Do You Wear Poppies?

  • Thread starter Thread starter Elenmmare
  • Start date Start date

Do You Wear Poppies?

  • Yes, All of November

    Votes: 8 12.1%
  • Yes, especially on Remembrance Day

    Votes: 21 31.8%
  • No

    Votes: 37 56.1%

  • Total voters
    66

Users who are viewing this thread

Elenmmare

Do you wear a poppy? A fairly simple question, but in my sphere, rather heated nonetheless.

If someone hands me a poppy, like my history teacher, I'll wear it while in his presence so as not to cause too much of a fuss. But quite simply I don't feel the desire to wear a poppy because people tell me I should wear a poppy. I'm not an angsty teenager, and I'll explain.

- Poppies go to charity. Most, at least. But aside from the fact that they're plastic and fake, I have a terribly sharp problem with it being the burden of charity to support the veterans of a war. These veterans, regarded so highly in society (and in the case of some wars, well they should), are having to rely on private charity for support. I can't think of a less nationalist profession, and yet the nation-state itself is failing to provide for its veterans. If I care about veterans, I'll vote for change, not pick up the slack of a government more concerned with say, funding more corporate wars.
- People tell me to. This is a bit of a stretch, and I've heard it uttered before. But it is indeed easy to draw parallels between public pressure to visually demonstrate your remembrance (because plastic brings sincerity, as they say) and public pressure to say, visually demonstrate support for an autocrat.
-I don't believe in nationalistic wars. Now I'd like to clarify that when I say 'nationalist', I literally mean relating to a nation. The Black Hand needn't be mentioned. I'm not a pacifist, because I condone violence in law enforcement or in global peace initiatives. I even condone wars of global intervention like, theoretically, Kosovo. I don't dislike or spit upon the graves of soldiers who fought in the World Wars, but I won't glorify their actions. Every citizen has a choice, I don't buy the bull**** that a billion people were dragged into a war.
Now maybe poppies are about protesting the wars. Yet if it can be interpreted so openly, why bloody well wear it? To show people you're thinking about it? I don't need red plastic to do so, and I don't need to prove that I remember history.

 
OH **** IT'S REMEMBRANCE DAY TODAY.

Eh.

I would wear one, but IMO they haven't done anything for me, so yeah.

Besides, why is it that the retired armed forces are going to charity for help?
 
Elenmmare said:
Every citizen has a choice, I don't buy the bull**** that a billion people were dragged into a war.
Yes. In our case it was enlist or be shot for cowardice.

I always wear a poppy, but then I suspect the reasons have more resonance for those of us on this side of the Atlantic.

Tuckles said:
OH **** IT'S REMEMBRANCE DAY TODAY.
Armistice Day. Remembrance Day is Sunday. Armistice Day is to remember those who fell in the Great War.
Besides, why is it that the retired armed forces are going to charity for help?
Short version of the story is that the government reneged on it's promise of a welfare state in 1918.
 
Maybe I should make a thread asking people whether or not they'll go house to house with horrible songs and lanterns wailing for candy?


No, I don't wear poppies.
 
Yes. In our case it was enlist or be shot for cowardice.

Unless of course you had the opportunity to read British common law and understand that conscientious objection was recognized by your government in the 18th century, though only for Quakers. It was then expanded to anyone in 1916, with the option for civil service instead. Some were imprisoned for it, 10 died. Which really brings me back to my point, why show support for such a regime and it's supporters anyway? I'll gladly wear a flower for the imprisoned and dead.

I always wear a poppy, but then I suspect the reasons have more resonance for those of us on this side of the Atlantic.

I suspect not. It was a North American that brought the poor flower into our tribal dances, and indeed if you feel that Britain's extra 10 days of war compared to Canada had a significant affect on war sentiments, I'd politely disagree.

Short version of the story is that the government reneged on it's promise of a welfare state in 1918.

So change it. "Freedom and Democracy!" and all that.
 
Only French-gentlemens can wear poppy! Don't you know this rule?
American spys are exception...
 
Elenmmare said:
Unless of course you had the opportunity to read British common law
Which wouldn't help, since the government had already declared emergency powers.
why show support for such a regime and it's supporters anyway? I'll gladly wear a flower for the imprisoned and dead.
I'm not. The poppy shows support for the entire generation that died in the fields of France. As far as I know, none of the government were there. That's kinda the point.
I suspect not. It was a North American that brought the poor flower into our tribal dances, and indeed if you feel that Britain's extra 10 days of war compared to Canada had a significant affect on war sentiments, I'd politely disagree.
I'd suggest Britain being Britain had a significant effect on war sentiment.
So change it. "Freedom and Democracy!" and all that.
We did. In 1945, after yet another war.
 
Yes, always.  :) I am compelled to as an Englishman. Elenmmere; forgive me for being ignorant (as I do not know the off-topic forumites so well) but in the USA, I presume it's not such of a large deal?
 
