop production code that's indirectly affected by prosperity, and it will control the maximum price an item can be that is produced from a workshop. When a workshop has done enough work to produce an item it randomly chooses an item from the particular category of the workshop type. The random item is chosen in such a way that more expensive items are less likely to be selected. So for instance, if heavy armor has been produced by a smithy it will choose a random heavy armor of the correct culture. This part is fine.

It then checks to see if the item's price is greater than the amount of gold a town has on hand, and will not produce the item if its price is higher than the total gold in the town. A town roughly carries an amount of gold equal to (7 x Prosperity). So as a rule of thumb, a town will not produce an item that is more expensive than 7 times its prosperity value. That's why most of the top gear never appears in a town, because even if a town has 10000 prosperity it can only produce items < 70k in value (roughly).

This is the part in the DoProduction function of the WorkshopsCampaignBehavior class that causes this:

The jury is out on whether or not this is intentional.
Thanks for looking into this. That explains a lot. I wonder if artificially inflating the town gold via buying up all their goods will work to spawn good items?
 

Bannerman Man

Squire
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0
I wonder if artificially inflating the town gold via buying up all their goods will work to spawn good items?
Technically yes, but realistically you only have a small chance of that actually spawning a rare item. The reason for this is because the game slowly equalizes a town's gold to 7 times its prosperity each day. It uses the equation [(7 x Prosperity) - CurrentTownGold] to find the difference between current gold and its target gold and adds or subtracts 20% of that difference each day until it reaches equilibrium. It takes 10 days for a workshop to produce one item from the "ultra armor" category, so unless you time it perfectly, the extra money that you gave a town will have already bled away.

I'm leaning toward this issue with gear spawning being unintentional. If I recall, equipment was much cheaper overall when the game was released, and towns' gold was also not capped at 7 x Prosperity, so this line of code checking if the item is too valuable was not problematic. They've made both of those changes in subsequent patches, which now prevents the most expensive gear from ever spawning.

That line of code is there to ensure that a town has enough money to purchase the item from the workshop before the workshop creates the item. However, towns only actually pay for trade goods produced by workshops; they get the equipment for free, so that line of code is not necessary for equipment, and should probably be changed so that it doesn't block top gear from spawning.
 

Lord of Banners

Sergeant
Best answers
0
Technically yes, but realistically you only have a small chance of that actually spawning a rare item. The reason for this is because the game slowly equalizes a town's gold to 7 times its prosperity each day. It uses the equation [(7 x Prosperity) - CurrentTownGold] to find the difference between current gold and its target gold and adds or subtracts 20% of that difference each day until it reaches equilibrium. It takes 10 days for a workshop to produce one item from the "ultra armor" category, so unless you time it perfectly, the extra money that you gave a town will have already bled away.

I'm leaning toward this issue with gear spawning being unintentional. If I recall, equipment was much cheaper overall when the game was released, and towns' gold was also not capped at 7 x Prosperity, so this line of code checking if the item is too valuable was not problematic. They've made both of those changes in subsequent patches, which now prevents the most expensive gear from ever spawning.

That line of code is there to ensure that a town has enough money to purchase the item from the workshop before the workshop creates the item. However, towns only actually pay for trade goods produced by workshops; they get the equipment for free, so that line of code is not necessary for equipment, and should probably be changed so that it doesn't block top gear from spawning.
When you say they get equipment for free does that mean workshop income is less for smithies specifically because towns never pay for their goods? That’s confusing
 

Bannerman Man

Squire
Best answers
0
When you say they get equipment for free does that mean workshop income is less for smithies specifically because towns never pay for their goods? That’s confusing
Smithies and wood workshops also produce tools as well as equipment, so they get paid that way since tools are trade goods.

Edit: Towns also have a 'hidden' artisan workshop that produces most items in the game, so a town is not required to have smithies or wood workshops in order to produce equipment.
 
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Gerta

Regular
Best answers
0
Technically yes, but realistically you only have a small chance of that actually spawning a rare item. The reason for this is because the game slowly equalizes a town's gold to 7 times its prosperity each day. It uses the equation [(7 x Prosperity) - CurrentTownGold] to find the difference between current gold and its target gold and adds or subtracts 20% of that difference each day until it reaches equilibrium. It takes 10 days for a workshop to produce one item from the "ultra armor" category, so unless you time it perfectly, the extra money that you gave a town will have already bled away.

I'm leaning toward this issue with gear spawning being unintentional. If I recall, equipment was much cheaper overall when the game was released, and towns' gold was also not capped at 7 x Prosperity, so this line of code checking if the item is too valuable was not problematic. They've made both of those changes in subsequent patches, which now prevents the most expensive gear from ever spawning.

That line of code is there to ensure that a town has enough money to purchase the item from the workshop before the workshop creates the item. However, towns only actually pay for trade goods produced by workshops; they get the equipment for free, so that line of code is not necessary for equipment, and should probably be changed so that it doesn't block top gear from spawning.
Thanks! I'm learning so much about the game from your posts.
 

Apocal

Knight
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0
Thanks! I'm learning so much about the game from your posts.
But wait, there's more:
(taken from a bug report)
Just as a follow-up, it appears there are multiple towns without merchant notables, meaning a number of them have disappeared. I couldn't give you a timeframe on any of them except Ayla the Carpenter, who disappeared from Akkalat no earlier than 15 days from that save.
@Apocal This is actually a mechanic in the game. If a notable falls below 100 power and has 0 caravans, 0 workshops, and 0 properties, they have a small chance to disappear each day. The lower their power goes the greater the chance, so it's not surprising that it would happen more often when the notable power system was broken and their power was tanking.
So let's so you've got that lovely four recruitment slot town to your name. Don't buy your weak merchant's workshop because there is a chance they'll go poof one day.
 

Gerta

Regular
Best answers
0
But wait, there's more:
(taken from a bug report)



So let's so you've got that lovely four recruitment slot town to your name. Don't buy your weak merchant's workshop because there is a chance they'll go poof one day.
Interesting. It seems like they went into a lot of detail on this mechanic, which I don't know... Is it even necessary? Thanks for the update though. I appreciate it.
 

Bannerman Man

Squire
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0
So let's so you've got that lovely four recruitment slot town to your name. Don't buy your weak merchant's workshop because there is a chance they'll go poof one day.
I should clarify that this only happens for urban notables (i.e. those in towns). With today's hotfix this shouldn't be much of a problem anymore, as merchant notables tend to get very powerful. I wouldn't worry too much about undercutting them by buying workshops out from under them.

I'll update exactly what's changed in the other thread if mexxico doesn't get around to it later. It's still not totally balanced yet, but it's a step in the right direction.
 
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