Disguising In A Town and Fighting When Noticed - NEEDS ATTENTION!

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tdriftx

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When you disguise yourself to get into a town you are at war with, whether it be to sell items to the market, sell off some prisoners or check the tavern for a companion you are looking for, you will usually be noticed and either have to surrender or fight your way out.

Now I actually don't mind the challenge of fighting your way out, but most of the time it's ridiculous.  The opponents usually move faster than you, even if you have high atheletics, and their weapons completely dominate you.  Unless you manage to stop them from grouping you by being in a single line, one behind the other, and get in those lucky hits that they don't block before they hit you, you pretty much have no hope unless you can get out of the town and avoid them (and I'm usually very good at fighting, in my opinion, and manage to cope with fighting many towns, but it is frustrating and some are almost impossible).

The weapons given to you are a joke, the ability to setup a disguised outfit for yourself so you can have better versions of a pole or throwing knives with the more money and skill you gain over time.  I could easily fit a shield on my back (obviously a small kite shield that wouldn't be noticeable) under my cloak as well, incase I do get noticed, not to mention a sword would be hidden while holstered beside my leg under my cloak too.
The fact you get a quarterstaff and the worst throwing knives to fend against a group would have to make you the biggest idiot in those times to even attempt to go into an enemies town, if it were necessary.


Having the option to setup what you take as a disguise, for when it is required, would be a feature that would give a much more realistic and user-chosen feeling to the game when disguising and would make not only disguising, but also fighting with what you chose to go under your disguise, a very enjoyable feature to the game rather than a feeling of disappointment when you actually have to fight.

My suggestions to the way it could be done are:
- A tab in the inventory, that allows switching from 'Battle' gear to 'Disguise' gear, which would change the standard item slots between each setup.  This way, people could simply click between the tabs in their inventory with ease for setting up both sets of gear.  A mandatory cloak would have to be worn to cover up any gear taken in.
- Possibly a size limit to shields, as round shields and big shields would be noticeable under a cloak.  Also, an axe would probably bump around under the cloak to a point of obviousness too so possibly only swords and small weapons can be taken in (or a polearm carried).  Otherwise anything could be taken in but the more/bigger items - the more of a chance to be noticed.
- Adding a new stat to items that have a 'Disguise' stat to display their obviousness rating so it is easy to understand how likely you will be spotted, where weapons, shields and armour add to it, and wearing a cloak and hood over would reduce it.  This would also have a total display like encumberance is shown from total weight of items.
- The ability to wear clothing over armour, like cloaks and hoods, would be a needed benefit to pulling this off.
- The ability to choose whether you go into towns in 'Battle' gear or 'Disguise' gear would also be an option that would be fun to have.  I doubt well-known people in those times would walk around town in their Battle gear all the time, especially those who have a bad reputation, no matter how friendly the town is - there would be cases where people would not want to be noticed by anyone, wherever they are.

There is much more that can be done, but at this stage I will leave it at that, and possibly come back to edit with more to add to this much-needed feature.
 
I agree, the giant size of that cloak should be able to hide at least a sword.
 
I don't see what's wrong with the quarterstaff myself. Nice range, blunt damage so it blows through armour. Why the hell would I want to swap it for something which is shorter and lacks damage?
 
It would be nice to have a choice, though.  Perhaps a character isn't skilled in pole arms?
 
You're fighting mid-tier troops. You shouldn't need that much polearm skill :razz:

I don't think the equipment is the issue so much as the scenario. It would possibly be better rather than have you fight the battle to simply have you wandering the streets, with a chance any guard you pass may recognise you and raise the alarm. You have more options then in how to approach the situation - try to sneak past and hope they don't recognise you; try taking them out quietly so they're no longer a problem, or plain old running away ...
 
Archonsod 说:
You're fighting mid-tier troops. You shouldn't need that much polearm skill :razz:

I don't think the equipment is the issue so much as the scenario. It would possibly be better rather than have you fight the battle to simply have you wandering the streets, with a chance any guard you pass may recognise you and raise the alarm. You have more options then in how to approach the situation - try to sneak past and hope they don't recognise you; try taking them out quietly so they're no longer a problem, or plain old running away ...

I like the scenario idea, think that should definitely be how it is done, too.  But definitely want a 'Disguise' gear option for extra enjoyment.

The polearm is basic and I don't like using polearms, it's more preference rather than what is wrong with it, even though it is weak and their swords almost have the same reach.  People that aren't good get completely frustrated with it too and find it impossible, and it is not about making it only possible for the fanatics, but for all audiences.

Edit:
markik 说:
Well, I like it, but I also think it would be rather difficult to implement.

Actually, I personally think I could write the code and implement it in a day quite easily.  The scenario idea would be a bit more effort than the simple code for an extra 'Disguise' gear feature and a simple skill with a percentage modifier for the chance of being noticed.
Adding the 'Disguise' stat to items may be time consuming, but extremely basic as well.
 
This idea really sounds like you're making mountain out of a mole-hill.
 
PrinceGhaldir 说:
This idea really sounds like you're making mountain out of a mole-hill.

yes, I agree. Improving the game is a bad idea.
 
I'm down for options. I'm with ya.