I'm not. The poppy shows support for the entire generation that died in the fields of France. As far as I know, none of the government were there. That's kinda the point.

Near half a hundred million soldiers found themselves in fields around the world hunting for the lives of other men. I see no reason in supporting such an event. It was a disaster like many others, although different in that it was masterminded and initiated by humans.
It was a generation lost to nationalism and imperialistic greed. Even poems of remembrance which we read, the very poem that spawned the tradition of poppies, urges me to take up the quarrel with their foe lest my predecessors sleep fitfully.

**** their quarrel, I rather like Germans, and I won't wear a poppy supporting military action. I also like the Japanese, and I wouldn't find many of them extolling the Allied defense of freedom and democracy as they stripped their citizens of Japanese ancestry of their property.

Turanien said:
Yes, always.  :) I am compelled to as an Englishman. Elenmmere; forgive me for being ignorant (as I do not know the off-topic forumites so well) but in the USA, I presume it's not such of a large deal?

I wouldn't know.
 
I sell poppies and anyone who doesn't want to wear one willingly is a rice throwing commie.

It's got nothing to do with politics and nothing to do with nationalistic wars, it is quite simply a symbol of rememberance for those who gave everything so that we might be at liberty today.

EoR
 
Then excuse me Elenmmere, I was under the impression that you were American. (I should spend more time in off-topic)



Rochester has hit the nail on the head.



I also feel that this short clip encapsulates much of the Great War; beautifully composed and arranged. 
 
Earl_of_Rochester said:
I sell poppies and anyone who doesn't want to wear one willingly is a rice throwing commie.

It's got nothing to do with politics and nothing to do with nationalistic wars, it is quite simply a symbol of rememberance for those who gave everything so that we might be at liberty today.

EoR

Right, except they did **** all for liberty today.
 
I always wear a poppy throughout November.

It's not about politics, it's just about remembering those who made the ultimate sacrifice.

It does irk me that none of the other students in my classes wear them, but it's their choice to do so.
 
Elenmmare said:
Near half a hundred million soldiers found themselves in fields around the world hunting for the lives of other men. I see no reason in supporting such an event.
We don't. The entire ****ing point of Mr Haig's organisation was summed up in their motto "Never again" :roll:

Elenmmare said:
Right, except they did **** all for liberty today.
Unless you're a woman who now has the ability to vote of course. Or a pensioner. Or disabled.
 
Unless you're a woman who now has the ability to vote of course. Or a pensioner. Or disabled.

And you believe that the social change to which you refer was found somewhere between the ruins of Passchendaele and the dunes of Arabia? Women could vote in New Zealand decades before World War One. Suffragetes were already on the rise before the war. Their movement was accelerated precisely because there were no bloody men in the homefront to man the factories. The men we commemorate for busying themselves butchering each other. I hope you don't sincerely believe that women required war for freedom.

Also interesting choice of example what with the 'disabled.'

We don't. The entire ****ing point of Mr Haig's organisation was summed up in their motto "Never again" :roll:

OK, so you don't support the generation. Instead you wear the poppies as a reminder of their folly? Seems an odd choice again, looking at the birthplace of the poppy and the poem where the tradition originates from. You can argue what you wish, and this gentleman Haig can have his opinion too, but it's a commonly accepted fact that poppy's demonstrate a support for the soldiers of the First World War. I don't support them. I pity them, certainly. But quite simply I refuse to endorse the bloodsheds of the century and their participants.

Now, if you asked me to wear a peace sign, indeed I would. A Star of David for victims of the Holocaust? Certainly. Perhaps ask me to remember the forgotten Indian disabled or the Natives who left the Second World War still with the inability to vote.
 
Elenmmare said:
And you believe that the social change to which you refer was found somewhere between the ruins of Passchendaele and the dunes of Arabia?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Representation_of_the_People_Act_1918
OK, so you don't support the generation. Instead you wear the poppies as a reminder of their folly?
Folly would imply they were being stupid, which would require they had a choice. They didn't, and for perhaps the first time in military history, they actually blamed the right people.
Now, if you asked me to wear a peace sign, indeed I would.
****ing hippy. Personally, I'd hang the lot of you soap dodging bastards.
 
Folly would imply they were being stupid, which would require they had a choice. They didn't, and for perhaps the first time in military history, they actually blamed the right people.

Who's the hippy? You're excusing an entire generation for not having the stones to say Hell No, We Won't Go. It's not like revolution or general strike was a foreign concept in Europe. It's not like you to advocate meek cowtailing. I'd prefer not to gather around and celebrate a generation coerced into a war by a 10% minority:

Or it could be, you know, that they wanted war.
Let's remember that conscription only came to Britain in 1918, years after the Somme. And yet people kept signing up. Doesn't sound like an army governed by 'join-or-die.'

Which circles back to the fact that I don't celebrate warmongers. You might, I don't. Maybe Britain is different in that way.
 
Back
Top Bottom