sturgia is considered the worst faction of the entire game they are not good at all compared to the warband nordics do you think they need a rework and make the nords strong again?
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do you think that sturgia need a rework?
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Sturgians aren't Nords.
I'm about four hours into a Sturgia playthrough and oh my ****ing god it sucks. Mostly the troop tree, but some other things too.
They're supposed to be weak. Barbarians who are good fighters, but not much else.
Lesbosisles
Knight at Arms
*Laughs in Battanian*
Battanians are more tricky/roguish and Sturgians are the more simple/straightforward faction though.
TheShermanator
Sergeant
I do agree that a 2nd look at Sturgia's troop tree would help them. No tier 2 archers definitely hurts, for example.
I also think that generally a rebalance (tuning down. e.g. tuning down AI accuracy) of all archers would help the Sturgian a lot. Don't know about you guys, but for any faction's troop true, I usually avoid the 2 handed branch because of their poor late tier survive-ability (because of random arrows vs. glorious melee deaths with 5-1 kill-death). And Sturgians ostensibly have good 2 handed infantry.
I also think that generally a rebalance (tuning down. e.g. tuning down AI accuracy) of all archers would help the Sturgian a lot. Don't know about you guys, but for any faction's troop true, I usually avoid the 2 handed branch because of their poor late tier survive-ability (because of random arrows vs. glorious melee deaths with 5-1 kill-death). And Sturgians ostensibly have good 2 handed infantry.
It's primarily an issue of geography, economy and autocalculation formula. Field battle performance is a very minor part of their underwhelming performance, because that would only be relevant when the player is present, which is a small minority of battles.
The geography issue is likely not ever going to be solved, because that would require a very big update which would take alot of time and is likely not something TW is going to bother with. Not least because they have a "vision" for each faction and rebalancing the geography of Sturgia from a balance perspective as opposed to a story one is not part of their overall vision for the game (I would guess).
Economic issues are partly due to geography, but they can also be independently altered to a certain degree, and we will likely see some changes in this area in the near future, which will help Sturgia along.
The third issue is autocalculation formula, which currently gives Cavalry a straight up 1.2x bonus (this used to be 1.3x). Sturgia borders four factions, three of which have the most cavalry in their "party templates" out of all the factions in the game; Vlandia, Khuzaits and also Battania. Sturgia itself has the least amount of cavalry in their party templates.
Add on top of that Sturgias geography and however the AI diplomacy works leading to Sturgia being at war with the most amount of factions at the same time most commonly, this leads to Sturgia being at war with multiple factions that have the most cavalry in their parties against Sturgia which has the least amount of cavalry in their parties, obviously this leads to Sturgia getting destroyed. The vast majority of games has Sturgia losing Varcheg to the Vlandians and Tyal to the Khuzaits within a few months, and from there it's just downhill.
The economy and autocalculation formulas can either be fixed by TW or by the modding community. The geography can also be fixed by the modding community when mod tools are released, but I'm not so sure TW would be willing to alter the geography enough to make a balance difference.
As for Sturgias field battle performance, honestly all tier 1 recruits (from all factions) should have a ****ty shield that can be destroyed with enough ranged fire, this will make leveling up recruits through field battles not an obnoxious endeavour (which is especially important for Sturgia given how weak they are). Giving all Sturgian infantry actually round shields (as opposed to claiming you are giving them all round shields but not actually doing so as TW did two patches ago
), will help their infantry protect themselves from archers and horse archers more efficiently in shieldwall/circle formation.
There's not much else to do with the troop tree to be honest. Maybe garantueed shoulder-armor for the veteran warrior/lords/shock troops in order to not have a variation of ~15 armor depending on if they spawn with a scarf/without anything/with shoulder armor aswell. Any other opinions I have on the matter of Sturgia are more cosmetic as opposed to balance related and I'll post them elsewhere.
The geography issue is likely not ever going to be solved, because that would require a very big update which would take alot of time and is likely not something TW is going to bother with. Not least because they have a "vision" for each faction and rebalancing the geography of Sturgia from a balance perspective as opposed to a story one is not part of their overall vision for the game (I would guess).
Economic issues are partly due to geography, but they can also be independently altered to a certain degree, and we will likely see some changes in this area in the near future, which will help Sturgia along.
The third issue is autocalculation formula, which currently gives Cavalry a straight up 1.2x bonus (this used to be 1.3x). Sturgia borders four factions, three of which have the most cavalry in their "party templates" out of all the factions in the game; Vlandia, Khuzaits and also Battania. Sturgia itself has the least amount of cavalry in their party templates.