But do you really have difficulty with fighting these little scuffles? :lol:
 
For all people saying it's a piece of cake,sneaking in town:

1. You've been spotted and you have to fight.
2. You spawn on the streets with 1 Nord Footmen in front of you,2 right behind you and a couple more god knows where...
3. You get an axe in your head whatever you do.

 
Taien 说:
For all people saying it's a piece of cake,sneaking in town:

1. You've been spotted and you have to fight.
2. You spawn on the streets with 1 Nord Footmen in front of you,2 right behind you and a couple more god knows where...
3. You get an axe in your head whatever you do.

Not if you know what you're doing.

You made me chuckle on a bad morning. I like you.
 
I'm fine with the disguise thingy.
What I would like to see implemented however is the actual fighting/chasing scene: the whole town becomes empty and the guards simply spawn next to you and you got no other options but to fight them to death.
I would like to see a more realistic situation, like this:
You are noticed, the scene starts with you inside the city with a guard or two next to you (the one that noticed you), meanwhile the simple town's folks start running away in panic from the scene and other guards spawn in different parts of the city and try to reach you, also, the town gate start closing, let's say in a minute or two for dramatic effect.
To escape you either have to fight them all, thus resulting in the chance of visiting the tavern, shops and the like, or you reach the town gate in time to escape from the city and rejoin your army on the world map.
What do you think?
 
To those saying it is easy to do the fights, that can really get some peoples nerve for the mocking about how you find it easy just because some people just aren't naturals/fanatics at the game.

My girlfriend can't do any of them at all so simply avoids this feature and hates it.  I consider myself at least good (if not more than good) in combat in this game, however you have to basically do each town at least once to do it perfectly seen as you only have a few seconds to move in the right direction and block/hit the guy infront of you, otherwise you get hit at least once.  When they run faster than you, multiple guys are blocking and hitting at the same time, and they hit with different swings, you can't block nor stand a chance of escaping/not dying.
I have found some towns easy enough to do after knowing where they are positioned and the best tactics, but some towns are almost impossible to do.  Unless you edit your stats, attempt it on the easiest settings or have never done this at a low level, I can't understand how the majority wouldn't have trouble or get frustrated and sick of it as the majority of gamers aren't natural-pro gamers.
It isn't a major requirement for the game but the feature sucks, in my opinion, until it is touched up.  I'd personally love to see this added and would be something I'd thoroughly enjoy each time I play.  Having the disguise means you could go into any town disguised, whether it is a friendly or hostile town, just adding that extra feel of difference rather than walking everywhere in the same thing.

The_Freeman 说:
I'm fine with the disguise thingy.
What I would like to see implemented however is the actual fighting/chasing scene: the whole town becomes empty and the guards simply spawn next to you and you got no other options but to fight them to death.
I would like to see a more realistic situation, like this:
You are noticed, the scene starts with you inside the city with a guard or two next to you (the one that noticed you), meanwhile the simple town's folks start running away in panic from the scene and other guards spawn in different parts of the city and try to reach you, also, the town gate start closing, let's say in a minute or two for dramatic effect.
To escape you either have to fight them all, thus resulting in the chance of visiting the tavern, shops and the like, or you reach the town gate in time to escape from the city and rejoin your army on the world map.
What do you think?

Basically this is what I definitely want to see as well.  The 'Disguise' feature would be more for enjoyment and that tip of realism added, however the whole way you get attacked now just really sucks.  The way you have explained is pretty much how I imagine it should be :grin: I'd definitely want to see something along the lines of your idea, I especially like the added suspense of only having 1 - 2 minutes to escape until you are locked in and forced to either fight or be put in prison.

Edit:
Ronan 说:
PrinceGhaldir 说:
This idea really sounds like you're making mountain out of a mole-hill.

yes, I agree. Improving the game is a bad idea.

I'm not saying it is major and ruins the game, it's a suggestion to a feature which would make it much more enjoyable and would be possible for all audiences.  I'd just like to see this turned into a full feature rather than something that is so basic and lacks what it should be, in my opinion.

How is improving a game ever bad?  You're under the 'Suggestions' area, which is for features/additions to be suggested, therefore suggestions for 'improving' the game.
 
tdriftx 说:
How is improving a game ever bad?  You're under the 'Suggestions' area, which is for features/additions to be suggested, therefore suggestions for 'improving' the game.

It was probably sarcasm.

My guess why there are such poor equipment when disguised is that the goal is to avoid being noticed. A staff is not out of place on a pilgrim or traveler, and throwing knives are not the best choice but a concealable alternative. A sword or axe would leave a bulge in your robes, the placement of which may make the guards curious.

Personally I would like the option of adding a small byrnie under the pilgrim disguise.
 
Great! Disguise gears are definitely a must. I can already see my Disguise set....A nice big axe and a plate mail. Nobody gets suspicious at a plated hobo with a giant axe.

Support. +13
 
it should be possible to try it yourself, not let the pc calculate whatever it calculates to determine wether you get spotted or not...
 
manekemaan 说:
it should be possible to try it yourself, not let the pc calculate whatever it calculates to determine wether you get spotted or not...

I don't think the design and the engine support stealth...
 
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