Add on top of that Sturgias geography and however the AI diplomacy works leading to Sturgia being at war with the most amount of factions at the same time most commonly, this leads to Sturgia being at war with multiple factions that have the most cavalry in their parties against Sturgia which has the least amount of cavalry in their parties, obviously this leads to Sturgia getting destroyed. The vast majority of games has Sturgia losing Varcheg to the Vlandians and Tyal to the Khuzaits within a few months, and from there it's just downhill.
The economy and autocalculation formulas can either be fixed by TW or by the modding community. The geography can also be fixed by the modding community when mod tools are released, but I'm not so sure TW would be willing to alter the geography enough to make a balance difference.
As for Sturgias field battle performance, honestly all tier 1 recruits (from all factions) should have a ****ty shield that can be destroyed with enough ranged fire, this will make leveling up recruits through field battles not an obnoxious endeavour (which is especially important for Sturgia given how weak they are). Giving all Sturgian infantry actually round shields (as opposed to claiming you are giving them all round shields but not actually doing so as TW did two patches ago
), will help their infantry protect themselves from archers and horse archers more efficiently in shieldwall/circle formation.There's not much else to do with the troop tree to be honest. Maybe garantueed shoulder-armor for the veteran warrior/lords/shock troops in order to not have a variation of ~15 armor depending on if they spawn with a scarf/without anything/with shoulder armor aswell. Any other opinions I have on the matter of Sturgia are more cosmetic as opposed to balance related and I'll post them elsewhere.
Yea, something definitely needs to be done.
I've started a new 1.4.0 game and by day 140, they've already lost Omor, Tyal, Sibir and 6 castles to Vlandia and the Khuzait.
The Sturgia run is over before it even started.
I think a problem is the extreme aggressiveness of the AI. Holding new lands should be troublesome, but the AI just keeps taking castle after castle and town after town. Sieges should be far more costly in terms of manpower and time.
The game is designed with generations in mind (families, children, etc..), but the current breakneck speed at which war is conducted just doesn't allow it to be a meaningful mechanic.
I've started a new 1.4.0 game and by day 140, they've already lost Omor, Tyal, Sibir and 6 castles to Vlandia and the Khuzait.
The Sturgia run is over before it even started.
I think a problem is the extreme aggressiveness of the AI. Holding new lands should be troublesome, but the AI just keeps taking castle after castle and town after town. Sieges should be far more costly in terms of manpower and time.
The game is designed with generations in mind (families, children, etc..), but the current breakneck speed at which war is conducted just doesn't allow it to be a meaningful mechanic.
I am pretty deep into a Sturgia campaign and I really love playing with their armies. It's been great fun and I've been very successful.
Sturgia's though has 2 problems.
The first and biggest one, is they are neighbors to the Khuzait. After the updates that fixed AI lords having armies full of recruits the Khuzait became bull**** strong. They steamroll everyone, and Sturgia being there neighbor means they die first. Something needs to be done to slow down the Khuzait desperately.
The other problem Sturgia has is economic. Their cities cannot build prosperity. Which leaves their lords poorer than other factions and causes a cascade of issues that result in weak armies and poor performance.
The only direct buff I think Sturgia needs specifically is a T6 infantry unit. There is no T6 infantry in the game, there should be one and Sturgia should have it.
Sturgia's though has 2 problems.
The first and biggest one, is they are neighbors to the Khuzait. After the updates that fixed AI lords having armies full of recruits the Khuzait became bull**** strong. They steamroll everyone, and Sturgia being there neighbor means they die first. Something needs to be done to slow down the Khuzait desperately.
The other problem Sturgia has is economic. Their cities cannot build prosperity. Which leaves their lords poorer than other factions and causes a cascade of issues that result in weak armies and poor performance.
The only direct buff I think Sturgia needs specifically is a T6 infantry unit. There is no T6 infantry in the game, there should be one and Sturgia should have it.
Yeah they should just turn the Druzhinnik into an infantry unit. Sturgia only has skirmisher cavalry and having noble troops that are melee cavalry makes absolutely no sense. They just suicide into the enemy and die due to being lower in numbers. But having them be a very strong t6 infantry unit would make much more sense as that is the supposed strength of the faction and also where Sturgia is more numerous.
I think it's not the Sturgians need a rework, but rather concessions and tweaks need to be made to the faction trait system to strengthen the pros/cons of each factions a bit more clearly and definitely.
For example:
Sturgians
- 20% faster movement speed in snow
- 10% more XP gained for infantry in combat
- 10% slower growth rate for settlements
- 5% lesser tax revenue from settlements
Khuzaits
- 10% faster campaign map movement speed
- 10% more tariffs from from towns
- Faster army cohesion depletion
- Cannot use siege weapons (ballista, onager, trebuchet)
Sturgians be infantry-based warriors of the cold north? OK. Then have them receive higher XP for their infantry, but account for the poor economic conditions of the north. Pros and cons. For the Khuzaits, faster campaign map movement speed for armies, and very lucrative caravan trade. But at the same time, large penalty to their capacity to fight siege battles. Higher combat values for cavalry and faster movement speed will make them very strong in field battles, but every time they want to siege, their army will have to risk significant losses due to lack of proper siege equipment.
For example:
Sturgians
- 20% faster movement speed in snow
- 10% more XP gained for infantry in combat
- 10% slower growth rate for settlements
- 5% lesser tax revenue from settlements
Khuzaits
- 10% faster campaign map movement speed
- 10% more tariffs from from towns
- Faster army cohesion depletion
- Cannot use siege weapons (ballista, onager, trebuchet)
Sturgians be infantry-based warriors of the cold north? OK. Then have them receive higher XP for their infantry, but account for the poor economic conditions of the north. Pros and cons. For the Khuzaits, faster campaign map movement speed for armies, and very lucrative caravan trade. But at the same time, large penalty to their capacity to fight siege battles. Higher combat values for cavalry and faster movement speed will make them very strong in field battles, but every time they want to siege, their army will have to risk significant losses due to lack of proper siege equipment.
Sturgians are not Nords, no matter how much offended Nord fans from Warband want it to be. Druzhiniks are great heavy cavalry that are worthy predecessors of Vaegir knights. Punishing Strugia by removing it makes no sense.
Sturgia already have very strong infantry unit. Two in fact. They are called Veteran Warriors and Shock Troops. Removing cavalry from Sturgia and replacing it with more heavy infantry is absolutely ridiculous proposition. Sturgia been already heavy infantry focused enough needs it's heavy cavalry unit to support their shield wall. Sturgia definitely does not need another heavy infantry unit.
Make a mod, wait for Nordic invasion DLC or go play Asseray if you hate Sturgia so much.
I generally agree with you.
But I think having a T6 infantry unit would be great, and the Sturgians should have it.
T6 infantry would be Veteran Warrior with +40 to their 1H and throwing stats. I don't think that it would make anything but symbolic difference.
Besides with Nords possibly coming in to Calradia in one of the planed DLCs along with ship combat, what T6 unit would you give them if Sturgia had T6 infantry already?
Armor Does Something, the mod, it helps a lot but even then, you have that ****ing idiotic unit that goes straight shirtless.
AntichX
Recruit
I think the faction trait system is too simplistic also. However i also think that the 10% the khuzaits get is just a bad ideea. I would like the faction traits to be boons for when the armies are fighting into home territory and maybe a few more regions around. The Ai is way to agressive, one way of balancing that(and the whole anti snowball system that is a joke right now) would be having them be stronger in their home land. Make the khurz faster in the sand, make the sturgians faster in snow, the battanians in forests, don't make them faster across the entire map. Why wouldn't infantry be faster in a mountain forest than desert horses that never seen snow in their life?
No good archer from troop tree is ok to me, it's good to let the kingdoms have their own specialties. In this aspect, I would rather have their javelin and throwing axes boosted.
Top priority, add villages and boost towns, adjust their geography. Secondly, implement their special traits and make their terrain useful. Thirdly, if TW want them to be infantry based faction, then make them the best. Last but not least, get that AC Valhalla guy to be their king.
Top priority, add villages and boost towns, adjust their geography. Secondly, implement their special traits and make their terrain useful. Thirdly, if TW want them to be infantry based faction, then make them the best. Last but not least, get that AC Valhalla guy to be their king.
This. Although it seemed to happen even in previous patch.
To be honest I've never seen Sturgia performing well. They are overperforming when they manage to keep what they have, but 4 games out of 5 I've played, they are the first faction to be wiped out from the map, and quickly.
And in my last game, when I wanted to actually become a lord for them, to check the situation from within so to speak, I've noticed that they are just crazy. They declare war on every faction at the same time. This makes no sense and will be fixed asap hopefully.
